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Author Topic: What's the purpose of smoking marijuana for Recreation?  (Read 22419 times)

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Offline RevolveBooks

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Re: What's the purpose of smoking marijuana for Recreation?
« Reply #120 on: March 16, 2022, 08:03:59 AM »
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    • Quote from: Ladislaus on March 16, 2022, 07:33:57 AM
    Situation:  woman wears shorts out to a grocery store.
    If Lizzo wear shorts to the grocery store and nobody feels lust is it still a sin?
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    Offline Mithrandylan

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    Re: What's the purpose of smoking marijuana for Recreation?
    « Reply #121 on: March 16, 2022, 09:34:49 AM »
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    • It's often remarked by Catholics that our country has a puritanical heritage. Usually, the heritage of American puritanism is seen simply as a rigid and principled rejection of certain pleasures, especially intoxicants.

    I don't think that's actually the heritage of American puritanism, though. I think the real heritage of American puritanism is the idea that intoxicants are for "getting messed up."  This attitude is something that almost all Americans share, they just differ in judging "getting messed up" to be a good or bad thing. In general, irreligious people think that getting messed up is good, whilst religious people think it's bad.

    In Europe, I am told, there is a much healthier attitude toward intoxicants (alcohol especially). Taking alcohol as an example, it is a cultural staple and even children are given it. Alcohol is to Europe what guns are to America: early exposure and normalization helps provide for a much more moderate and responsible use. This isn't to suggest or imply that we should give children cannabis just for the sake of getting them used to it. Cannabis is psychoactive, so I would favor age restrictions on it since regular use can be detrimental to cognitive development. No, the reason I bring it up is to show how very cultural the evaluation LT offers (and others who argue like him) actually is. And as is the case with many things that are cultural, it's just about impossible to imagine it being any other way. 





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    "Be kind; do not seek the malicious satisfaction of having discovered an additional enemy to the Church... And, above all, be scrupulously truthful. To all, friends and foes alike, give that serious attention which does not misrepresent any opinion, does not distort any statement, does not mutilate any quotation. We need not fear to serve the cause of Christ less efficiently by putting on His spirit". (Vermeersch, 1913).

    Offline epiphany

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    Re: What's the purpose of smoking marijuana for Recreation?
    « Reply #122 on: March 16, 2022, 11:47:53 AM »
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    • Quote from: Meg on March 16, 2022, 12:23:49 AM
    At least those who drink alcohol don't usually claim that it's for "medicinal purposes." Unless they wink their eye when doing so.
    And that is why MJ should be legalized.
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    Offline epiphany

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    Re: What's the purpose of smoking marijuana for Recreation?
    « Reply #123 on: March 16, 2022, 11:49:08 AM »
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    • Quote from: Mark 79 on March 16, 2022, 12:36:07 AM
    Actually alcohol was used effectively to slow premature labor.

    Much more efficacious and non-toxic alternatives are now used.

    So much for Meg's medical insights—about as worthless as her channeling the interior dispositions of others.
    Hops has been used by midwives for a long time to help women with morning sickness.  Sipping on half a beer throughout the day can really help.

    Red wine in moderation has been proven to help the heart.
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    Offline Meg

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    Re: What's the purpose of smoking marijuana for Recreation?
    « Reply #124 on: March 16, 2022, 12:06:50 PM »
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    • Quote from: epiphany on March 16, 2022, 11:47:53 AM
    And that is why MJ should be legalized.

    Don't get what you mean to say here. 
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    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29

    Offline Meg

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    Re: What's the purpose of smoking marijuana for Recreation?
    « Reply #125 on: March 16, 2022, 12:11:49 PM »
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    • Quote from: Mithrandylan on March 16, 2022, 09:34:49 AM
    It's often remarked by Catholics that our country has a puritanical heritage. Usually, the heritage of American puritanism is seen simply as a rigid and principled rejection of certain pleasures, especially intoxicants.

    I don't think that's actually the heritage of American puritanism, though. I think the real heritage of American puritanism is the idea that intoxicants are for "getting messed up."  This attitude is something that almost all Americans share, they just differ in judging "getting messed up" to be a good or bad thing. In general, irreligious people think that getting messed up is good, whilst religious people think it's bad.

