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Author Topic: Woman's Love Defined By Obedience To Man  (Read 5040 times)

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Offline Cantarella

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Re: Woman's Love Defined By Obedience To Man
« Reply #30 on: June 30, 2018, 10:40:06 AM »
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    Women by nature WANT TO AND ARE INCLINED TO FOLLOW THE LEAD OF THEIR HUSBANDS.  And they WILL follow their husbands unless the husband fails in leadership.  You see, the husband is the head and the leader in a marriage, and therefore the buck stops with him, and he's ultimately responsible for the breakdown of the marriage.  That kind of authority cuts both ways.  True leaders take responsibility for the failures of their organization (in this case family) and don't blame their underlings.  If you were working as a business leader in a company, and your group fails, your boss isn't going to listen to you whining about how your subordinates failed.  It is YOU who failed and it is YOU who will be held accountable.  Your boss won't fire your subordinates.  He'll fire you.  Similarly, if a man's marriage breaks down, HE is the one accountable for it before God.  If you don't accept this, then it is you who are unmanly and a feminist.  You will be mocked and scorned by your superiors if you effeminately point the finger at your subordinates.  Man up and assume the responsibility (and consequences) for YOUR FAILED LEADERSHIP.

    I love it how you insist on the benefits of leadership, i.e. being able to boss people around and subject them to your will, but refuse to accept the responsibilities and accountability that come with it.  YOU as the husband are accountable for the success or failure of your family, and a true man will take ownership of this.  If anyone needs to man up, it's you.  If a woman leaves you, then it is YOUR failure, whether in having chosen poorly or having failed to lead and to love as you needed to in order to keep your family intact.  That is the attitude of a true leader and a true man, little boy.


    ^^^^ This.
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    Offline Cantarella

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    Re: Woman's Love Defined By Obedience To Man
    « Reply #31 on: June 30, 2018, 10:47:23 AM »
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    • Quote from: TKGS on June 30, 2018, 07:20:18 AM
    With all of the great traditional Catholic sermons concerning marriage one can easily find on the internet, I find it disturbing that a Catholic would seek religious counsel from "Pastor Dowell" of Youtube.

    By the way, there are great Catholic resources on this website about Marriage and particularly, about womanhood, for the few ladies out there who strive to be more like Mary and less like Eve.
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    If anyone says that true and natural water is not necessary for baptism and thus twists into some metaphor the words of our Lord Jesus Christ" Unless a man be born again of water and the Holy Spirit" (Jn 3:5) let him be anathema.

    Offline JezusDeKoning

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    Re: Woman's Love Defined By Obedience To Man
    « Reply #32 on: June 30, 2018, 10:50:23 AM »
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    • Quote from: Cantarella on June 30, 2018, 10:40:06 AM

    ^^^^ This.
    1000%. Köszönöm, Ladislaus. There's actually Catholic advice on this thread.
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    Remember O most gracious Virgin Mary...

    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Woman's Love Defined By Obedience To Man
    « Reply #33 on: June 30, 2018, 11:18:25 AM »
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    • Quote from: JezusDeKoning on June 30, 2018, 10:50:23 AM
    1000%. Köszönöm, Ladislaus. There's actually Catholic advice on this thread.

    Szivesen.

    But don't thank me.  Any Catholic thought I have ever had comes from God, to Him Alone is the thanks.  And that's the thing about authority in general, since that is under discussion here.  Authority is not given for the authority-holders to exult in and lord it over others with.  God gives authority as something with which to serve others.  That is the entire meaning of Our Lord's discourse at The Last Supper.  We are to serve and not to be served.  Priests are not ordained priests for their own glory, since no man deserves such glory; they are ordained priests so they can serve the flock, feed the sheep, and bring them grace ... and especially the Sacraments.  Wives serve their husbands through their obedience, their submission, and their love.  Husbands serve their wives through their authority and their love.  Both husband and wife in turn serve their children with their authority.  When we bid our children do something, we are serving them by making them do what's not only good in general but good for them as well.  At least that's what I've tried to tell the children; they don't always buy it as this age, but they'll understand this either later in life or in the next life.  When I command my 5-year-old not to run out into the street, it's not because I am trying to deprive her of fun and happiness, but because I want her to stay alive.   So I am thereby serving her.  Right now she doesn't get that.  But she will.
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    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Woman's Love Defined By Obedience To Man
    « Reply #34 on: June 30, 2018, 11:28:46 AM »
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    • In all my years of marriage (going on 18 now), I have given my wife only one single command where I explicitly invoked my authority.  I commanded that she say the Rosary every day.  I did it obviously because I love her and for her own good.  In all other things, I've never had to explicitly ask her to do anything; she just knows what I want and prefer, and she does it.  And the Rosary she just fell away from for a little while being busy with 6 children and getting next-to-no sleep.  And then I told her that if she needs me to watch the kids while she says the Rosary, then she should just ask.
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    Offline 2Vermont

