Author Topic: Wishing people go to Hell  (Read 2542 times)

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Offline Disputaciones

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Wishing people go to Hell
« on: October 09, 2015, 01:48:03 AM »
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  • I wonder if it is ever allowed to wish for certain people to go to Hell to pay for the evil they have done, if they have escaped justice on this earth and "gotten away with it".

    In the revelations of St. Catherine of Sienna, it is said that the blessed will rejoice even if their very mother, father, husband, daughter etc. are sent to Hell, because it is God's will they were sentenced there and their will will be perfectly united to His, perfectly willing all that He wills.

    The revelations say the blessed will not be sad about this.

    So if in Heaven you won't be sad your very loved ones went to Hell, isn't it allowable to wish for despicable, evil, degenerate evil doers to go to Hell since you have moral certainty they will never convert and die in their evil ways, and that they won't pay for their crimes here?

    I thought about this today because today 2 armed men broke into the house of someone very dear to me and they stole everything from her and her mom, but thank God they didn't rape her or the maid or hurt them, who were the only ones in the house at the time. I couldn't help it and I told her "The good thing is that these damned people will pay for it all in Hell".

    Offline clare

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    Wishing people go to Hell
    « Reply #1 on: October 09, 2015, 02:16:10 AM »
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  • I think it's one thing for the saints in Heaven to be pleased with God's justice being done. I suppose we should also be pleased with it being done. But it's something else to hope that someone doesn't repent and gets eternally punished for it. We'll receive the mercy we show others. Best be on the safe side therefore, and pray for people's repentance.


    Offline Stubborn

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    Wishing people go to Hell
    « Reply #2 on: October 09, 2015, 05:45:35 AM »
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  • We cannot wish hell on anyone no matter what their crime. We are supposed to pray for them, for their conversion, not curse them to hell or hope they suffer in hell for their eternity.

    We can say they will suffer in hell for their eternity if they don't change, but because the torments are so terrible and are never ending, we say it always with the hope that they will convert before they die.

    We can not comprehend the value of one soul nor the severity of the pains of hell, but we know the value of one soul is infinitely greater than the value of the whole world with all it's glory, magnificence and riches, we know this because this was the price the devil would have happily paid when he tempted Our Lord. But without God, people are inclined to evil, some more than others as in your case, but even the Good Thief, St. Dismas repented and won forgiveness from Our Lord.


    From the book, "So High The Price":
    Quote
    The optimists object: “Can it be possible that God punishes a momentary sinful pleasure with an eternity of pain?”

    It is not only possible, but it is right and just. The offense given by the sinner to God when he transgresses His holy laws involves infinite malice, since it is an offense to infinite Majesty. Therefore, it deserves an infinite punishment. But since man, being finite, is incapable of undergoing punishment that is infinite in intensity, God punishes him with a chastisement infinite in duration. In acting thus, God acts justly.

    Consider my son, that if you go to hell, you will never leave it. There, every pain is suffered and suffered forever.

    Even when a hundred years have gone by since you went to hell, or a thousand, hell will be just beginning. After a hundred thousand, a hundred million years, after millions of centuries, hell will still be just beginning.
    If an angel were to bring news to the damned that God had decided to free them from hell when as many million centuries had passed as there are drops of water in the ocean, leaves on the trees and grains of sand on the earth - if the damned were to hear that, they would be immensely consoled. "True", they would say, "many centuries must yet pass, but some day the time of our freedom will come." In reality, however, such vast stretches of time and more than we can possibly imagine, shall pass and find hell still only beginning.
    Every soul damned in hell would be willing to make this agreement with God: "Lord, increase my suffering as much as You will; make me stay here in this place of torment as long as You will, but give me hope that someday You will free me."

    But no, this hope, this end to suffering, shall never be. At least if the poor soul of the damned could deceive himself and cheer himself up by thinking, "Who knows? Perhaps some day God will have pity on me and lift me out of this burning inferno."

    No, not even that way is open to him, for he will forever see written before him the sentence of his wretched eternity.

    "So", he will say, "all this terrible pain, this fire, will never end for me?"
    "No," will come the answer. "No, never."
    "Will they last forever?"
    "Forever - for all eternity."
    Oh, eternity! O bottomless pit! O sea without a shore! O endless tunnel! Who does not tremble at the thought of you!
    Accursed sin! What tremendous agony you prepare for those who commit you!
     
    For a small gain they travel far; for eternal life many will scarcely lift a foot from the ground. - Thomas A Kempis

    Offline LaramieHirsch

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    Wishing people go to Hell
    « Reply #3 on: October 09, 2015, 05:59:10 AM »
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  • On Facebook, Fr. Paul Nicholson rejoices that Archbishop Lefebvre "died excommunicated."
    .........................

    Before some audiences not even the possession of the exactest knowledge will make it easy for what we say to produce conviction. For argument based on knowledge implies instruction, and there are people whom one cannot instruct.  - Aristotle

    Offline Matthew

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    Wishing people go to Hell
    « Reply #4 on: October 09, 2015, 10:11:07 AM »
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  • If they are so "morally certain" to die unrepentant, then you should find plenty of consolation saying,

    "May God's will be done unto them."

    That isn't wishing evil, that's wishing God's will. If God plans (or knows) that they will convert at some point, you're not pitting your anger against God's designs.

