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Traditional Catholic Faith => Catholic Living in the Modern World => Topic started by: Nandarani on June 26, 2018, 05:52:50 PM

Title: Silence! Mental, Vocal Prayer, etc.
Post by: Nandarani on June 26, 2018, 05:52:50 PM
This is on this part of the site because the subject matter is used, at least by me!  regularly during each minute of the day as far as possible AND, I did this when teaching too... which got to be amusing but more on that later.  So, this is going to be where I will put thoughts on remaining sane while active, as well as while trying to get to sleep, when in public etc.  What a privilege Matthew has given us to be able to post what we think... for my part, without being able to do that, I'd not be even partly ok.  This is new:  I used to be calmer.

So!  When teaching, around 8 years ago or so I hand-made a little round disk and somehow managed to type on it, centered, this:

Observing
Silence
 
I punched a hole in it at the top, after laminating it - I'm sure I fit this in while doing other laminating so common in special education - and strung it on a rough piece of string.  It's hanging now from a shelf.  Of course, observing silence doesn't work that well as a teacher but it could be used as a way to teach observant students to pay attention better. 

Later in the teaching I ran into a rough patch as agendas became more rampant, and everybody hunkered down and thought about their accruing pensions and stayed.... except me, who never paid any attention to the pension.  Until wanting to know whether I could survive and quit.  I could.  BUT, during that period, I used silent mental prayer in the form of repeating a certain form of the Jesus prayer.  This helped me get through the day.  Note, I had an 18 hour day and worked on Saturdays too.  At least I loved riding to work and listening to podcasts from True Restoration Radio among others - leaving home at 2:30 am at the latest for a long commute by bike.

So silent ejaculations have helped me.  There is so much more to be said.

That's just one of the things I hope to help others with or remind them of.... and also in this thread would come the topic of Mental vs. Vocal Prayer, the matter of indulgences (my attitude about that has always been I am not a quid pro quo person but that has changed somewhat - it is an attitude, being not quid pro quo as I have seen it... which is integral to who I am though).  Definitions of Mental Prayer - I have noticed this topic is not cast in stone.  Options.

I will have specifics and anyone else's will be here too maybe.
Title: Re: Silence! Mental, Vocal Prayer, etc.
Post by: Nandarani on June 26, 2018, 07:45:31 PM
I have been using Jesus Mary I love you Save Souls for about a month, and found it in the blue Pieta Prayer Book.   Decided to look up the sister to whom this was given and found.... another treasure of information!  Imagine being told exactly what to repeat by Jesus, and all day long to repeat it.  How odd - the practice I began to stay sane often vocally when alone at home, and also am beginning to include it in the rosary, as I read is done in Portugal and the Philippines, in researching a bit yesterday.  Wikipedia has an article but no article is probably better than this one:  giving what Our Lord actually told her in bite sized pieces, in red, at the end of the link below.  Very accessible and authentic and inspiring.  And, Sister Consolata , 1903-1949, was beautiful.  

I have given it to one person on the street, an addict who is trying to save himself but finds the nights the most difficult.  Honolulu looks safe and sunny during the day but I have never been out at night past 5:30 pm or so, on returning from a long day teaching.

At night, is when the evil activities are occurring.  The police I have watched in action are kind here.  Not in the sense of pushovers; simply kind.

Here's the article:  http://www.mysticsofthechurch.com/2010/02/servant-of-god-sr-consolata-betrone.html (http://www.mysticsofthechurch.com/2010/02/servant-of-god-sr-consolata-betrone.html)
Title: Re: Silence! Mental, Vocal Prayer, etc.
Post by: Nandarani on June 27, 2018, 08:24:06 PM
Analogy to mental prayer, legal docuмent paperwork in special education done on Saturdays.  The time was agonizing for me.  Not because of inability.   It shuts out mental prayer.  One must concentrate.  One only concentrates in mental prayer to keep the mind undisturbed during that time.
Title: Re: Silence! Mental, Vocal Prayer, etc.
Post by: Viva Cristo Rey on June 27, 2018, 10:25:12 PM
Pray the Rosary in your bedroom. 
Title: Re: Silence! Mental, Vocal Prayer, etc.
Post by: Nandarani on July 02, 2018, 02:11:01 PM
In here is encouragement on one type of interior matter from Our Lord. 

It begins more from The Life of Sr. Mary of St. Peter pertaining to the Precious Blood which I read today.  Pdf form:  link to get it: https://archive.org/details/lifeofsistermary00janvuoft (https://archive.org/details/lifeofsistermary00janvuoft) 

It always takes a huge amount of time to cut and paste and post a book published in 1884 (revised in 1884) !   Was going to start another thread just for this book, and resources connected with La Salette since the two are connected.  But maybe, this thread will suffice.  I don't know what I will do yet.   

