TG is in the most awful state for workers rights, I wish I knew someone in the Northeast who could find him a different position.

Quote from: Tiffany

Quote from: Dolores

Quote from: Traditional Guy 20

Those corporate bastards I work for are making me work this Sunday to make up for Thanksgiving and New Year's Day so they don't have to pay me overtime!

Corporations are immoral behemoths!

Pardon my ignorance, but how does forcing you to work extra hours avoid overtime?

might be work on those holidays or scheduled with the day off as holidays,  pays time and a half or holiday pay so he is working Sunday instead.

If true, his state must have very labor-friendly, and unusual, overtime laws.  Both federal law, and the law of most states, only require overtime for time worked in excess of 40 hours per week.  Work on holidays doesn't entitle the worker to anything other then his normal wage.

No his state is awful for worker's rights. It might just be the co policy,

If true, his state must have very labor-friendly...

Here let me change something for you: "If true his state must be very business-friendly and is all for business rights..."

I misunderstood your first post.  It is true, in order to get overtime, you have to actually work more than 40 hours, not just be paid for more than 40 hours.  Like you said, holiday and vacation time don't count.  Sorry you have to work on Sunday.

It is alright. I want to make clear that I am not against business per se, but these large corporations and Big Businesses have too much of a stranglehold on our economy and politics. It used to be that anti-trust laws were created to break up large companies but these days companies like Wal-Mart are given the golden rug in American politics.

Now small business on the other hand I have very few problems against (besides luring women into the workplace) and I support small businesses.

Catholic theology when it comes to the practice of labor and capital says that the worker must be given time off for his religious observances and must be paid a wage high enough to live on.

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It's true that Thanksgiving isn't a Holy Day, but it IS an American "holiday" where people take time off work to spend time with family.

It just seems like the force of commercialization marches on, constantly pushing the boundaries.

It's undeniable.

I heard reports of two major retail stores who had said to their employees
they were going to have Thanksgiving Day off, but just a month or two
ahead (during October) they changed that telling them they're going to be
expected to show up for work at 6:00 or 7:00 pm on November 28th,
Thanksgiving Day.

It's hard to imaging that there won't be a rising sentiment of discontent
among workers this year because of this.  

I suggest that all of us go out that day and visit as many such stores
as possible and go around talking to the floor help, to console them
for their inconvenience on Thanksgiving Day evening.  

There could be no better way to counter this, with short notice, other
than picketing the stores.  

We could go in the stores and just cheer up the workers, telling them that
we really appreciate their sacrifice, and that this is really dumb for the
store to be open like this.  AND WE SHOULD NOT BUY ANYTHING.  

The employees cannot get in trouble for speaking to a customer for a few
seconds, because that's what they are on the floor to do:  customer
service.  Just don't keep them for more than about 10 or 15 seconds.  
For the managers could get a bit ticked if the sales people talk for 5 or
10 minutes to a customer who isn't buying something.  

And it would also help to put a word in to the managers and assistant
managers, telling them that this really upsets us and we're not here to
buy anything today, and we're going to be taking our business to good
stores that did NOT open doors on Thanksgiving Day.  

The management needs to hear that.

To give you an example of concrete progress they have made: Just in 2013 companies started having Black Friday deals throughout the whole month of November.

I can say accurately that as of right now, the Christmas shopping season starts the day after Halloween, or November 1st. They might have a hard time getting it to start before Halloween (let's face it -- the ambiances of Halloween and Christmas are pretty much opposites!),

A few years ago, they tried to crack that nut with "The Nightmare Before
Christmas" but it wasn't all that successful.  I get a hunch though, that it
might be making a second run before long.  At Disneyland, they re-did the
whole Haunted Mansion ride to import "Nightmare" characters and themes.
It was the sloppiest job for a makeover of any Disneyland attraction, ever.
The original Haunted Mansion was far more effective.  

but I have seen Christmas stuff in some stores as early as September.

At local stores here a week before Halloween, the Christmas decoration
supplies were on the third sets of shelves behind the front rows when
you first enter the store, such that the first 3 rows were Halloween, then
the next 2 rows were Christmas.  They figured that the MESS from frantic
shoppers would be confined to the front of the store, then when Nov. 1st
at daybreak hits, the shelf crew would clear out the Halloween stuff and
move the Christmas items up to the front shelves by noon pretty much.