    This isn't my own idea, it comes from a Traditional priest who gave me this advice years ago.
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    Offline JPM

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    Wishing people go to Hell
    « Reply #5 on: October 09, 2015, 12:37:06 PM »
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  • In all things our desires should mirror the desires of God.  His perfect will is that all are saved.  His permissive will allows stubborn souls to detach themselves from Him. We should, likewise, desire all are saved.

    Offline Ladislaus

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    Wishing people go to Hell
    « Reply #6 on: October 09, 2015, 02:32:10 PM »
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  • Quote from: Matthew
    If they are so "morally certain" to die unrepentant, then you should find plenty of consolation saying,

    "May God's will be done unto them."

    That isn't wishing evil, that's wishing God's will. If God plans (or knows) that they will convert at some point, you're not pitting your anger against God's designs.

    This isn't my own idea, it comes from a Traditional priest who gave me this advice years ago.


    To me that's a bit of a slippery slope and can have an implicit desire that they be lost in it.

    God wills that all men be saved, and so should we.  Period.  Once they have been damned of course, then it's God's will that they be there.

    Offline klasG4e

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    Wishing people go to Hell
    « Reply #7 on: October 09, 2015, 03:50:06 PM »
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  • Should we let Dante off the hook for placing people in hell or do we just chock that up to poetic license or some such thing?

    It is said that in a "Last Judgment" by Blessed Fray Angelico that the ministers of justice seem to have a special joy in hurrying off to the pit popes, cardinals, and other ecclesiastics.

    I do not mean to imply that either Dante or Angelico were not in accord with Catholic doctrine concerning the topic of this thread.





    Offline Ursus

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    Wishing people go to Hell
    « Reply #8 on: October 09, 2015, 08:15:07 PM »
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  • Quote from: Stubborn
    We cannot wish hell on anyone no matter what their crime. We are supposed to pray for them, for their conversion, not curse them to hell or hope they suffer in hell for their eternity.

    Co, will never end for me?"
    "No," will come the answer. "No, never."
    "Will they last forever?"
    "Forever - for all eternity."
    Oh, eternity! O bottomless pit! O sea without a shore! O endless tunnel! Who does not tremble at the thought of you!
    Accursed sin! What tremendous agony you prepare for those who commit you!
     


    People are even reminded of hell in NO churches anymore. Conversion of even "good" people isn't ever mentioned. Jew, Hindu atheists... Pure silence. Even the heretic prots.


    A big confusing mess

    Offline poche

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    Wishing people go to Hell
    « Reply #9 on: October 09, 2015, 11:57:36 PM »
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  • I wonder if it is ever allowed to wish for certain people to go to Hell to pay for the evil they have done, if they have escaped justice on this earth and "gotten away with it".

    to wish som would go to Hell is the worst thing you can wish on someone. It is a mortal sin. You should go to confession if you do this.

    Offline poche

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    Wishing people go to Hell
    « Reply #10 on: October 10, 2015, 12:05:19 AM »
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  • I thought about this today because today 2 armed men broke into the house of someone very dear to me and they stole everything from her and her mom, but thank God they didn't rape her or the maid or hurt them, who were the only ones in the house at the time. I couldn't help it and I told her "The good thing is that these damned people will pay for it all in Hell".

    My mother was murdered by a lunatic. shen he was caught he said that her sast words to him in this life were, "Jesus loves you." I know it is hard to love those who do wrong to us but it is something that pleases God and it cancels out a multitude of sins.  


    Offline poche

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    Wishing people go to Hell
    « Reply #11 on: October 10, 2015, 12:06:50 AM »
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  • Quote from: LaramieHirsch
    On Facebook, Fr. Paul Nicholson rejoices that Archbishop Lefebvre "died excommunicated."


    I am deeply saddened that Archbishop Lefebvre died excommunicated.

    Offline poche

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    Wishing people go to Hell
    « Reply #12 on: October 10, 2015, 12:09:21 AM »
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  • Quote from: Matthew
    If they are so "morally certain" to die unrepentant, then you should find plenty of consolation saying,

    "May God's will be done unto them."

    That isn't wishing evil, that's wishing God's will. If God plans (or knows) that they will convert at some point, you're not pitting your anger against God's designs.

    This isn't my own idea, it comes from a Traditional priest who gave me this advice years ago.


    The thing is that we normal people do not know who died unrepentant and who died in the state of grace. Therefore I ask god to be merciful because when I die I would like tfat others would pray for the repose of my soul.

    Offline Thomas777

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    Wishing people go to Hell
    « Reply #13 on: October 16, 2015, 03:48:19 AM »
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  • Wishing somehow that a specific person goes to hell is like wishing some guilty person goes to jail.  It is not sinful at all, as long as you believe God is just. You are not doing anything wrong with that. You are just making a lawsuit in front of God against them. It is never a fault to make a lawsuit against someone, as long as the judge is just, even you could be bound to loose that lawsuit.
    I am sorry to say that some answers like that of poche above is sick. Mathew's answer would be more balanced to me.

    Offline clare

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    Wishing people go to Hell
    « Reply #14 on: October 16, 2015, 05:24:20 AM »
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  • Quote from: Thomas777
    Wishing somehow that a specific person goes to hell is like wishing some guilty person goes to jail.... You are just making a lawsuit in front of God against them....

    Oh yes, it's exactly like that!  :scratchchin:

    Except:
    "For with what judgment you judge, you shall be judged: and with what measure you mete, it shall be measured to you again." - Matthew 7:2

    Maybe earthly judges ought also to take into account the record of the man bringing charges against someone before sentencing both of them!

     

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