I am so enthralled with exactly the way Our Lord deals with Sr. Mary... at present I find it more engaging than anything else at this time of the day.  Later on, another book takes precedence...the old fashioned kind I don't have to be online to read.  

In between, I am out and about very actively, and reciting or mentally praying (using St. Louis Marie Grignon de Montfort's bead by bead method memorized from regular use) the rosary.

Rrarely without thinking.... oh my, how true, all these folks could be saved if clued in.  It for me always comes down to information. 

I didn't have it as a protestant; I got it much later through various twists and turns.  Therefore, anyone born Catholic is fortunate?  Well, almost anyone - those who fall out of the faith get so far gone that it is almost impossible for them to turn themselves around.  That is in my experience/observation!  They, presumably, are worse off for their heritage.

Anyway, here are written words to her Mother Superior who always with one exception (that concerning a pre-announcement of La Salette posted on another thread, which the Holy Man of Tours himself wrote down, after listening to Sr. Mary's Mother Superior relate what the Sister had said earlier) ...asked that Sr. Mary of St. Peter put her new information from Jesus into writing. 

Here is the end of the little preamble of the sister for her Mother Superior by way of introduction to what she was going to write.  "Illusion" here can refer to multiple problems. 

Two Carmelite sisters tormented by mental anguish about themselves for long periods.  It took a huge amount of confidence on the part of St. Terese of Jesus to do pretty much anything she did and the static got more so the longer she lived.  ;D

"Poor little worm that I am, I cannot find language to convey an idea of those heavenly gifts; nevertheless, I shall communicate to you all I can of what esus gave me to understand." 

"This Divine Director of my soul said to me My daughter, be more pliable under my operations, and more simple, for I wish to nourish you myself with the milk of my consolation.  The uneasy reflections you make on self, the fear you have of illusion, impede me from fully accomplishing my designs over you."

"When I had acknowledged my fault, he assumed a greater power over me and revealed many admirable secrets of his infinite mercy.  He called my attention to his justice and manifested his wrath as a great ocean, but at the same time, he commanded me to resist the impetuous torrent of his anger in union with his Divine Heart, that it might be lost in the abyss of his mercy."

"On another day, he presented to my view the multitude of souls who are daily falling into hell, and invites me in the most touching manner to fly to the rescue of these poor sinners.  He made me comprehend the real obligation of the Christian towards these unfortunate blind creatures, who precipitate themselves into the eternal abyss, whose eyes would have been opened if charitable souls had interceded on their behalf." 

"He said that if he would demand of the rich an account of the temporal goods confided them for the succor of the poor, with how much more reason would he not demand of a Carmelite, and of all religious souls, a rigorous account of the use they have made of the treasure of their celestial Spouse in succoring unfortunate sinners.  Then my amiable Saviour, opening to me the immense treasures composed of the infinite merits of his life and Passion, added: My daughter, I give you my face and my Heart, I give you my precious blood and my Sacred Wounds: draw from this treasury and scatter blessings around!  Purchase without money, my Blood is the price of souls.  Oh: what a sorrow it is for my Heart to see that the remedies which have coast me so much suffering are so wantonly despised:  Demand of my Father as many souls as I have shed drops of blood."






Title: Re: Silence! Mental, Vocal Prayer, etc.
Post by: Nandarani on July 02, 2018, 07:51:44 PM
Our Lord on courage he can work with, below first in red pertains exactly to the beginning of the long post above, where Our Lord says, be more malleable.   If not, I can't get the pleasure I get from working with your soul as he said to the obscure nun to whom He gave the ejaculation, "Jesus Mary I love you Save souls!."   Our Lord wants courage these days and always did.  But one has to have an idea for what.

Having been and still being basically a rabbit, one who would have taken out a non-participation pact with life had she been able to from the very beginning...to become someone with some courage took TRUSTING that were I to be myself, there would be a net.

Our Lord on courage he can work with -

"Only a few souls let me act with full freedom, so I cannot grant many graces."

Our Lord to Blessed Maria Pierina de Micheli receiver of the medal.

"Every time that anyone gazes at My Face, I will pour My Love into hearts and by means of My Holy Face, the salvation of many souls will be obtained." Then in 1937, Our Lord instructed her; "It may be that some souls fear that the devotion and cult of My Holy Face diminishes that towards My Heart. Tell them that on the contrary, it will be completed and augmented. In contemplating My Face, souls will share in all My gifts and will feel the need for love and reparation. Is that not perhaps the true devotion to My Heart?"

