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Author Topic: Why do Protestants Assume We do Not Accept Jesus?  (Read 4111 times)

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Offline Truth is Eternal

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Why do Protestants Assume We do Not Accept Jesus?
« on: February 25, 2012, 02:52:06 PM »
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  • The whole sacrifice of the Mass is Christ centered.  :incense:

    Sorry. I as just venting. It is so difficult to reason with Protestants.
    "I Think it is Time Cathinfo Has a Public Profession of Belief." "Thank you for publicly affirming the necessity of believing, without innovations, all Infallibly Defined Dogmas of the One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church."


    Offline Capt McQuigg

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    Why do Protestants Assume We do Not Accept Jesus?
    « Reply #1 on: February 25, 2012, 03:04:31 PM »
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  • If they think we don't accept Jesus, albeit that is a protestant twist, they do have some very unusual interpretations.

    No kidding, I once had a conversation about 13 or so years ago where the young man earnestly and with no malice or even bad thoughts intended, he said that Catholics have crucifixes because they don't believe Jesus rose from the dead.

    I knew he just completely lacked knowledge so I never rolled my eyes or resorted to sarcasm at any time - never do this because it ruins any chance of a legitimate conversation - and I said to him that the crucifix means that we Catholics believe that Jesus rose body and soul into Heaven.  

    Since I was explaining it in a plain straightforward way, he was receptive to the idea and understood it.  You could see it in his eyes that he realized how wrong he was.  

    We talked for about another half hour about priests and other Catholic items.  

    This conversation was possible because he was active in his Bible study group and was truly interested in learning.



    Offline ServusSpiritusSancti

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    Why do Protestants Assume We do Not Accept Jesus?
    « Reply #2 on: February 25, 2012, 03:39:08 PM »
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  • Simple: because they're confused.

    They think the Catholic Church is nothing more than a Mary-worshipping cult. One Protestant who owns some anti-Catholic website went as far as to say that Catholics "are just pagans who hide behind complex and confusing doctrines".

    In reality, it is the Protestants who are in error. It's funny how they say we are cultists for following the Pope, when the Protestant Reformation was a cult.
    Please ignore ALL of my posts. I was naive during my time posting on this forum and didn’t know any better. I retract and deeply regret any and all uncharitable or erroneous statements I ever made here.

    Offline Maizar

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    Why do Protestants Assume We do Not Accept Jesus?
    « Reply #3 on: February 25, 2012, 08:07:23 PM »
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  • Protestant might believe all kinds of things. They frequently believe that the Latin Vulgate is heretical, accusing it of being deliberately changed to satisfy a more pagan interpretation of Christianity. They believe that Catholics deify Mary, considering her to be somehow made to be part of the Trinity, and so warping Christianity to be in line with some pagan (including ancient Egyptian) cults who have a deistic trinity consisting of a Father/Mother/Son. They also believe that graven images of God amount to idolatry, so crucifixes with a corpus are no-go. Some see that praying at statues is akin to idolatry also. The above does not really include Lutherans or Anglicans, who generally have a better understanding of basic theology and so are less easily deluded. Some Protestants are offended by Easter eggs, because they have pagan origins, and others argue against various aspects of how Catholics celebrate Christmas, and more creative people come up with arguments against pretty much everything else, because it is against their business model to lose their flock to Catholicism.

    Now most of these accusations are Masonic and Jєωιѕн in origin, because in their cult a lot of emphasis is given to study of ancient religions (including тαℓмυdic Judaism) and this knowledge is used to discredit Catholicism.

    Traditional Catholics can usually give good refutations to all of the above, as most if not all are based on a misunderstanding of what is fundamental to the religion and what is cultural adaptation. Cultural adaptation is not necessarily wrongful. To give a fictitious example, If everybody in a given city or region had the habit of eating cashews at lunchtime on First Tuesdays to pay homage to some kind of "nut deity", there is nothing stopping people from turning Cashews Tuesday into, say, a devotion to St. Bob, bishop and martyr, who dedicated his life to helping nuts and the poor but was slain by a marauding crowd of masonic zealots. Of course masons will chip away (so to speak) trying to spread fear uncertainty and doubt, saying that cashews have some kind of geometric shape that means the whole thing is a masonic symbol of a partial eclipse, and so credit themselves with having invented everything and ridiculing Catholics as somehow worshiping the Sun and Moon. Catholics are then left bemused at this bizarre accusation and it will then take several generations before a defector from the Masons reveals that the whole thing was made up, but century after century people will come up with new ways to attack what by that time has become part of the Catholic liturgical calendar.

