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Author Topic: What is gossip?  (Read 494 times)

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Offline AnthonyPadua

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What is gossip?
« on: July 15, 2025, 04:11:09 AM »
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  • From the Catholic Point of View, and how does it different from the secular idea of gossip? And is it a sin?

    Offline AMDGJMJ

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    Re: What is gossip?
    « Reply #1 on: July 15, 2025, 07:23:07 AM »
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  • From the Catholic Point of View, and how does it different from the secular idea of gossip? And is it a sin?
    One of the ladies asked about this recently.  Here was my response in the Women's Only Forum:

    "I don't have a sermon but I am reminded of a saying written over/on the table of a Saint (I think) but can't remember which or exactly how it went.  It was something like this:

    "This board allows no defamer place.
    Who shall charge the absent with disgrace."

    From what I understand the idea is that gossip is speaking unnecessarily of others faults in a manner that it will be spread around the community.

    Sometimes it is necessary in charity to warn people of the faults of others.

    Sometimes it is edifying to recount stories about others but it generally should be done anonymously (without their names) if it is a bad account.

    Sometimes if one has no confessor, one can confide in another man or woman for guidance and this is not gossip.

    Hope this helps a bit!  🥰"
    "Jesus, Meek and Humble of Heart, make my heart like unto Thine!"

    http://whoshallfindavaliantwoman.blogspot.com/


    Offline Twice dyed

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    Re: What is gossip?
    « Reply #2 on: July 15, 2025, 11:25:23 AM »
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  • My town has one, and only one Café. I never go there...the mostly senior customers search for gossip topics. "Coffee Row", they call it. The source of much misinformation. Nothing much happens in town, so any activity is discussed and imaginations have free rein. Reality gets twisted, and the Prots keep grudges. Gossip is sinful for the most part. We will have to render account for every idle word!
    Anyway, here's a very short story about the evil of "Calumny".
    *****
    http://catholicapologetics.info/morality/general/btongue.htm

    Rufinus of Aquilea relates the following incident: Some brothers had been sent by their monastery to visit hermits living here and there in the desert. They came first to an elderly anchorite who gave them sincere and cordial hospitality. To relieve his road-weary visitors, he resolved to treat them as well as he could and openheartedly offer them all he had. Poverty can be generous in its way, not in what it gives but in the dispositions with which it gives. The old man wanted to show this religious magnificence so that his guests, seeing his liberality, would be at ease and freely receive what his charity was not embarrassed to give them. They said evening prayers after a very congenial supper, and then the old man bedded down his guests while he went to rest in another room.

    To bring on drowsiness, our travelers began to talk. And one of them said, "What do you think? These hermits eat better than we do in our monastery... ". The old man heard all these remarks. He was hurt because his guests were returning his kindness with calumny, but he kept silence. At dawn the next morning, the brothers said they were going to go and visit another hermit As he bid them goodbye, the old man said to them, "Give my greetings to the hermit who is my dear friend, and tell him simply this: 'Take care not to sprinkle the oil.'"

    The brothers repeated his message faithfully. The other hermit understood the recommendation at once, and he served his guests an extremely frugal table, the main meal consisting in dry bread, salt and a little vinegar: that was the substance of the banquet. Soon tiring of such cold hospitality, our travelers moved out that very night with as little fanfare as possible. (22)

    (22) Rufinus of Aquilea, Pelagius, Book 10, No. 5.

    My friends, stop slandering those who treat you with kindness. Learn to stop backbiting their generosity..."


    ...But backbiting is so sweet!' you say. Yes, but not backbiting is sweeter still..."

    ***
    Be kind, pray.
    La mesure de l'amour, c'est d'aimer sans mesure.
    The measure of love is to love without measure.
                                     St. Augustine (354 - 430 AD)

    Offline Aleksandar

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    Re: What is gossip?
    « Reply #3 on: July 15, 2025, 12:57:26 PM »
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  • One of the ladies asked about this recently.  Here was my response in the Women's Only Forum:

    "I don't have a sermon but I am reminded of a saying written over/on the table of a Saint (I think) but can't remember which or exactly how it went.  It was something like this:

    "This board allows no defamer place.
    Who shall charge the absent with disgrace."

    From what I understand the idea is that gossip is speaking unnecessarily of others faults in a manner that it will be spread around the community.

    Sometimes it is necessary in charity to warn people of the faults of others.

    Sometimes it is edifying to recount stories about others but it generally should be done anonymously (without their names) if it is a bad account.

    Sometimes if one has no confessor, one can confide in another man or woman for guidance and this is not gossip.

    Hope this helps a bit!  🥰"
    I just said something negative about a priest that was maybe unnecessary.

