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Author Topic: What Formal Apostasy Looks Like  (Read 6374 times)

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Offline gladius_veritatis

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Re: What Formal Apostasy Looks Like
« Reply #15 on: May 19, 2022, 01:20:37 AM »
Quote from: DigitalLogos on May 18, 2022, 11:33:35 AM
Just like what us in tradland are suffering without a legitimate Pope.

It's Traddieland, DL.  I am pretty sure I coined the term and probably should have obtained some sort of trademark :laugh1:
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Offline gladius_veritatis

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Re: What Formal Apostasy Looks Like
« Reply #16 on: May 19, 2022, 02:00:47 AM »
Quote from: SeanJohnson on May 18, 2022, 08:48:13 AM
We fling this term around a bit too loosely, but here’s an actual example of a formal act of apostasy:

Ironically, you are using the term rather loosely -- that is, incorrectly -- in this instance.  Falling into schism -- i.e., joining a schismatic sect -- is not the same thing as apostatizing.  Heresy, schism and apostasy are three distinct things, thus three different terms.


https://www.catholic.org/encyclopedia/view.php?id=930

"Perfidiæ is the complete and voluntary abandonment of the Christian religion, whether the apostate embraces another religion such as Paganism, Judaism, Mohammedanism, etc., or merely makes profession of Naturalism, Rationalism, etc. The heretic differs from the apostate in that he only denies one or more of the doctrines of revealed religion, whereas the apostate denies the religion itself, a sin which has always been looked upon as one of the most grievous..."
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Offline gladius_veritatis

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Re: What Formal Apostasy Looks Like
« Reply #17 on: May 19, 2022, 02:24:54 AM »
Quote from: Ladislaus on May 18, 2022, 09:11:45 AM
 Maybe this priest is sincere and has come to believe in Orthodoxy, but that does not render him a merely material schismatic.  He's a formal schismatic at this point.  Period.

Yet, SJ, who clearly considers himself extremely well-informed about such matters, is absolutely and embarrassingly wrong in this instance.  I remember when I popped up after a lengthy absence and he told me I wasn't even in his league (Homey said WHA?!?!?!?).  He clearly had no idea who I am and what I'd done on CI before his ignorant ass was even here.  To be fair, although he irks me from time to time with his arrogance and ignorance, I am morally certain he's a good dude and we'd have a blast hanging out, drinking some top-notch bourbon and smoking a few Cubans.
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Offline SeanJohnson

Re: What Formal Apostasy Looks Like
« Reply #18 on: May 19, 2022, 06:13:50 AM »
(Blushing)
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Offline Ladislaus

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Re: What Formal Apostasy Looks Like
« Reply #19 on: May 19, 2022, 06:39:21 AM »
Quote from: gladius_veritatis on May 19, 2022, 01:18:04 AM
Just look at Assisi (1986, The Deuce) if you want to see apostasy in action.  This is child's play in comparison and, unless I am mistaken, he is not actually abandoning the Christian religion altogether, which is what it means to apostatize. See Mortalium animos.

Yes, technically apostasy refers to infidelity, i.e. adopting a false religion that denies the core essential mysteries, the Holy Trinity and Incarnation.  I think it's often used loosely (and this causes confusion) as applying to someone who formally or officially abandons the Church ... vs. those who continue to show up at Novus Ordo churches while believing maybe 10% of what the Church teaches and that only because it suits them.  I think I saw a number somewhere that nearly half of Novus Ordites question even the existence of God.

That's in fact the S&S position, that one remains a member of the Church unless one either formally renounces the Church or gets kicked out (excommunicated) by name ... and thus their assertion that Joe Biden is actually a Catholic, while SVs are not.
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