"By My Holy Face you will obtain the conversion of numberless sinners. Nothing that you ask in making this offering will be refused you. According to the care you take in making reparation To My Face, disfigured by blasphemers, I will take care of yours, which has been disfigured by sin. I will reprint on it My Image, and render it as beautiful as it was on leaving the Baptismal Font. I promise personal and spiritual protection to all who venerate this medal."
Title: Re: Silence! Mental, Vocal Prayer, etc.
Post by: Nandarani on July 09, 2018, 05:53:23 PM
No less than THREE really cool things in one post!  

1.  Here is an absolutely, well, two, great things to know or rather to ponder:  dying, in an utterly speeded-up process having been given close to the exact time by Jesus, Sr. Mary of St. Peter was reminded by onlookers, her fellow sisters, of the satisfaction she had had when contemplating His Divine Infancy :  I will spare you my editorial comments on such a prodigy but for this:  so all the innocence and simplicity which characterized her dovetailed and was reinforced by attraction to the first twelve years of Our Lord's life AND this helps to understand how to bear the cross.  Very cool.  Some amazing details are given near the end of the book, shortly before the rapid decline, of the entire realm associated with nursing and what Our Lord received form Our Lady.  The sister has not been the only one to whom the mystery was given.  At the time she said this, she couldn't move without so much pain from the rapid onset of consumption that she had developed large sores.  Her death process was extremely rapid from health and youth dying at just before age 33 to collapse.  The Mother Superior opined later the connection to the seriousness of her focus and the suffering Sr. Mary of St. Peter had in connection with the work of Reparation. 

Around this time news filtering into the convent about what was actually occurring in France and elsewhere in Europe including Rome was confirming it.

Sr. Mary of St. Peter died 170 years ago yesterday 8 july 1848.

https://archive.org/details/lifeofsistermary00janvuoft (https://archive.org/details/lifeofsistermary00janvuoft) pdf of her life I am ever pushing.

To encourage her in these sentiments, we spoke to her of the Child Jesus and of all the graces she had received through the mysteries of his childhood.  To which she said: 'Our Lord was then instructing me in the science of the Cross.'

2. The other cool thing is this:  I found these words connected with an article about Our Lady somewhere in here in one of the articles which I commend to attention.  What an absolutely great description of prayer ! : individually we can all use it to match and surpass in God's time ourselves only and no competition at all.

"...always more and always better"

http://salvemariaregina.info/SalveMariaRegina/Salve.html (http://salvemariaregina.info/SalveMariaRegina/Salve.html)

3. One final cool thing I have been intending to put up:  St. Thomas, mental prayer. 

I found this and quoted in notepad from some website when I was trying to get clearer on the options.  St. Terese of Jesus used a best-seller (numerous reprints) The Spiritual Alphabet, still available on amazon too to go to mental prayer and it was pivotal in her development. 

Just listening to her works makes so many things about prayer, recollection and more, so clear.  We can use librivox. 

Here is St. Thomas

One of the questions St. Thomas Aquinas posed in his short treatise on prayer (Summa Theologiæ, II-II, Q. 13, Art. 12) was, “Should prayer be vocal?” The answer is: Yes, if it increases our devotion.
Title: Re: Silence! Mental, Vocal Prayer, etc.
Post by: Nandarani on July 09, 2018, 09:20:36 PM
No wonder the following prayer always struck me as perfect before finding who dictated it. 

http://www.mysticsofthechurch.com/2009/11/sister-mary-of-holy-trinity-poor-clare.html (http://www.mysticsofthechurch.com/2009/11/sister-mary-of-holy-trinity-poor-clare.html)   

"My Lord Jesus, here is my tongue that You may watch over it, that it may not utter more than pleases You; and that my silence may speak to You.
Here are my ears that they may listen only to the voice of duty, and to Your Voice, o Jesus!
Here are my eyes that they may not cease to behold You in every face and in every work.
Here are my hands and my feet that You may make them agile, that You may rivet them to Your service alone, to the execution of Your desires.
Here are my thoughts that Your Light may possess them.
Here is my heart that Your Love, O Jesus, may reign and rest in it!"
Title: Re: Silence! Mental, Vocal Prayer, etc.
Post by: Nandarani on July 19, 2018, 07:21:18 PM
http://www.carmelitemonks.org/ (http://www.carmelitemonks.org/)

Source for writings of St. Terese of Jesus translated by E. Allison Peers - The Life of St. Terese has a marvelous time-line of her life in front of the actual text, and also a treat of a description of the special challenges of translation of this particular saint's writings, from the translator.  I prefer this version over the 1851 by Fr. John Dalton which librivox used - but that one still works great in audio form.