    I asked a person how a certain mass they went to was, they said that the priest rushed the mass. I replied that i don't like when priests do that, and that another priest that i know tends to that aswell. I named where the priest says mass so i identified him.

    I guess it was unnecessary to say that in response, i just wanted to say something on topic, was that gossip?

    Offline AMDGJMJ

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    Re: What is gossip?
    « Reply #4 on: July 15, 2025, 02:13:52 PM »
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  • I just said something negative about a priest that was maybe unnecessary.

    I asked a person how a certain mass they went to was, they said that the priest rushed the mass. I replied that i don't like when priests do that, and that another priest that i know tends to that aswell. I named where the priest says mass so i identified him.

    I guess it was unnecessary to say that in response, i just wanted to say something on topic, was that gossip?
    It depends on whether the information you shared was public/common knowledge or necessary for some reason to mention. 

    If not, it probably was gossip.  I think the idea is that if you share such information it should be done without mentioning the person's actual name if possible because it could detract from his good name.

    Saint Francis de Sales in his Introduction to the Devout Life has several sections discussing what is appropriate and not good in conversations.  I highly recommend reading it if you have time.

    Here is a link to where you can read it online for free:

    https://archive.org/details/IntroductionToTheDevoutLife
    "Jesus, Meek and Humble of Heart, make my heart like unto Thine!"

    http://whoshallfindavaliantwoman.blogspot.com/


    Offline AMDGJMJ

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    Re: What is gossip?
    « Reply #5 on: July 15, 2025, 02:15:03 PM »
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  • My town has one, and only one Café. I never go there...the mostly senior customers search for gossip topics. "Coffee Row", they call it. The source of much misinformation. Nothing much happens in town, so any activity is discussed and imaginations have free rein. Reality gets twisted, and the Prots keep grudges. Gossip is sinful for the most part. We will have to render account for every idle word!
    Anyway, here's a very short story about the evil of "Calumny".
    *****
    http://catholicapologetics.info/morality/general/btongue.htm

    Rufinus of Aquilea relates the following incident: Some brothers had been sent by their monastery to visit hermits living here and there in the desert. They came first to an elderly anchorite who gave them sincere and cordial hospitality. To relieve his road-weary visitors, he resolved to treat them as well as he could and openheartedly offer them all he had. Poverty can be generous in its way, not in what it gives but in the dispositions with which it gives. The old man wanted to show this religious magnificence so that his guests, seeing his liberality, would be at ease and freely receive what his charity was not embarrassed to give them. They said evening prayers after a very congenial supper, and then the old man bedded down his guests while he went to rest in another room.

    To bring on drowsiness, our travelers began to talk. And one of them said, "What do you think? These hermits eat better than we do in our monastery... ". The old man heard all these remarks. He was hurt because his guests were returning his kindness with calumny, but he kept silence. At dawn the next morning, the brothers said they were going to go and visit another hermit As he bid them goodbye, the old man said to them, "Give my greetings to the hermit who is my dear friend, and tell him simply this: 'Take care not to sprinkle the oil.'"

    The brothers repeated his message faithfully. The other hermit understood the recommendation at once, and he served his guests an extremely frugal table, the main meal consisting in dry bread, salt and a little vinegar: that was the substance of the banquet. Soon tiring of such cold hospitality, our travelers moved out that very night with as little fanfare as possible. (22)

    (22) Rufinus of Aquilea, Pelagius, Book 10, No. 5.

    My friends, stop slandering those who treat you with kindness. Learn to stop backbiting their generosity..."


    ...But backbiting is so sweet!' you say. Yes, but not backbiting is sweeter still..."

    ***
    Be kind, pray.
    I never heard this story before!  Thank you for sharing! 
    "Jesus, Meek and Humble of Heart, make my heart like unto Thine!"

    http://whoshallfindavaliantwoman.blogspot.com/

    Offline Seraphina

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    Re: What is gossip?
    « Reply #6 on: Yesterday at 07:14:08 AM »
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  • This is entirely secular, but I recall in second grade, in response to an untrue rumor and hurtful  gossip about a certain girl, everyone in my class had to write 25x for homework, 

    “Is it kind?
    Is it true?
    What if it were 
    said of you?”  

    Offline Twice dyed

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    St John Bosco on gossip.
    « Reply #7 on: Yesterday at 10:32:35 AM »
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  • That 'secular' saying has a good moral, I like it. I notice the Manitoba gov't web site dedicates 4 pages about the evils of gossip, and pagan of course, ...but even they conclude gossiping is bad for morale/ community . 

