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Author Topic: The Coyote Saint  (Read 4242 times)

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Offline klasG4e

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Re: Leonine Wall/Re: The Coyote Saint
« Reply #30 on: July 12, 2018, 09:11:10 PM »
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  • the majority of the Mexican people are Catholic  and friendly to Catholic Tradition.

    The majority of the Mexican people are nominal Catholics.

    I lived there, went to school there, and worked 3 summers in a very poor Mexican parish.  Most of the people by and large are decent hard working folks, but at the same time they are extremely secularized.  Most are cultural Catholics at best with the filth of the TV sewage lines coming into their homes on a daily basis.

    As far as knowledge of the traditions and traditional teachings of the Catholic Church most are fairly clueless.  It is quite a pitiful/pathetic situation, but I think it's fair to say that it is about the same through all the rest of Latin America.

    Offline poche

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    Re: The Coyote Saint
    « Reply #31 on: July 14, 2018, 10:59:58 PM »
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  • Do you believe that a country has the right to legislate laws which protects its own citizens firstly and foremost?
    Yes, a country has the right to legislate to protect its own citizens. For those who are not protected then we should call on the Holy Virgin to protect us.  


    Offline poche

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    Re: Leonine Wall/Re: The Coyote Saint
    « Reply #32 on: July 14, 2018, 11:02:46 PM »
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  • I'm pretty sure that the thread is about the issue of (illegal) migrants crossing the US - Mexican border.
    No, it is about St Toribio Romo.

    Offline poche

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    Re: The Coyote Saint
    « Reply #33 on: July 14, 2018, 11:05:51 PM »
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  • This is an outlandish statement.  Can you prove it or even come close to proving it?
    The Holy Virgin is the Queen of Heaven. St Toribio would never do anything but for the Holy Virgin asking for him to do it. The Holy Virgin intercedes for all her children.  

    Offline poche

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    Re: The Coyote Saint
    « Reply #34 on: July 14, 2018, 11:08:53 PM »
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  • Cf. "Not every one that saith to me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven: but he that doth the will of my Father who is in heaven, he shall enter into the kingdom of heaven." (Matt. 7:21)

    According to poche, however, "St. Toribio intercedes for all [as in ALL] those who pray to him."  

    First of all, we don't know what each of those prayers are for.  Nor do we know who each of the people praying to the "Coyote Saint" is.  (For instance, it may well be that some coyotes pray to him to assist them in their continual criminal operation!  After all, they would in a certain sense be on the same page as the ones they are helping to cross the border illegally.)  Even if you were to grant that each of the ones praying loves the Blessed Mother how does that translate into the Coyote Saint interceding on behalf of each one of them, especially if they are praying in essence for assistance in violating the immigration (border laws) of another sovereign country?

    Finally, only God Himself determines whether or not one's prayers to a saint or angel will reach the intended recipient.  The Church has never taught that every person in every instance who prays to a saint or angel asking for their intercession will be heard.  God hears all, but that certainly doesn't mean a prayed to saint or angel necessarily hears all.  Even when they do hear our prayers it is still only through God's will (should He will it) that they be allowed to intercede for us.
    So when St Toribio is sent from Heaven to help a supplicant then it is because God heard that person's cry for help and sent the Holy Saint to aid him.


    Offline poche

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    Re: Leonine Wall/Re: The Coyote Saint
    « Reply #35 on: July 14, 2018, 11:13:27 PM »
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  • but, when they run the borders they commit a criminal act. Crime is not the mark of a Catholic.
    Trying to save oneself from starvation is not a criminal act.

    Offline poche

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    Re: The Coyote Saint
    « Reply #36 on: July 14, 2018, 11:17:37 PM »
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  • Including those who deliberately break the law and sin?
    There is no civil law that can legitimately require us to materially commit suicide or submit to starvation.

    Offline poche

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    Re: The Coyote Saint
    « Reply #37 on: July 14, 2018, 11:23:35 PM »
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  • They are not coming here to eat, they are coming here to take advantage of the American taxpayer and break the law.
    Overall they benefit the American taxpayer by paying into a system form which they may never benefit.


    Offline JPaul

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    Re: The Coyote Saint
    « Reply #38 on: July 15, 2018, 08:35:33 AM »
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  • Overall they benefit the American taxpayer by paying into a system form which they may never benefit.
    There are millions of them on the social system who have never paid a dime into it. There are millions more who don't pay taxes at all. The U.S economy lost over 24 Billion dollars last year in overseas remittances.

    Offline JezusDeKoning

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    Re: The Coyote Saint
    « Reply #39 on: July 15, 2018, 09:49:45 AM »
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  • There are millions of them on the social system who have never paid a dime into it. There are millions more who don't pay taxes at all. The U.S economy lost over 24 Billion dollars last year in overseas remittances.
    As someone who still has family abroad, I see nothing wrong with that. If their currency is weak against the dollar, something like US$200 is a LOT for them.
    Les ferismes sont revenus. Un homme qui ne veut pas tuer sa femme quand elle n'écoute pas c'est un "soyboy/juif" selon la tête du Quid.

    Offline klasG4e

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    Re: The Coyote Saint
    « Reply #40 on: July 15, 2018, 03:50:39 PM »
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  • I'm bowing out.  My substantive Catholic reasoning is responded to or rather not responded to by silly pious one or two line platitudes by poche.


    Offline JPaul

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    Re: The Coyote Saint
    « Reply #41 on: July 15, 2018, 06:34:21 PM »
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  • I'm bowing out.  My substantive Catholic reasoning is responded to or rather not responded to by silly pious one or two line platitudes by poche.

    Speaking of the Wall, you can speak to poche all the day long and still, nothing gets through. He is impenetrable, we could sure use more of that on the border................

    Offline poche

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    Re: The Coyote Saint
    « Reply #42 on: July 16, 2018, 07:56:07 AM »
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  • There are millions of them on the social system who have never paid a dime into it. There are millions more who don't pay taxes at all. The U.S economy lost over 24 Billion dollars last year in overseas remittances.
    There are also millions who pay into the social security ssystem who will never qualify for benefits. 

    Offline poche

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    Re: The Coyote Saint
    « Reply #43 on: July 16, 2018, 07:58:26 AM »
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  • Speaking of the Wall, you can speak to poche all the day long and still, nothing gets through. He is impenetrable, we could sure use more of that on the border................
    Don't be so sure that I would not open the door for them. But then if I did that wouldn't that make their entry a legal entry?  

    Offline JezusDeKoning

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    Re: The Coyote Saint
    « Reply #44 on: July 16, 2018, 08:03:37 AM »
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  • Don't be so sure that I would not open the door for them. But then if I did that wouldn't that make their entry a legal entry?  
    They have to actually do the arduous process themselves. There are some illegal migrants that do and rectify their status, but that's rare.

    If they have children on U.S. soil, those children are U.S. citizens, which is fine.
    Les ferismes sont revenus. Un homme qui ne veut pas tuer sa femme quand elle n'écoute pas c'est un "soyboy/juif" selon la tête du Quid.

     

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