Meanwhile, at the pool . . .
The below is an excerpt which is borne out in my own experience in dealing with certain folks, actually one person in particular, who tries to engage me in conversation when all I aim to do is enter water and swim.  This person falls into the unfortunate category of people I know who take nothing in their Catholic heritage seriously and are old enough to have experienced pre-1958.  I simply maintain silence and get in.  What power that detonates it never fails; silence is golden.  I do not maintain silence by repeating anything mentally at the time I use it... but having repeated such things as "Jesus Mary I love you.  Save souls" quite a lot at other times probably helps.

As I tried to teach students in public school you are never required to answer questions simply because they are asked, in most instances, unless you are in court under oath or are dealing with authority figures like parents and teachers.

Anyway:  I have St. Terese's favorite instruction manual, it seems to me, from what she writes in her autobiography, on mental prayer - Osuna's The Third Alphabet.  You can find it on amazon, of course. ...

Actually I can't wait to read it in my real-book reading time as opposed to line reading time but am reading Libietis' True Consecration to Mary over again.

Here is the quote from page 62 of the pdf.  Again, pdf's available at carmelitemonks.org

'The blessings possessed by one who practises prayer -- I mean mental prayer -- have been written of by many saints and good men. Glory be to God for this! If it were not so, I should not have assurance enough (though I am not very humble) to dare to speak of it. I can say what I know by experience -- namely, that no one who has begun this practice, however many sins he may commit, should ever forsake it.   For it is the means by which we may amend our lives again, and without it amendment will be very much harder. So let him not be tempted by the devil, as I was, to give it up for reasons of humility, but let him believe that the words cannot fail of Him Who says that, if we truly repent and determine not to offend Him, He will resume His former friendship with us and grant us the favours which He granted aforetime, sometimes many more, if our repentance merits it.99 And anyone who has not begun to pray, I beg, for love of the Lord, not to miss so great a blessing. There is no place here for fear, but only desire. For, even if a person fails to make progress, or to strive after perfection, so that he may merit the consolations and favours given to the perfect by God, yet he will gradually gain a knowledge of the road to Heaven.'








Title: Re: Silence! Mental, Vocal Prayer, etc.
Post by: Viva Cristo Rey on July 20, 2018, 06:27:05 AM
Unplug on Sundays.  No texting or social media.  
Title: Re: Silence! Mental, Vocal Prayer, etc.
Post by: Neil Obstat on July 20, 2018, 06:49:38 AM
Unplug on Sundays.  No texting or social media.  
.
Fr. Girouard and Fr. David Hewko agree on this: Cell phones do not belong in a Catholic home, especially at the dinner table.
Title: Re: Silence! Mental, Vocal Prayer, etc.
Post by: Nandarani on July 20, 2018, 12:11:55 PM
This reflects how it is when I was teaching.... distracted by a thousand worldly cares and thoughts and how it can be using social media - which is the only reason I have ever condemned it.  Of course I understand it is consoling and fun to learn of a first tooth in a relative or an acceptance to a certain college, etc. but it is on a lower level of what someone like St. Terese recognized was necessary = she who tormented herself for a long period of time by recognizing that, for her, her social media, which was conversations with those visiting the convent for example, was in fact a mortal sin - it ruined her soul so it fit the definition.  Here on the next page from yesterday, is a little more...  on social media, I always felt about it that a better way of conveying information is with the distance of the time it takes to find a time to call, and actually speak with someone, or:  wow, to write a hard copy letter.  E-mail being a poor substitute.

'...and you will gladly endure the troubles which arise from being100 so much with One Who is so different from you.


O infinite goodness of my God! It is thus that I seem to see both myself and Thee. O Joy of the angels, how I long, when I think of this, to be wholly consumed in love for Thee! How true it is that Thou dost bear with those who cannot bear Thee to be with them! Oh, how good a Friend art Thou, my Lord! How Thou dost comfort us and suffer us and wait until our nature becomes more like Thine and meanwhile dost bear with it as it is! Thou dost remember the times when we love Thee, my Lord, and, when for a moment we repent, Thou dost forget how we have offended Thee. I have seen this clearly in my own life, and I cannot conceive, my Creator, why the whole world does not strive to draw near to Thee in this intimate friendship. Those of us who are wicked, and whose nature is not like Thine, ought to draw near to Thee so that Thou mayest make them good. They should allow Thee to be with them for at least two hours each day, even though they may not be with Thee, but are perplexed, as I was, with a thousand worldly cares and thoughts.'

Title: Re: Silence! Mental, Vocal Prayer, etc.
Post by: Nandarani on July 20, 2018, 04:53:23 PM
How logical St. Terese is!  See below.  She has a lot more than this to say about how she used force on herself.  And to think I couldn't even dare to pray for fear really getting it - as I now do - would take my mind away from the responsibilities on my plate and 18 not 16 hour days including the 2:30 am departure time on bike.