    Offline Truth is Eternal

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    Why do Protestants Assume We do Not Accept Jesus?
    « Reply #4 on: February 25, 2012, 08:45:59 PM »
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  • Quote from: Maizar
    Protestant might believe all kinds of things. They frequently believe that the Latin Vulgate is heretical, accusing it of being deliberately changed to satisfy a more pagan interpretation of Christianity. They believe that Catholics deify Mary, considering her to be somehow made to be part of the Trinity, and so warping Christianity to be in line with some pagan (including ancient Egyptian) cults who have a deistic trinity consisting of a Father/Mother/Son. They also believe that graven images of God amount to idolatry, so crucifixes with a corpus are no-go. Some see that praying at statues is akin to idolatry also. The above does not really include Lutherans or Anglicans, who generally have a better understanding of basic theology and so are less easily deluded. Some Protestants are offended by Easter eggs, because they have pagan origins, and others argue against various aspects of how Catholics celebrate Christmas, and more creative people come up with arguments against pretty much everything else, because it is against their business model to lose their flock to Catholicism.

    Now most of these accusations are Masonic and Jєωιѕн in origin, because in their cult a lot of emphasis is given to study of ancient religions (including тαℓмυdic Judaism) and this knowledge is used to discredit Catholicism.

    Traditional Catholics can usually give good refutations to all of the above, as most if not all are based on a misunderstanding of what is fundamental to the religion and what is cultural adaptation. Cultural adaptation is not necessarily wrongful. To give a fictitious example, If everybody in a given city or region had the habit of eating cashews at lunchtime on First Tuesdays to pay homage to some kind of "nut deity", there is nothing stopping people from turning Cashews Tuesday into, say, a devotion to St. Bob, bishop and martyr, who dedicated his life to helping nuts and the poor but was slain by a marauding crowd of masonic zealots. Of course masons will chip away (so to speak) trying to spread fear uncertainty and doubt, saying that cashews have some kind of geometric shape that means the whole thing is a masonic symbol of a partial eclipse, and so credit themselves with having invented everything and ridiculing Catholics as somehow worshiping the Sun and Moon. Catholics are then left bemused at this bizarre accusation and it will then take several generations before a defector from the Masons reveals that the whole thing was made up, but century after century people will come up with new ways to attack what by that time has become part of the Catholic liturgical calendar.


    It is sad  a post such as yours is so lengthy and is the truth but still only exposes a small part of how deceived Protestants are. Hopefully many of these Protestants will soon be receptive to the truth.  :reading:
    "I Think it is Time Cathinfo Has a Public Profession of Belief." "Thank you for publicly affirming the necessity of believing, without innovations, all Infallibly Defined Dogmas of the One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church."


    Offline Maizar

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    Why do Protestants Assume We do Not Accept Jesus?
    « Reply #5 on: February 25, 2012, 09:28:30 PM »
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    Hopefully many of these Protestants will soon be receptive to the truth.

    Hopefully. Maybe they even have a point sometimes. If we all tried our best to stick to the most necessary parts of the Faith and did a better job being generally virtuous and holy, and perhaps relied less on popular piety, they would have fewer excuses to soften their hearts? Probably better for us also.

    Offline MyrnaM

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    Why do Protestants Assume We do Not Accept Jesus?
    « Reply #6 on: February 25, 2012, 09:36:42 PM »
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  • My own opinion of Protestants missing the boat is very simple.  They do not honor Our Lady, therefore their love for Jesus is limited.  However, since they never knew what real love for Jesus is, they do not know what they are missing.

      Our Lady even said "My soul magnifies the Lord"... I realize that phrase has another meanings, but to me it says, if you honor me, your love for my  Son will be magnified.  In other words the more you love Our Lady, the more you will love her Son, its grace, she gives us.   Since they do not honor Mary, their love for her Son is earthly.  

    Their love is so tiny, they can't imagine our supernatural devotion gazing at a Crucifix, doing penance, uniting our suffering with His. It goes on and on, whatever they complain stems from their lack of love for Jesus.  

    To prove this, just listen to them accuse us of worshipping Our Lady, they wouldn't even give Jesus as much as we give Our Lady, so they see us and say we worship her.  

    Please pray for my soul.
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    Offline Darcy

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    Why do Protestants Assume We do Not Accept Jesus?
    « Reply #7 on: February 25, 2012, 09:45:06 PM »
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  • It depends on the protestant sect.  For example, the Lutherans prefer a Crucifix to a cross.