They'd only leave a quarter of the front row for clearance Halloween
items, and all the clearance candy would be on islands that you have to
walk AROUND to get into the store, that way you don't miss the candy
when you come in.

It's like every store is in a hurry to be the first one to have the next
season's stuff up, because there are early bird shoppers who just can't
bear the thought of being the second person on the block to have their
new load of junk for the next big holiday.  It's just nuts.  

There are shoppers who are hitting the shops on All Saints' Day to be
the most 'cutting edge' guy in town for Christmas decorations.  They want
the most impressive items, whatever they are, so they won't be stuck
having to be embarrassed saying "I wanted one of those too but they
were all sold out by the time I got to the store."  

No, their goal is to have this line:  "I got the first on off the shelf and boy
was I happy because there was a lineup of people behind me all ready
to grab the last ones. By the time I got to the checkout stand they were
already fighting over who gets which box 'cause the store was running
out."  

It's every man-child for himself.  

You know, you could replace "Thanksgiving" with "Sunday", "family" with "God", and "holiday" with "day of rest".

And that would be:  

"Because I believe in God, I pledge to not shop on Sunday.  
If I'm shopping, someone else is working and not spending
time with their God.  
Everyone deserves a day of rest."

Correct? (Making a pledge to not shop on Sunday is more specific
than to say you pledge not to shop on Sunday.  The latter
means that you do not pledge that you will shop on Sunday.  It's a like
saying you do not promise that you will drive drunk, instead of promising
that you will not drive drunk.)

All those businesses trying to have a 3 month "Christmas" season need to take a few minutes to read the classic tale, "Christmas Every Day":

http://www.classicreader.com/book/3743/1/

I think they could learn a lot about the concept of "too much of a good thing", etc.

For example, I note that most people grow weary of Christmas music after about 30 days of listening to it.

Every year, by the time we get to a WEEK before Christmas, I hear people
at random in shopping malls and restaurants muttering how sick they are
of Christmas.  I even hear it on the radio.  They seem to be pushing the
lead like they want to be the first broadcaster to announce on their show
that they're tired of "Joy to the World" and "Jingle Bells" -- it's the same
ravenous greed again, wanting to be the first one on the block.  They don't
want to be criticized for being a 'downer', but even that they can play up
with stupid banter between announcers like, "Oh, you're such a holiday
drag!  Where's your spirit?"

"I'm not going to fake it this year!  I'm sick of Christmas!  This is the 30th
day in a row that I've heard 'Hark the Harold Angels Sing'!"  

It's all for show.  Whatever gets listeners to tune in.  And when more
listeners tune in the station's ratings go up, and the program director makes
new rules.  Rules like "Christmas starts earlier next year."  

Keep in mind that Chanukah this year starts on Nov. 27th, so our "elder
brothers" in the Christmas merchandising business are going to be ALL
DONE with the "holiday celebrations" by December 5th, in 2013.

So if you fire up the Christmas music on Thanksgiving, then you'll be sick of it by ...about Christmas Day. Diabolical!

In our Catholic homes we should be aware that the Season of Advent
has its own music.  From Sunday, December 1st to Tuesday, Dec. 24th
this year, is the Season of Advent, and it's time for Advent music.  We
should never play Christmas music until Christmas Day!  

When we wait until the Nativity of Our Lord to start having Christmas,
then we can continue it all through the Christmas season, which goes
all the way until Candlemas Day, February 2nd, the Feast of the
Purification and the Presentation of Our Lord in the Temple.  

And no, it's not "Groundhog Day," unless you're a Freemason.  That
was a Freemason smokescreen set up to obscure the triple Catholic
Feast Day and the end of the Christmas Season.  Instead of recalling
the Feast of the Presentation, the prophesy of St. Anna and St. Simeon,
Freemasons run out into the woods and stare at a hole in the ground,
because they don't know the difference between that and, well, never
mind.

To me, Thanksgiving has become a 100% secular holiday.  Nevertheless, and regardless of its origins, it is still a major US holiday wherein most people don't work and spend time with their families.  In my opinion, regardless of whether this family time is for a holiday or a holyday, it is something that should not be disturbed by employers for a few extra hours of revenue.