Not until I quit the job was the fire lit... and it took a while to memorize St. Louis de Montfort's bead by bead method which now is the mainstay of a certain type of prayer from which I benefit.  Plan to post on this particular contribution of St. Louis de Monfort later in this thread.

Oh... the true frustration of not being able to share anything of Catholicism with my students, especially the 5th and 6th graders in special education, who probably could have handled it better than the 'regular ed' group.  Except for the trad calendar posted in the classroom with a different picture for each month.

'Now if the Lord bore for so long with such a wicked creature as I -- and it is quite clear that it was in this way that all my wrong was put right -- what other person, however wicked he may be, can have any reason for fear? For, bad though he be, he will not remain so for all the years I did after having received so many favours from the Lord.'
Title: Re: Silence! Mental, Vocal Prayer, etc.
Post by: Nandarani on July 23, 2018, 12:04:30 PM
This is posted because St. Terese of Jesus is absolutely unequivocal about it, and since in my life this has been in modified form a need to know and I never did.  From earliest times, competition was difficult if not impossible for me - from the National Honor Society kudos, to being in an accelerated track - all of it was a problem very early just as special education is a problem for otherwise entirely sane and likely more sane, folks in public school. 

In any case, like the saint I was given a lot of gifts and felt miserable from the very beginning of my life pretty much always sensing there is something else to know here and not getting it of course as you can see in my background.  So, lots of adventures followed as I forced myself to participate in so many areas - thank goodness marriage was not one of them as for example, the Harvard Harvard Law son of a diplomat East Indian saw.... 'nothing will ever make you happy.'  Yes; very true. 

I also saw that everyone is on a cross and caught the existential situation dimly - . 

So... here is what the saint says and the foundation of it is understanding how much we need and how much we lack and never forgetting that.  I don't like to be happy for prolonged periods of even a little while because I always know, there is going to be a downside pretty soon - kind of like having the rug pulled out.  Lots of amazing adventures which all boil down to:  remain centered on the cross - actually looking at the face of the Veil of Veronica works well - looking at the mouth of Christ works particularly well.  It is clear he is so many things at the time that photograph was taken for which words I don't have.

So, we need to understand the following and never forget it and also be extra comfortable knowing:  all is well; don't strive; God will do it all but be sure to ask for a grace needed once you discover what it is and can name it. 

There is no modified form of learning that is not without a cost to you .... just as in special education.

'The comparison which now suggests itself to me is, I think, a good one. These joys which come through prayer are something like what the joys of Heaven must be. As the souls in Heaven see no more than the Lord wills them to see, and as this is in proportion to their merits, and they realize how small their merits are, each of them is content with the place given to him, and yet there is the very greatest difference in Heaven between one kind of fruition and another -- a difference much more marked than that between different kinds of spiritual joy on earth, though this is tremendous. When a soul is in its early stages of growth and God grants it this favour, it really thinks there is nothing more left for it to desire and counts itself well recompensed for all the service it has done Him. And it has ample reason for thinking so: a single one of these tears, which, as I say, we can cause to flow almost by ourselves (though nothing whatever can be done without God), cannot, I think, be purchased with all the labours in the world, so great is the gain which it brings us.'
Title: Re: Silence! Mental, Vocal Prayer, etc.
Post by: Nandarani on July 23, 2018, 06:24:00 PM
This is necessary too, so here it is.  But! From here on out, I mean from the end of this section on - St. Terese of Jesus writing at all under obedience only, withdraws her permission to have her name attached to anything she would write because she had been commanded to give in detail what her actual experiences were and it is here that she drew the line - while she is still living.  In fact so many people were known and living that it was not until she died that the entire book was published so The Way of Perfection was written also under obedience after her Life, to give to her sisters in her charge and it is a complete, shorter form of what the Life contains.

Follows from the last quote:

'And what greater gain is there than to have some evidence that we are pleasing God? Let anyone, then, who has arrived thus far give great praise to God and recognize how much he is in His debt. For it now seems that He wants him to be a member of His household and has chosen him for His kingdom, if he does not turn back.

Let him not trouble about certain kinds of humility, of which I propose to treat. We may think it humility not to realize that the Lord is bestowing gifts upon us. Let us understand very, very clearly, how this matter stands. God gives us these gifts for no merit of ours. Let us be grateful to His Majesty for them, for, unless we recognize that we are receiving them, we shall not be aroused to love Him. And it is a most certain thing that, if we remember all the time that we are poor, the richer we find ourselves, the greater will be the profit that comes to us and the more genuine our humility. Another mistake is for the soul to be afraid, thinking itself incapable of receiving great blessings, with the result that, when the Lord begins to grant them, it grows fearful, thinking that it is sinning through vainglory. Let us believe that, when the devil begins to tempt us about this, He Who gives us the blessings will also give us grace to realize that it is a temptation, and fortitude to resist it: I know God will do this if we walk before Him in simplicity, endeavouring to please Him alone and not men.

