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Author Topic: What should I do?  (Read 1318 times)

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Offline Magdalene

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What should I do?
« on: December 12, 2007, 10:44:59 PM »
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  • I asked the following question in another Catholic site but got conflicting responses - so I am still at a loss what to do. Wondering what you guys here think about this situation and any advice you might have would be appreciated (where are you, Mike?!).

    A friend of mine, who is an Orthodox Christian, has invited me to her wedding. We used to be best friends but are no longer close (she will always have a special place in my heart, however, even though we are incompatible and distant towards each other now). The man she is marrying was a Catholic when he met her. Although he went to Mass every Sunday (and made sure his 13 year old son always came with him), he was not really a practicing Catholic since he committed sins of fornication with those he dated (hypocritically enough, he often referred to himself as "good Catholic boy" to my friend several times). Well anyway, now my friend's fiance is in the process of converting to the Orthodox religion with his son so that he can be Orthodox when he marries her. This man is head over heals over my friend (he's 12 years older and is nearing middle age) and I think he is converting to please her and because, since he wasn't a devout Catholic in the first place, it really makes no difference to him whether he is Catholic or Orthodox (the Orthodox liturgy is also more appealing than the N.O. and so I think he got lured that way too).

    My question is this: Should I attend my friend's wedding knowing that she is marrying a man who has just apostacized from the Catholic faith? If not, what do I tell my friend? She is the type of person who easily gets offended. And if the answer is that I should not attend her wedding, can I attend her reception?



    Offline JoanScholastica

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    What should I do?
    « Reply #1 on: December 13, 2007, 02:57:18 AM »
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  • Here's something from the Catechism by Fr. Cogan

    Quote
    Are you ever allowed to go to a non-Catholic church?
       Yes, but only for the wedding or funeral of a close relative or friend or of a public official.

    Are you ever allowed to take part in the religious services of a non-Catholic church?
       No; this includes singing hymns or praying aloud with the congregation.
    Also, you are forbidden to act as best man or bridesmaid at a wedding at which a non-Catholic minister or rabbi officiates if the wedding is invalid.


    But personally, I do not want to attend due to the man. I would heartily talk to her about why I'm not attending and explain to her my decision. Hopefully, she wouldn't get mad but whatever happens, I'm still sticking to my decision.

    Hope this helps!



    Offline Magdalene

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    What should I do?
    « Reply #2 on: December 13, 2007, 04:29:39 AM »
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  • Quote from: JoanScholastica
    Here's something from the Catechism by Fr. Cogan

    Quote
    Are you ever allowed to go to a non-Catholic church?
       Yes, but only for the wedding or funeral of a close relative or friend or of a public official.

    Are you ever allowed to take part in the religious services of a non-Catholic church?
       No; this includes singing hymns or praying aloud with the congregation.
    Also, you are forbidden to act as best man or bridesmaid at a wedding at which a non-Catholic minister or rabbi officiates if the wedding is invalid.


    But personally, I do not want to attend due to the man. I would heartily talk to her about why I'm not attending and explain to her my decision. Hopefully, she wouldn't get mad but whatever happens, I'm still sticking to my decision.

    Hope this helps!



    Even if it means that she'll be so offended that she'll never talk to me again?

    Offline JoanScholastica

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    What should I do?
    « Reply #3 on: December 14, 2007, 12:30:49 AM »
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  • But look, who do you want to please most? If your conscience tells you that you wouldn't be displeasing God in this situation, then I bet you never ask for advice here.

    Talk out to her in a kind way. If you loose her friendship, then I believe God would always reciprocate you with another friend. Keep courage.

    God is never outdone in generosity.

    Offline amiga

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    What should I do?
    « Reply #4 on: December 14, 2007, 03:02:51 AM »
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  • Well here is my opinion...

    You may go to the wedding and attend the party.  But you should never hide that you are a Catholic should the occaision arise.

    but then, it is still up to you... :scratchchin:

    Christ on my daily round

    I pray each morn that I may not be blind
    To Christ, Who moves that day among my kind.
    I dare not turn a hungry man away,
    Lest I be leaving Him unfed today.
    I dare not slight some tattered, unclothed one,
    Lest I should fail


    Offline Adesto

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    What should I do?
    « Reply #5 on: December 14, 2007, 08:13:51 AM »
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  • The best thing to do would be ask a priest, Magdalene. We are all (unless I'm mistaken) laypeople here and if we give contrasting answers then you are no better than you were beforehand. None of us have the stamp of ecclesiastical authority unless we're quoting from catechism. Talk it over with a priest, if your conscience is bothering you. It's what I'd do, at any rate.