    There's that story about some lady who went to St John Bosco (?) for confession. So she confessed sins of detraction, slander etc. St. John Bosco then told her she would have a penance , but in two parts. First he told her to get a pillow and go on a hill and throw all the feathers of the pillow to the wind.  So the woman was really wondering: 'what a strange penance!??' Of course she obeyed our saint. 
    When she returned to our Saint  , she then asked him ' Now what is the second part?  St. John Bosco told her: 'Now  you go and pick them up!'

    ~ ~ ~ ~~ ~ ~

    Hey! These feathers even have "EYES"  ☆
    La mesure de l'amour, c'est d'aimer sans mesure.
    The measure of love is to love without measure.
                                     St. Augustine (354 - 430 AD)


    Offline Croagh Patrick

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    Re: What is gossip?
    « Reply #8 on: Yesterday at 11:21:08 AM »
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  • It depends on whether the information you shared was public/common knowledge or necessary for some reason to mention. 

    If not, it probably was gossip.  I think the idea is that if you share such information it should be done without mentioning the person's actual name if possible because it could detract from his good name.

    Saint Francis de Sales in his Introduction to the Devout Life has several sections discussing what is appropriate and not good in conversations.  I highly recommend reading it if you have time.

    Here is a link to where you can read it online for free:

    https://archive.org/details/IntroductionToTheDevoutLife
    My favourite religious book AMDGJM. God bless you!!

    Offline SimpleMan

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    Re: What is gossip?
    « Reply #9 on: Yesterday at 01:35:13 PM »
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  • One thing that "sealed the deal" for me in embracing Catholicism was the teaching on detraction, viz. revealing unflattering but true facts, hitherto unknown, about someone.  I'd never heard this before in the Protestant environment in which I was raised.  Some people are in the height of their glory when they can relate an unflattering, hurtful truth about someone else.  It's a sin against the Fifth Commandment, and can be a very grave one.

    Offline Aleksandar

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    Re: What is gossip?
    « Reply #10 on: Yesterday at 01:53:21 PM »
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  • It depends on whether the information you shared was public/common knowledge or necessary for some reason to mention. 

    If not, it probably was gossip.  I think the idea is that if you share such information it should be done without mentioning the person's actual name if possible because it could detract from his good name.

    Saint Francis de Sales in his Introduction to the Devout Life has several sections discussing what is appropriate and not good in conversations.  I highly recommend reading it if you have time.

    Here is a link to where you can read it online for free:

    https://archive.org/details/IntroductionToTheDevoutLife
    Yes, I can say what has happened to me if I want to say something relevant but I shouldn't have identified the priest, thank you.


    Offline AnthonyPadua

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    Re: What is gossip?
    « Reply #11 on: Yesterday at 05:27:26 PM »
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  • Quote
    So, the term "gossip" is a very imprecesive and broad term, used in a secular context to refer to anyone who just speaks about other people, typically behind their backs, in typical "hushed whispers".
    Quote
    As such, it's too vague to make any judgments about its sinfulness or liceity.
    Quote
    But ... gossip can be sinful if the following occur (Catholic concepts vs. the broad secular term) --
    Quote
    1) calumny (spreading falsehoods about people)
    Quote
    2) detraction (spreading information about secret faults of a person, even if it happens to be true ... without sufficient justification)
    Quote
    3) lack of charity
    Quote
    #1 and #2 are dealt with extensively by Catholic moral theologians.
    Quote
    #3 is a little bit more vague. So, people could gossip about others where it's not calumny and not detraction, but still could be a violation of charity, where, say, you comment about how ugly someone's clothes are or perhaps about their homely looks, or being overweight, or some other bad habit they have, e.g. a nervous tick, etc. ... things along those lines. They don't involve moral faults nor are they hidden (so not detraction) nor are they lies (calumny) ... but they still offend against charity when there's no real justification for speaking about it. One could talk about these types of things if the conversation is motivated by charity (e.g. getting advice to help the person, etc.) ... but otherwise it can be a sin against charity.
    Quote
    I suppose that if none of the 3 conditions above apply, the gossip could be non-sinful, such as if you were talking about rumors that such and such a person might be planning on doing something non-sinful or not even bad where it could be an offense against charity ... "oh, I hear rumors that they're trying to adopt some children", things along those lines. That could be vain curiosity which may be an imperfection, but not really sinful since it doesn't violate charity and does not constitute detraction (there's no fault involved) -- as this one actually may imply some merit on the part of the individuals -- nor is it a lie. In that case, spreading information around would not be sinful except to the extent that some individual might be over-indulging useless curiosity, and the conversation could easily slide with a single mis-step or two into territory that might be sinful (so as an occasion for sin)