It is a very evident truth that we love a person most when we have a vivid remembrance of the kind actions he has done us. If, then, it is lawful, and indeed meritorious, for us to remember that it is from God that we have our being, and that He created us from nothing, and that He preserves us, and also to remember all the other benefits of His death and of the trials which He had suffered for all of us now living long before any of us was created, why should it not be lawful for me to understand, realize and consider again and again that, though once I was wont to speak of vanities, the Lord has now granted me the desire to speak only of Himself.  Here is a jewel which, when we remember that it is given us, and that indeed we already possess it, invites and constrains us to love, and all this is the blessing that comes from prayer founded on humility. What, then, will it be when we find ourselves in possession of other and more precious jewels, which some servants of God have already received, such as contempt for the world and even for themselves?  It is clear that such persons must think of themselves as still more in God's debt and under still greater obligations to serve Him. We must realize that nothing of all this comes from ourselves and acknowledge the bounteousness of the Lord, Who oa soul as poor and wretched and undeserving as mine -- for whom the first of these jewels would have been enough, and more than enough -- was pleased to bestow greater riches than I could desire.

We must seek new strength with which to serve Him, and endeavour not to be ungrateful, for that is the condition on which the Lord bestows His jewels. Unless we make good use of His treasures, and of the high estate to which He brings us, He will take these treasures back from us, and we shall be poorer than before, and His Majesty will give the jewels to some other person who can display them to advantage and to his own profit and that of others. For how can a man unaware that he is rich make good use of his riches and spend them liberally? It is impossible, I think, taking our nature into consideration, that anyone who fails to realize that he is favoured by God should have the courage necessary for doing great things. For we are so miserable and so much attracted by earthly things that only one who realizes that he holds some earnest of the joys of the next world will succeed in thoroughly abhorring and completely detaching himself from the things of this; for it is through these gifts that the Lord bestows upon us the fortitude of which our sins have deprived us. And a man is unlikely to desire the disapproval and abhorrence of all, or the other great virtues possessed by the perfect, unless he have some earnest of the love which God bears him and also a living faith. For our nature is so dead that we pursue what we see before us and so it is these very favours which awaken and strengthen faith. But it may well be that I am judging others by my wicked self, and that there may be some who need no more than the truths of the Faith to enable them to perform works of great perfection, whereas I a wretched woman, have need of everything.

Such as these must speak for themselves. I am describing my own experiences, as I have been commanded to do; if he to whom I send this does not approve of it, he will tear it up, and he will know what is wrong with it better than I. But I beseech him, for the love of the Lord, that what I have thus far said concerning my wicked life and sins be published. I give this permission, here and now, both to him and to all my confessors, of whom he who will receive this is one. If they like, they can publish it now, during my lifetime, so that I may no longer deceive the world and those who think there is some good in me. I am speaking the absolute and literal truth when I say that, as far as I understand myself at present, this will give me great comfort.  But I do not make that permission applicable to what I shall say from now onwards; if this should be shown to anyone, I do not wish it to be stated to whom it refers, whose experience it recounts or who is its author; and for that reason I do not mention myself or any one else by name.'

Title: Re: Silence! Mental, Vocal Prayer, etc.
Post by: Nandarani on July 26, 2018, 01:15:04 PM
This is an example of a woman who is extremely gifted in communication and who is effortlessly without rereading rigidly controlling her female tendency to speak and volubility.  This is very inspiring, especially for females.   She refers to herself, 'my wings droop' or something very similar but 'wings and droop' are included, at being female and of course counseled her sisters in her charge to be strong men.  She lamented any man not using his gifts to the max, and had a life long attraction to men who  did.  Men who took themselves seriously.

However clearly I may wish to describe these matters which concern prayer, they will be very obscure to anyone who has no experience of it. I shall describe certain hindrances, which, as I understand it, prevent people from making progress on this road, and also certain other sources of danger about which the Lord has taught me by experience. More recently I have discussed these things with men of great learning and persons who have led spiritual lives for many years; and they have seen that in the twenty-seven years during which I have been practicing prayer, His Majesty has given me experiences, ill as I have walked and often as I have stumbled on this road, for which others need thirty-seven, or even forty-seven, in spite of having made steady progress and practiced penitence and attained virtue. May His Majesty be blessed for everything, and may He, for His name's sake, make use of me.  For my Lord well knows that I have no other desire than this, that He may be praised and magnified a little when it is seen that on so foul and malodorous a dunghill He has planted a garden of sweet flowers. May His Majesty grant that I may not root them up through my faults and become what I was before. This I beseech Your Reverence, for love of the Lord, to beg Him for me, for you know what I am more clearly than you have permitted me to say here.
Title: Re: Silence! Mental, Vocal Prayer, etc.
Post by: Nandarani on July 30, 2018, 12:18:19 PM
To simultaneously develop another level along with St. Terese's effect, comes back The Mystical City of God to which had been listening from librivox many months ago, and looked for a pdf.  I tried to research why Timothy Duff's new English version might be best but could find no definite information - though - what made up my mind was that I checked the very beginning, the first few sentences, and saw that the 1912 version which the translator says took 15 years of hard work and reflects closely the actual original Spanish I prefer.  