    Edit: my two cents would be that his past sins (you mentioned that he used to sleep around) are irrelevant in this situation. I wouldn't want anyone staying away from my wedding based on something I'd done as a younger person.

    Join the Rosary Apostolate of Our Lady of Perpetual Succour: www.virgoclemens.bravehost.com

    Offline JoanScholastica

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    What should I do?
    « Reply #6 on: December 15, 2007, 05:16:46 PM »
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  • Quote from: Adesto
    Edit: my two cents would be that his past sins (you mentioned that he used to sleep around) are irrelevant in this situation. I wouldn't want anyone staying away from my wedding based on something I'd done as a younger person.


    Just to make it clear: I'm not against the man due to his past sins. Everyone of us has past sins. All I'm against was his apostatizing on the Catholic Faith.

    Offline Adesto

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    What should I do?
    « Reply #7 on: December 15, 2007, 05:31:36 PM »
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  • Quote from: JoanScholastica
    Quote from: Adesto
    Edit: my two cents would be that his past sins (you mentioned that he used to sleep around) are irrelevant in this situation. I wouldn't want anyone staying away from my wedding based on something I'd done as a younger person.


    Just to make it clear: I'm not against the man due to his past sins. Everyone of us has past sins. All I'm against was his apostatizing on the Catholic Faith.


    Sorry Joan, I didn't mean to imply that you did. I was just pointing out that they weren't relevant to the situation, as Magdalene mentioned them.

    Join the Rosary Apostolate of Our Lady of Perpetual Succour: www.virgoclemens.bravehost.com


    Offline Nomas

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    What should I do?
    « Reply #8 on: December 15, 2007, 05:45:11 PM »
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  • Quote from: Magdalene
    Quote from: JoanScholastica
    Here's something from the Catechism by Fr. Cogan

    Quote
    Are you ever allowed to go to a non-Catholic church?
       Yes, but only for the wedding or funeral of a close relative or friend or of a public official.

    Are you ever allowed to take part in the religious services of a non-Catholic church?
       No; this includes singing hymns or praying aloud with the congregation.
    Also, you are forbidden to act as best man or bridesmaid at a wedding at which a non-Catholic minister or rabbi officiates if the wedding is invalid.


    But personally, I do not want to attend due to the man. I would heartily talk to her about why I'm not attending and explain to her my decision. Hopefully, she wouldn't get mad but whatever happens, I'm still sticking to my decision.

    Hope this helps!



    Even if it means that she'll be so offended that she'll never talk to me again?


    Who is it better to offend a schismatic or Christ?
    Do you think your Guardian Angel will be happy with you for making him attend such an event?

    You shouldn't even have a friend who is a schismatic, you cannot be a friend of God and also a friend of the enemies of God.

    Offline Nomas

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    What should I do?
    « Reply #9 on: December 16, 2007, 09:09:48 AM »
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  • Then you disagree with greater people than me.

    To know whom to avoid is a great means of saving our souls. [...] Thus, the Church forbids the faithful to communicate with those unbelievers who have forsaken the faith by corrupting it, such as heretics, or by renouncing it, such as apostates. St. Thomas Aquinas

    Do not work together with unbelievers, for what does justice have in common with injustice? II Corinthians 6:14

    Whoever is separated from the Church must be avoided and fled from; such a man is wrong-headed; he is a sinner and self-condemned. [...] But if some of the leaders of schism persist in their blind and obstinate foolishness, and if advice for their own good fails to bring them back to the way of salvation, let the rest of you [...] break away from their ensnaring falsehood. [...] One must withdraw from those who are engaged in sin; rather, one must fly from them, lest by joining in their evil course and thus taking the wrong road, one should [...] become involved in the same guilt oneself. St. Cyprian

     We have heard that many, saying they are Catholic, are living a life in common with Jєωs and pagans [...] in diverse errors, maintaining that they are not being harmed. [...] A great and deadly error! Pope Adrian I

     It is an illusion to seek the company of sinners on the pretence of reforming them or of converting them; it is far more to be feared that they will spread their poison to us. St. Gregory nαzιanzen

     For if they have doctrines opposed to ours, it is not fitting to be mixed up with them for this cause alone. [...] What do you say? "Their faith is the same; these men are orthodox"? Why, then, are they not with us? St. John Chysostom

    You help the ungodly, and you are joined in friendship with those who hate the Lord; and therefore you did indeed deserve the wrath of the Lord. II Paralipomenon 19:2

    The accursed perversity of heretics [...] has so increased that now they exercise their wickedness not in secret, but manifest their error publicly, and win over the weak and simple-minded to their opinion. For this reason, We resolve to cast them, their defenders, and their receivers under anathema, and We forbid under anathema that any one presume to help heretics or to do business with heretics. III Lateran Council