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    Re: Woman's Love Defined By Obedience To Man
    « Reply #35 on: June 30, 2018, 11:34:42 AM »
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    • What woman wouldn't want to submit to a husband who loves her as Christ loves the Church?
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    Offline Jaynek

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    Re: Woman's Love Defined By Obedience To Man
    « Reply #36 on: June 30, 2018, 11:59:30 AM »
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    • Quote from: 2Vermont on June 30, 2018, 11:34:42 AM
    What woman wouldn't want to submit to a husband who loves her as Christ loves the Church?
    I discovered traditional Catholicism quite late in my life, so I did not know anything about Catholic teaching on the wife's obedience in the early years of my marriage.  I just knew about Novus Ordo teaching on "mutual submission of husband and wife". I also had a childhood non-Catholic formation involving feminism.

    Even in my situation of complete ignorance of traditional teaching and a personal tendency toward rebellion, I was able to figure out that I ought to obey my husband.  It just became more and more clear that he deserved to be obeyed. I could see that things went better when I followed his lead and that he was simply wiser than me.

    That is how powerful it is when a man loves his wife as Christ loved the Church.
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    Offline Croix de Fer

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    Re: Woman's Love Defined By Obedience To Man
    « Reply #37 on: June 30, 2018, 12:34:17 PM »
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    • Quote from: TKGS on June 30, 2018, 07:20:18 AM
    With all of the great traditional Catholic sermons concerning marriage one can easily find on the internet, I find it disturbing that a Catholic would seek religious counsel from "Pastor Dowell" of Youtube.

    Strawman. The impetus of posting Dowell's videos on this forum isn't for religious council. It's for practical advise to men on getting prenups and avoiding state marriage licenses as a means to protect their life's work from predatory women who "divorce" them.

    None of you have a true argument against this fact, so you use the strawman (seeking religious guidance from a heretic) to divert attention away from the real issue at hand.

    You've all been dishonest and/or lack critical thinking.
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    Offline Jaynek

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    Re: Woman's Love Defined By Obedience To Man
    « Reply #38 on: June 30, 2018, 12:53:28 PM »
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    • Quote from: Croix de Fer on June 30, 2018, 12:34:17 PM
    Strawman. The impetus of posting Dowell's videos on this forum isn't for religious council. It's for practical advise to men on getting prenups and avoiding state marriage licenses as a means to protect their life's work from predatory women who "divorce" them.
    His practical advice is based on religious assumptions that are contrary to Catholic teaching.  For example, he is teaching men to divorce a wife who is disobedient and then the man is free to marry again.

    Of course, a man who advises divorce and remarriage also advises a prenup about what to do in the event of a divorce.  This is no indication that it is a good idea for Catholics since we do not accept divorce and remarriage.  

    It is not possible to treat religious and practical issues as completely separate from each other.
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    Offline Croix de Fer

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    Re: Woman's Love Defined By Obedience To Man
    « Reply #39 on: June 30, 2018, 01:06:45 PM »
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    • Quote from: Jaynek on June 30, 2018, 12:53:28 PM
    His practical advice is based on religious assumptions that are contrary to Catholic teaching.  For example, he is teaching men to divorce a wife who is disobedient and then the man is free to marry again.

    Of course, a man who advises divorce and remarriage also advises a prenup about what to do in the event of a divorce.  This is no indication that it is a good idea for Catholics since we do not accept divorce and remarriage.  