    Offline Caraffa

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    Why do Protestants Assume We do Not Accept Jesus?
    « Reply #8 on: February 25, 2012, 10:35:01 PM »
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  • Quote from: Truth is Eternal
    The whole sacrifice of the Mass is Christ centered.  :incense:

    Sorry. I as just venting. It is so difficult to reason with Protestants.


    Liberal and worldly Protestants don't accept Catholicism because as Bishop Williamson once said for worldly people in general, is that they know they'd have to change their lives and views and they don't desire to do so.

    Part of the problem is that the more serious Protestants, and the number of the those appear to be fading, only have interaction with Novus Ordo Catholicism, the typical NO kind, or the Neo-Catholic version, so when they come across Traditional Catholicism they might be caught off guard or they may not be sure what to expect, so they resort to the old arguments that they are used to making.  
    Pray for me, always.

    Offline Hobbledehoy

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    Why do Protestants Assume We do Not Accept Jesus?
    « Reply #9 on: February 25, 2012, 11:47:33 PM »
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  • Quote from: MyrnaM
    My own opinion of Protestants missing the boat is very simple.  They do not honor Our Lady, therefore their love for Jesus is limited.  However, since they never knew what real love for Jesus is, they do not know what they are missing.

      Our Lady even said "My soul magnifies the Lord"... I realize that phrase has another meanings, but to me it says, if you honor me, your love for my  Son will be magnified.  In other words the more you love Our Lady, the more you will love her Son, its grace, she gives us.   Since they do not honor Mary, their love for her Son is earthly.  

    Their love is so tiny, they can't imagine our supernatural devotion gazing at a Crucifix, doing penance, uniting our suffering with His. It goes on and on, whatever they complain stems from their lack of love for Jesus.  

    To prove this, just listen to them accuse us of worshipping Our Lady, they wouldn't even give Jesus as much as we give Our Lady, so they see us and say we worship her.


    Excellent!

    What St. Louis-Marie Grignion de Montfort taught in his renowned treatises The Secret of Mary (Le secret de Marie), Treatise on the True Devotion to the Blessed Virgin Mary (Traité de la vraie dévotion à la Sainte Vierge), and The Love of Eternal Wisdom (L'Amour de la Sagesse Éternelle), is essentially a wondrous epitome of the teachings of the Sacred Gospels, the holy Apostles, the Fathers of the Church, and the Apostolic See: epitomized in turn in the message that Our Lady of the Rosary vouchsafed us at Fatima, which is nothing more than an echo of those immortal words that Mary Most Holy herself spoke (the only public pronouncement of hers recorded by the Evangelists): "Whatsoever He (that is, Our Lord Jesus) shall say to you, do ye" (St. John ch. ii., 5).

    Only Our Lady can guide us in the perfect knowledge, love and service of her Divine Son.

    The Protestants' pseudo-theology reaches the acme of Babel's absurdity when they deny her glorious title of Mother of God.

    A mother brings forth a person, not a nature or part of a person (in Mothers' Day Cards we don't thank our mothers for giving us our flesh or kidney or nerves or neurons, but giving us life) - Jesus is the Second Person of the Most Holy Trinity Who assumed unto Himself a human nature in a hypostatic union with His divine nature in one divine Person of the Incarnate Word - Jesus is therefore God, as He Himself declared openly in the Gospels - the Blessed Virgin is therefore the Mother of God.

    St. Joseph, St. Elizabeth and St. John the Baptist, the Shepherds at Bethlehem, the royal Sages bearing gifts from the East, the Temple at Jerusalem, the holy ancient Simeon and the prophetess Anna: all received Jesus and His graces only from the maternal arms of Mary. This is the economy of salvation that Our Lord Himself has established, as St. Louis-Marie and St. Alphonsus, and the Fathers before them, have taught.

    Because the Protestant heretics reject the Mother of Our Lord, they deprive themselves of the graces of Our Lord.
    Please ignore all that I have written regarding sedevacantism.

    Offline Nishant

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    Why do Protestants Assume We do Not Accept Jesus?
    « Reply #10 on: February 26, 2012, 05:01:43 AM »
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  • Protestants like to say Catholics don't know the Bible, but I've found the opposite to be sometimes true, even of Protestants who appear of good will. I've had Protestants open their Bible to check some verses are there that they've obviously never heard of before. One of my college friends once read Rev 12 in shocked amazement

    Anyway, apart from clearing their ever-prevalent misconceptions about the Catholic Church, those who know their Faith should gently challenge them to examine their own beliefs as well. Since they love to say they "take God at His Word" as if we don't, I usually start with John 6:51-58. It's usually very effective, for those who've never known Christ in the Holy Eucharist.