I want to have an overview, now.  I am too tuned into the struggles of people on the street - want to have an overall context.  Though the very beginning of TMCG is dense, it does give a bird's eye view.  Here is part of the introduction by the translator.  This is probably understood by everybody but it is nice to see it in words.

It does seem that He prefers women for private revelation.  He chose men to reveal the great public truths of the Bible and to attend to the public teaching, but to women in the new law He seems to have consigned the task of private revelations. At least most of the known private revelations have been furnished us by women and not men. We must infer from this that they are better adapted for this work. In fact, no special learning or great natural insight is required of a messenger; such qualities might tend to corrupt or narrow down the inspired message to mere human proportions, whereas pri vate revelation is given precisely for the purpose of communicating higher truths than can be known or under stood naturally. Humility, great piety and love, deep faith are the requisites of God s special messengers.  Women as a rule are more inclined to these virtues than men, and therefore are not so apt to trim the message of God down to their own natural powers of understanding. In choosing women for his special revelations He gives us to understand from the outset, that what He wishes to reveal is above the natural faculties of perception and insight of either man or woman.
Title: Re: Silence! Mental, Vocal Prayer, etc.
Post by: Nandarani on July 30, 2018, 06:14:13 PM
No quote here.  But there are pages of choice ones from Sr. Mary of Agreda about the over 10 years she spent in resisting Our Lord, St. Michael, and a group of specifically deputed angels instructed to with 'lightest breath' illumine her intellect about the wisdom of simply obedience to make it logical in this instance like the other one - Made under obedience to accept being in charge of her convent at 25 she was assured guidance and teaching by Our Lady to handle the responsibility.  But writing was absolutely not what she wanted to do at all. 

Since this gets directly on the subject of one of the things missing from a protestant upbringing here is a list:  any born Catholic person reading can again understand what an irreplaceable gift the shambles of the Church is even now to someone who was born into it.

1.  Obedience.  In the end, no one to obey or respect because no
2.  Discussion of sin ever in any specific way using terms like venial or mortal, or a clear description of original sin's impact.
3.  No such thing as penance and associated matters - no teeth.  And most of all,

4.  No Our Lady.  That one, #4, destroys Protestantism.

We will get back to St. Terese of Jesus.   For me the Consecration to Jesus through Mary is upcoming in a few weeks.

One final thought, as so often earlier in the thread, we have marvelous instances of Our Lord working with a soul and priceless verbal evidence of same. 

In the case of Sr. Mary of Agreda one passage ends with, so 'Obey, soul!" 

In the end only obedience to her superiors did the trick but as she herself noted, after so much time resisting, her soul had evolved - and that is what happens with all of us. 

That is what gets me about those on the street and why I see my limitations:  there will not be enough time to evolve, for them, time is running out and there is too much to do.  You don't have to be on the street to fall into that category - there are many here who simply do not have information about the truth.  Plenty of Christians who while possessing faith, lack so much else in the way of refinement and certainly do not trust, because cannot conceive of, the accessible even if inaccessible, truths that so support life, and prayer.  Remembering the Episcopal Church as I knew it, prayer was.... not common even though we had the beautiful Book of Common Prayer.

Outlook was material, not spiritual.  That one thing enormously influenced my state of ongoing 'angst.'  Though, I didn't see it for what it was until later and several lifetimes of adventures.
Title: Re: Silence! Mental, Vocal Prayer, etc.
Post by: Nandarani on January 04, 2019, 09:02:31 PM
Happy New Year everyone.  I'm reading a book now by Fr. de Caussade who wrote in the 18th century - Abandonment to Divine Providence, and after the book are included many letters he wrote in the way of spiritual direction to sisters of the Visitation near whom he lived.   See if this is the way you live inside; it quite probably is!  Not limited to sisters; advantageous for Everybody.  https://www.ccel.org/ccel/decaussade/abandonment (https://www.ccel.org/ccel/decaussade/abandonment) scroll down and see the formats including audio, online, pdf.

Here is the first letter. 