    It is not possible to treat religious and practical issues as completely separate from each other.

    Dishonest argument. I've clarified exponential times that the point of the posted videos is for men to get the practical advice on prenups and avoiding state marriage licenses, and the reasons - predatory & flaky disposition of most women in these latter days - for such legal action & inaction, respectively. Ignore the other stuff. He only touches on those heresies briefly. It's a given that Catholic men should avoid his comments about "divorcing" his wife and "marrying other women".
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    Offline Jaynek

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    Re: Woman's Love Defined By Obedience To Man
    « Reply #40 on: June 30, 2018, 01:33:35 PM »
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    • Quote from: Croix de Fer on June 30, 2018, 01:06:45 PM
    I've clarified exponential times that the point of the posted videos is for men to get the practical advice on prenups and avoiding state marriage licenses, and the reasons - predatory & flaky disposition of most women in these latter days - for such legal action & inaction, respectively. Ignore the other stuff. He only touches on those heresies briefly. It's a given that Catholic men should avoid his comments about "divorcing" his wife and "marrying other women".
    From what I can tell, few, if any, of those videos were practical advice about to formulate a prenup.  Some (most?) of the videos do not even mention prenups or avoiding licences.  Rather they are rants about how untrustworthy and predatory women are that you use to justify prenups, etc. 

    Telling his audience about how horrible women are is not practical at all.  The videos are emotional and heretical and virtually useless for Catholics.
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    Offline Croix de Fer

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    Re: Woman's Love Defined By Obedience To Man
    « Reply #41 on: June 30, 2018, 02:12:16 PM »
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    • Quote from: Jaynek on June 30, 2018, 01:33:35 PM
    From what I can tell, few, if any, of those videos were practical advice about to formulate a prenup.
    That's because of your bias as a woman.


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    Some (most?) of the videos do not even mention prenups or avoiding licences.
    As I told the female moderator, those particular vids are to fortify his argument in favor of getting prenups and avoiding state marriage licenses. Predation comes in various forms. You better have various means of protection against it.


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    Rather they are rants about how untrustworthy and predatory women are that you use to justify prenups, etc.
    Not rants but wisdom. Let men be prudent in their dealings with women.


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    Telling his audience about how horrible women are is not practical at all.
    Please point out were he says "women are horrible" in any of the posted videos.


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    The videos are emotional and heretical and virtually useless for Catholics.
    Says the biased, emotional woman who injects the barely touched upon heresies in some of the vids, as if that discredits his advice for men to protect themselves and their life work from thieving women and the courts. That's an ad hominem fallacy.

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    Offline Pax Vobis

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    Re: Woman's Love Defined By Obedience To Man
    « Reply #42 on: June 30, 2018, 02:14:25 PM »
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    The SSPX Priests obey the civil laws that ask couples apply for a marriage license. 

    A marriage license is NOT required by any law - local, state or federal.  So, your statement about "obeying a law" shows you don't know your rights as a US citizen.
     

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    I know a resistance Priest that married some friends of mine and they did not want a marriage license. The Priest was fine with it. However, now that they have children, taxes have been a challenge for them because she is a stay at home mom with no income. Plus medical insurance has also been a problem for them. 
    I can’t say they regret their decision because I haven’t asked, but they have expressed to me many difficulties with not having one.
    The govt wants you in the system, so they do make things easier on you and give you "benefits", however you can get the same benefits (which are actually rights) if you jump through a few hoops.  If one opts out of the system without a plan, yes, there will be many difficulties.  But they can be overcome.
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    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Woman's Love Defined By Obedience To Man
    « Reply #43 on: June 30, 2018, 06:09:41 PM »
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    • Quote from: Croix de Fer on June 30, 2018, 02:12:16 PM
    Let men be prudent in their dealings with women.

    You would do well to avoid any dealings with them whatsoever.
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    Offline TxTrad

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    Re: Woman's Love Defined By Obedience To Man
    « Reply #44 on: June 30, 2018, 06:13:28 PM »
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    • Quote from: Croix de Fer on June 30, 2018, 02:12:16 PM
    That's because of your bias as a woman.
    .
    Then take it to the men's forum.
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