    "Never will anyone who says his Rosary every day become a formal heretic ... This is a statement I would sign in my blood." St. Montfort, Secret of the Rosary. I support the FSSP, the SSPX and other priests who work for the restoration of doctrinal orthodoxy and liturgical orthopraxis in the Church. I accept Vatican II if interpreted in the light of Tradition and canonisations as an infallible declaration that a person is in Heaven. Sedevacantism is schismatic and Ecclesiavacantism is heretical.


    Offline ServusSpiritusSancti

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    Why do Protestants Assume We do Not Accept Jesus?
    « Reply #11 on: February 26, 2012, 12:46:18 PM »
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  • Myrna, Caraffa, and Hobbledehoy all made some fantastic posts. Thumbs up to all three of you.

    I would also like to add that one of the biggest problems with Protestantism is that their faith teaches the whole "once saved always saved" hoax. That is a very dangerous belief to hold. If you think you're already gauranteed to go to Heaven, then why do penance? Why repent for your sins? Why be nice to people? Why not be greedy? Hey, you're going to Heaven anyway, right? That is what runs through the Protestants' minds, and it is extremely dangerous and heretical.

    They think that Christ did all the penance and suffering for them when He died on the cross, so they feel no need to do any penance. Instead, they think they can just "accept Jesus into their heart" and then say "Ok, that's it. I'm done". That is not at all how it works.

    Their understanding of Scripture is very shallow, for Jesus said many times in the Bible that few are saved.
    Please ignore ALL of my posts. I was naive during my time posting on this forum and didn’t know any better. I retract and deeply regret any and all uncharitable or erroneous statements I ever made here.

    Offline Sigismund

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    Why do Protestants Assume We do Not Accept Jesus?
    « Reply #12 on: February 26, 2012, 04:17:48 PM »
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  • Quote from: Darcy
    It depends on the protestant sect.  For example, the Lutherans prefer a Crucifix to a cross.



    As do many Anglicans.
    Stir up within Thy Church, we beseech Thee, O Lord, the Spirit with which blessed Josaphat, Thy Martyr and Bishop, was filled, when he laid down his life for his sheep: so that, through his intercession, we too may be moved and strengthen by the same Spir

    Offline Truth is Eternal

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    Why do Protestants Assume We do Not Accept Jesus?
    « Reply #13 on: February 26, 2012, 05:36:14 PM »
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  • Quote from: MyrnaM
    My own opinion of Protestants missing the boat is very simple.  They do not honor Our Lady, therefore their love for Jesus is limited.  However, since they never knew what real love for Jesus is, they do not know what they are missing.

      Our Lady even said "My soul magnifies the Lord"... I realize that phrase has another meanings, but to me it says, if you honor me, your love for my  Son will be magnified.  In other words the more you love Our Lady, the more you will love her Son, its grace, she gives us.   Since they do not honor Mary, their love for her Son is earthly.  

    Their love is so tiny, they can't imagine our supernatural devotion gazing at a Crucifix, doing penance, uniting our suffering with His. It goes on and on, whatever they complain stems from their lack of love for Jesus.  

    To prove this, just listen to them accuse us of worshipping Our Lady, they wouldn't even give Jesus as much as we give Our Lady, so they see us and say we worship her.  



    Thanks for this insightful response. I never thought about Protestants accusing us of worshiping Mary because they do not even give Jesus as much as we give Our Lady.
    "I Think it is Time Cathinfo Has a Public Profession of Belief." "Thank you for publicly affirming the necessity of believing, without innovations, all Infallibly Defined Dogmas of the One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church."

    Offline Maizar

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    Why do Protestants Assume We do Not Accept Jesus?
    « Reply #14 on: February 26, 2012, 09:26:29 PM »
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    I would also like to add that one of the biggest problems with Protestantism is that their faith teaches the whole "once saved always saved" hoax. That is a very dangerous belief to hold. If you think you're already gauranteed to go to Heaven, then why do penance? Why repent for your sins? Why be nice to people? Why not be greedy? Hey, you're going to Heaven anyway, right? That is what runs through the Protestants' minds, and it is extremely dangerous and heretical.

    This is one of the many traps in trying to talk to a Protestant (again not a Lutheran or Anglican), but it isn't quite what goes through their minds. I mean, you can ask a Protestant "What does the sin of presumption mean?" and they more or less get it right, and might quote a Bible passage that more or less fits, but completely miss your point. Apologists need to work harder at understanding how they can think in this way. My take on it is like telling someone how to climb a mountain from one side when in that person's imagination they are standing on the opposite side of the mountain and just don't get what you're saying.