    In Europe, I am told, there is a much healthier attitude toward intoxicants (alcohol especially). Taking alcohol as an example, it is a cultural staple and even children are given it. Alcohol is to Europe what guns are to America: early exposure and normalization helps provide for a much more moderate and responsible use. This isn't to suggest or imply that we should give children cannabis just for the sake of getting them used to it. Cannabis is psychoactive, so I would favor age restrictions on it since regular use can be detrimental to cognitive development. No, the reason I bring it up is to show how very cultural the evaluation LT offers (and others who argue like him) actually is. And as is the case with many things that are cultural, it's just about impossible to imagine it being any other way.


    Well said. When I took an enology course at a community college, the instructor's parents were from France. She said that they were all given wine as children during supper, diluted with water. She said that she and none of her 5 siblings were alcoholics. 

    Yes, cannabis is psychoactive. Hence, caution should be used. And one needs to be realistic about the side effects, which are very much downplayed. 
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    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29

    Offline epiphany

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    Re: What's the purpose of smoking marijuana for Recreation?
    « Reply #126 on: March 16, 2022, 12:52:48 PM »
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    • Quote from: Meg on March 16, 2022, 12:11:49 PM

    Well said. When I took an enology course at a community college, the instructor's parents were from France. She said that they were all given wine as children during supper, diluted with water. She said that she and none of her 5 siblings were alcoholics.

    Yes, cannabis is psychoactive. Hence, caution should be used. And one needs to be realistic about the side effects, which are very much downplayed.
    There are fewer side effects to MJ than alcohol.  Educate yourself.  Google Rick Simpson Oil story.
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    Offline Meg

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    Re: What's the purpose of smoking marijuana for Recreation?
    « Reply #127 on: March 16, 2022, 12:57:25 PM »
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    • Quote from: epiphany on March 16, 2022, 12:52:48 PM
    There are fewer side effects to MJ than alcohol.  Educate yourself.  Google Rick Simpson Oil story.

    If someone is suffering from cancer, and pot helps, that's fine. But that's a completely different thing from saying that there's nothing wrong with smoking pot recreationally. And I still don't believe that it's an actual cure for cancer. 

    And I'm willing to bet that I've seen more people suffer and die from cancer (and chemotherapy) than you have, since I worked for several years in an in-patient hospital oncology unit. I'm not a fan of allopathic medicine. I favor alternatives. But those who push pot as being medicinal tend to completely whitewash the negative aspects of it, especially when taken recreationally. 

    You're another know-it-all. Aren't traditional Catholics wonderful? :laugh1:
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    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29

    Offline Mark 79

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    Re: What's the purpose of smoking marijuana for Recreation?
    « Reply #128 on: March 16, 2022, 02:14:13 PM »
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    • As if emptying bedpans is a qualification to pontificate on oncology protocols or to correct "know-it-alls"?

    Quote from: Mark 79 on March 16, 2022, 01:10:19 PM

    It is an amusing irony that marijuana's strongest opponents continue to claim that marijuana causes cancer. The National Institute of Drug Abuse funded UCLA pulmonologist Prof. Donald Tashkin. For decades Tashkin struggled to demonstrate that smoking marijuana causes cancer, but he finally gave up. Tashkin's 2006 publication of his case-controlled study compared 1,200 patients with lung and head and neck cancers to a control group without cancers. To his credit, Tashkin reported reported the results that flew against his prejudice. He reported that, while tobacco smokers had a twenty-fold risk of cancer compared to non-smokers, marijuana smokers had lower cancer risk than non-smokers.

    Got that? Marijuana smokers had lower cancer risk than non-smokers!

    Marijuana Use and the Risk of Lung and Upper Aerodigestive Tract Cancers: Results of a Population-Based Case-Control Study

    Mia Hashibe; Hal Morgenstern; Yan Cui; Donald P. Tashkin; Zuo-Feng Zhang; Wendy Cozen; Thomas M. Mack; Sander Greenland. Cancer Epidemiol Biomarkers Prev (2006) 15 (10): 1829–1834.
    https://doi.org/10.1158/1055-9965.EPI-06-0330

    Tashkin's findings merely echoed an earlier 1997 National Institute of Drug Abuse funded study of 65,000 Kaiser HMO patients. In turn, those findings in humans were presaged by federally funded animal studies from the 1970s.

    Get the memo—the most committed opponents of marijuana (researchers and feds) have been forced to begrudgingly admit that there is no evidence that marijuana causes cancer.

    That marijuana smokers have lower cancer risk than non-smokers certainly lends credence to the reports of cancer cures using marijuana.