    Saints Peter and Paul, in their Epistles, have loathed heretics, and warned us to avoid them. St. Cyprian

    Or what fellowship does light have with darkness? And what concord does Christ have with Belial? Or what part do the faithful have with the unbeliever? [...] Wherefore, go out from among them and be ye separate, says the Lord. II Corinthians 6:14-17

    I have always regarded the Church's enemies as my own. St. Jerome

    Separate yourself from your enemies. Ecclesiasticus 6:13

    John, the disciple of the Lord, going to bathe at Ephesus, and finding Cerinthus inside, rushed out of the bath-house without bathing, shouting: "Let us fly, lest even the bath-house fall down, for Cerinthuis, an enemy of truth is inside!" And Polycarp himself replied to Marcion who met him on one occasion asking: "Do you know me?" "I do know you," replied Polycarp: "I know you to be the first-born of Satan!" Such was the horror which the Apostles and their disciples had against even holding even verbal communication with any corrupters of truth. St. Irenaeus of Lyons

    In respect to their guilt whereby they are opposed to God, all sinners are to be hated, even one's father or mother or kindred, according to Luke 14:26. For it is our duty to hate in the sinner his being a sinner. St. Thomas Aquinas

    If any man hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brothers and sisters [...] he cannot be My disciple. St. Luke 14:26

    If any man come to you and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into the house, nor say to him: "God speed you." For he who says to him "God speed you" communicates with his wicked works. II John 1:10-11

    When our friends fall into very great wickedness, and become incurable, we ought no longer to show them friendliness. It is for this reason that both divine and human laws command such sinners to be put to death, because there is a greater likelihood of their harming others than of their mending their ways. St. Thomas Aquinas

     If you will not return to the good path from which you have departed, we shall treat you as a stranger, and we shall separate from you; for it behooves us not to have any communication with one who has abandoned his God to please men and to secure for himself the perishable things of this life, which will cause him to perish everlastingly. St. James Intercisus

    If any man shall be friendly to those with whom the Roman Pontiff is not in communion, he is in complicity with those who want to destroy the Church of God; and, although he may seem to be with us in body, he is against us in mind and spirit, and is a much more dangerous enemy than those who are outside and are our avowed foes. Pope St. Clement I

    Let us hate those who are worthy of hatred. Let us withdraw from those from whom God withdraws. Let us say to God with all boldness concerning all heretics: "Do I not hate them, O Lord, who hate Thee?" St. Cyril of Jerusalem

     Have I not hated them, O Lord, who hated Thee? [...] I have hated them with a perfect hatred, and they have become enemies to me. Psalm 138:21-22

    We are not faithful to God if we love His enemies. St. Thomas Aquinas

    He who can never love Christ enough will never give up fighting against those who hate him. St. John Chysostom


    The living God has charged me to declare unto you that He will punish those who will not avenge Him against His enemies. St. Bernard


    Joined in friendship with those who hate the Lord, you truly deserve the wrath of God! II Paralipomenon 19:2

    I pray God that some of us, as high as we seem to sit treading heretics under our feet like ants, that we live not to see the day we would gladly wish to be at league and composed with them, to let them have their churches quietly to themselves so that they would be content to let us have our quietly to ourselves. [...] Upon conditions that all heresies were suppressed, I would wish that all my books were burned up and all my labour utterly lost. St. Thomas More

    So great is my aversion for the company of heretics, or of conversation with them, that I say we ought not even go near them. St. Anthony the Abbot

    St. Anthony the Abbot would not speak to a heretic, except to exhort him to the true faith; and he drove all heretics from his mountain, calling them venomous serpents. St. Athanasius

    I was to either convert hypocrites to the way of salvation, or reject them and refrain from associating with them. St. Boniface

    I entreat you to shun, whenever possible, the society of those who profess false doctrines. St. John Eudes

    Therefore, he, who would not continue as one with the brethren, having followed heretics, goes forth as an antichrist. St. Optatus of Milevis

    Are heretics and schismatics excommunicated? Yes; they have no part in the Communion of the Saints. Catechism of the Summa

    But because you would not stay away from that wicked excommunicated person, you yourself shall die! St. Cedd of London

    Turn your thoughts away from a non-Catholic, turn away your ears, so that you may have strength to grasp life everlasting through the one, true and holy Catholic Church. Our Lord warns all the faithful: they must not put any faith in heretics or schismatics. St. Augustine

    Do not treat with a man without religion. [...] Give no heed to them in any matter of counsel. Ecclesiasticus 37:12,14