SPIRITUAL COUNSELS OF FR. DE CAUSSADE, see Abandonment to Divine Providence (book by Fr. Caussade)

I.—Conformity to the Will of God.
Written in 1731 to Sister Marie-Thérèse de Voiménil, in the 9th year of her profession, and the 28th of her age.  For the attainment of perfect conformity to the will of God.  [...is the first of many letters to Visitation Sisters and the only one I have read so far; it so impressed me.  He became the spiritual director to several when he lived near them.  Fr. Caussade gradually went blind and used his understanding to help him deal with this one may be sure.]


1st. At the beginning of each day, and of meditation, Mass, and Communion, declare to God that you desire to belong to Him entirely, and that you will devote yourself wholly to acquiring the spirit of prayer and of the interior life.
2nd. Make it your chief study to conform yourself to the will of God even in the smallest things, saying in the midst of the most annoying contradictions and with the most alarming prospects for the future: “My God, I desire with all my heart to do Your holy will, I submit in all things and absolutely to Your good pleasure for time and eternity; and I wish to do this, Oh my God, for two reasons; first: because You are my Sovereign Lord and it is but just that Your will should be accomplished; secondly: because I am convinced by faith, and by experience that Your will is in all things as good and beneficent as it is just and adorable, while my own desires are always blind and corrupt; blind, because I know not what I ought to desire or to avoid; corrupt, because I
nearly always long for what would do me harm. Therefore, from henceforth, I renounce my own will to follow Yours in all things; dispose of me, Oh my God, according to Your good will and pleasure.”
3rd. This continual practice of submission will preserve that interior peace which is the foundation of the spiritual life, and will prevent you from worrying about your faults and failings.  You will put up with them instead, with a humble and quiet submission which is more likely to cure them than an uneasy distress, only calculated to weaken and discourage you.
4th. Think no more about the past but only of the present and future. Do not trouble about your confessions, but accuse yourself simply of those faults you can remember after seven or eight minutes examen. It is a good thing to add to the accusation a more serious sin of your past life. This will cause you to make a more fervent act of contrition and dispose you to receive more abundantly the grace of the Sacrament. You should not make too many efforts to get rid of the obstacles which make frequent confession disagreeable to you.
5th. To escape the distress caused by regret for the past or fear about the future, this is the rule to follow: leave the past to the infinite mercy of God, the future to His good Providence, give the present wholly to His love by
being faithful to His grace.
6th. When God in His goodness sends you some disappointment, one of those trials that used to annoy you so much; before all thank Him for it as for a great favour all the more useful for the great work of your perfection in that it completely overturns the work of the moment.
7th. Try, in spite of interior dislike, to show a kind face to troublesome people, or to those who come to chatter about their troubles; leave at once prayer, reading, choir office, in fact anything, to go where Providence calls you; and do what is asked of you quietly, peacefully, without hurry, and without vexation.
8th. Should you fail in any of these points, make immediately an act of interior humility—not that sort of humility full of uneasiness and irritation against which St. Francis of Sales said so much, but a humility that is gentle, peaceful, and sweet. This is a matter essential for overcoming your self-will, and to prevent you becoming a slave to your exterior or interior devotion.
9th. We must understand that we can never acquire true conformity to the will of God until we are perfectly resolved to serve Him according to His will and pleasure and not to please ourselves. In everything look to God, and you will find Him everywhere, but more especially where you have most completely renounced yourself. When you are thoroughly convinced that of yourself you are incapable of doing any good, you will give up making resolutions but will humbly confess to God: “My God, I acknowledge after many trials that all my resolutions are useless. Doubtless I have hitherto depended too much on myself, but You have abased me. 
You alone can do all things; make me then, do such and such a thing, and give me, when necessary, the recollection, energy and strength of will that I require. Without this, I know from my former sad experiences, I shall never do anything.”
10th. To this humble prayer add the practice of begging pardon at once or as soon as possible of all those who witnessed any of your little impetuosities or outbursts of temper. It is most important for you to practise these counsels for two reasons: first, because God desires to do everything in you Himself; secondly, on account of a secret presumption, which, even in the midst of so many miseries, prevents you referring everything to God, until you have experienced a thousand times how absolutely incapable you are of performing any good. When you become thoroughly convinced of this truth you will exclaim almost without reflexion, when you act rightly, “Oh my God it is You who do this in me by your grace.” And when You do wrong: “This is just like me! I see myself as I am.” Then will God be glorified in all your actions, because He will be proved to be the sole author of all that is good. This is your path; all the misery and humiliation you must take on yourself, and render to God the glory and thanks that are His due. All the glory to Him, but all the profit to you. You would be very foolish not to accept with gratitude a share so just and so advantageous.