    Sure, marijuana's rabid enemies can point to this or that putatively carcinogenic chemical in marijuana smoke (e.g., aromatic hydrocarbons such as benzopyrene), but whatever those chemicals, it is clear that marijuana's beneficial chemicals have the predominant effect.
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    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: What's the purpose of smoking marijuana for Recreation?
    « Reply #129 on: March 16, 2022, 06:08:54 PM »
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    • Quote from: RevolveBooks on March 16, 2022, 08:03:59 AM
    If Lizzo wear shorts to the grocery store and nobody feels lust is it still a sin?

    Objectively, it's sinful.  But Lizzo may not know and her ignorance may be inculpable, so, to repeat, maybe yes, maybe no.  Your average person today has NO clue that it's wrong.
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    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: What's the purpose of smoking marijuana for Recreation?
    « Reply #130 on: March 16, 2022, 06:13:46 PM »
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    • Quote from: Pax Vobis on March 16, 2022, 07:59:43 AM
    I get your larger point, but we cannot say that a person has "no understanding" about immodesty because the natural law is written on all men's hearts, so there is no excuse for such sins.

    There's no natural law about wearing shorts.  Nature had Adam and Eve running around unclothed.  This notion of natural law is excessively widened sometimes to include everything under the sun.  That's simply not true.
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    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: What's the purpose of smoking marijuana for Recreation?
    « Reply #131 on: March 16, 2022, 06:21:10 PM »
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    • Quote from: DigitalLogos on March 16, 2022, 08:03:25 AM
    My favorite devotional book, Imitation of the Sacred Heart, tells us that we need to operate in such a manner that we presume everyone else is holier than ourselves to crush all pride.

    For the saints, though, it wasn't a mere presumption.  They really believed that.  It wasn't just something "make believe" that they convinced themselves of to gain humility.  They saw their own sinfulness, realizing that nothing good in them was their own, but was from God, and that all that they contributed to their relationship with God was the bad stuff.  Combine that with deep charity towards their neighbor, and they really believed it.

    If you were to tell a saint, "You're a saint," they would be disgusted and offended by the suggestion.

    I recall a story told from the pulpit.  I can't recall if it was St. Charles Borromeo or St. Philip Neri who was the main protagonist.  There were rumors going around about how a certain religioius house had a true saint there.  So he went to visit and asked, "May I speak to the saint please?"  And the "saint" stepped forward and said, "I am he."  And our Saint immediately turned around and left.
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    Offline curious2

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    Re: What's the purpose of smoking marijuana for Recreation?
    « Reply #132 on: March 16, 2022, 06:28:20 PM »
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    • Quote from: Ladislaus on March 16, 2022, 06:13:46 PM
    There's no natural law about wearing shorts.  Nature had Adam and Eve running around unclothed.  This notion of natural law is excessively widened sometimes to include everything under the sun.  That's simply not true.
    Adam and Eve's bodies pre-fall reflected the glory of their souls, so there was appropriately no shame. 

    Even children know from a very young age that there's something strange about someone walking around naked in public. Or is this merely social conditioning?
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    Offline epiphany

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    Re: What's the purpose of smoking marijuana for Recreation?
    « Reply #133 on: March 16, 2022, 06:33:35 PM »
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    • Quote from: Meg on March 16, 2022, 12:57:25 PM
    If someone is suffering from cancer, and pot helps, that's fine. But that's a completely different thing from saying that there's nothing wrong with smoking pot recreationally. And I still don't believe that it's an actual cure for cancer.

    And I'm willing to bet that I've seen more people suffer and die from cancer (and chemotherapy) than you have, since I worked for several years in an in-patient hospital oncology unit. I'm not a fan of allopathic medicine. I favor alternatives. But those who push pot as being medicinal tend to completely whitewash the negative aspects of it, especially when taken recreationally. 

    You're another know-it-all. Aren't traditional Catholics wonderful? :laugh1:
    Well, I researched MJ extensively when my uncle was found to have incurable stage 4 cancer.  He was given 2 weeks to live.  He was put on all kinds of meds which made him loopy with no appetite.

    He was pretty far gone for even MJ to turn it around.

    But once he started injesting MJ, he was happy as his usual self and eating well.  He died a happy man with his happy family around.

    What a way to go!!
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    Offline epiphany

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    Re: What's the purpose of smoking marijuana for Recreation?
    « Reply #134 on: March 16, 2022, 06:35:25 PM »
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    • Quote from: Mark 79 on March 16, 2022, 02:14:13 PM
    As if emptying bedpans is a qualification to pontificate on oncology protocols or to correct "know-it-alls"?
    Sometimes it is difficult for people who work in the western medical field to awaken from the education they received in training and work.  
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