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Author Topic: Saints Who Fell From Grace?  (Read 1669 times)

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Offline Miser Peccator

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Saints Who Fell From Grace?
« on: October 12, 2021, 04:59:27 PM »
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    • Are there any examples of saints who fell from grace or continued to struggle with sin after their conversion?

    It seems like they had a moment of conversion and then never sinned again, at least not mortal sin.

    They talk about the temptations that beset them but it appears they never gave in.

    Are there any saints who fell from grace later in their life but repented?
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    Offline DigitalLogos

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    Re: Saints Who Fell From Grace?
    « Reply #1 on: October 12, 2021, 06:46:22 PM »
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    • Of course. They were still human like the rest of us, with their own temptations and sins. They became Saints because of how they handled their temptations.

    Recall that St. Paul would often complain about temptations of the flesh in his epistles.
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    "Be not therefore solicitous for tomorrow; for the morrow will be solicitous for itself. Sufficient for the day is the evil thereof." [Matt. 6:34]

    "In all thy works remember thy last end, and thou shalt never sin." [Ecclus. 7:40]

    "A holy man continueth in wisdom as the sun: but a fool is changed as the moon." [Ecclus. 27:12]

    Offline DustyActual

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    Re: Saints Who Fell From Grace?
    « Reply #2 on: October 12, 2021, 07:19:28 PM »
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    • Yes, Saint John of God is one saint who kept falling into sin but he was repentant.
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    Offline Nadir

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    Re: Saints Who Fell From Grace?
    « Reply #3 on: October 12, 2021, 11:32:56 PM »
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    • Blessed Anthony Neyrot

    275px-Anthonyneyrot
    Blessed Anthony Neyrot occupies a unique place in Dominican history, as he is the only one among the beautified who ever renounced the faith. He expiated his sin with an act of heroism that merited heaven, washing away in his own blood the denial that might have cost him his soul.

    Of the childhood of Blessed Anthony, we know nothing that he was born at Rivoli, in Italy. He was accepted into the Order by Saint Antoninus, who must have been particularly fond of the young man, since he gave him his own name. Completing his studies, Anthony was ordained and lived for a time at San Marco, the famous Dominican convent in Florence. Then, becoming restless and dissatisfied, he asked for a change of mission. He was sent to Sicily, but this did not prove to his liking either so he set out for Naples.

    Brother Anthony was sailing from Sicily to Naples when pirates captured the ship. Anthony was taken to Tunis and sold as a slave. He was able to win his freedom, but fell away from the Church. He denied his faith in Jesus and abandoned his religious vocation. He accepted the Koran, the diabolical book of the Muslims. For several months, he practiced the Muslim religion. He also married.

    In the meantime, his former Dominican prior, the saintly Antoninus, died. This led Anthony to have a shocking experience. It seems that one night, Anthony had something like a dream. St. Antoninus appeared to him. The conversation between the two men was to lead to a radical change in Anthony. He became truly sorry for having betrayed the Lord. He knew that in his heart he could never give up his faith in Jesus. He knew that he could only be a Catholic. And he realized that he still wanted very much to be a Dominican brother.

    Blessed Anthony sent his wife back to her family. He then put on his white Dominican habit. In spite of his fear, he went to see the ruler of Tunis. A large crowd gathered and the ruler came out to the courtyard. Brother Anthony publicly admitted he had made a terrible mistake becoming a Muslim. He was a Catholic. He believed in and loved Jesus. He was a Dominican and wanted to be so for all his life. The ruler was angry. He threatened and then made promises of rewards if only Anthony would take back what he was saying. But Anthony would not. He knew this meant his death.

    Anthony knelt and began to pray for the courage to give his life for Jesus. Suddenly he felt the large stones pounding him. He just kept praying for the strength to remain true to the Lord. Then he lost consciousness. Anthony died a martyr in 1460. Some merchants from Genoa, Italy, took his remains back to his own country.

    Born: 1420
    Died: Martyred on Holy Thursday, 1460
    https://orderofpreachersindependent.org/2015/04/10/blessed-anthony-neyrot/
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    Offline xavierpope

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    Re: Saints Who Fell From Grace?
    « Reply #4 on: October 13, 2021, 06:04:13 AM »
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    • Didn't Saint Augustine say " make me pure but not yet"

    St Peter denied Christ three times 
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    Offline The Mrs

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    Re: Saints Who Fell From Grace?
    « Reply #5 on: October 13, 2021, 08:17:42 AM »
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    • I wonder if your question has more to do with desiring to hear how the saints overcame their predominant faults because I’ve often wondered the same thing and one interesting book you may want to read is called, The Family that Overtook Christ.  It’s about the family of St Bernard.  Everyone in that family are saints or at least venerable.  It’s an very captivating book. Certain members of the family had their natural weaknesses of temperament on display and it’s very interesting to see how they prayed and sought after virtue to conquer their faults.  They weren’t grave faults though.  But if you are anything like me, I find inspiration from seeing the saints pick themselves back up and becoming stronger than before.  
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    Offline The Mrs

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    Re: Saints Who Fell From Grace?
    « Reply #6 on: October 13, 2021, 08:20:52 AM »
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    • I have also heard from a priest that it took St Frances de Sales 19 years to conquer his natural inclination to anger.  He said that he read that in a book but couldn’t recall the name of the book.  If anyone knows, I would love to know the title of the book so I can read it.  
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    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Saints Who Fell From Grace?
    « Reply #7 on: October 13, 2021, 08:48:33 AM »
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    • Quote from: The Mrs on October 13, 2021, 08:20:52 AM
    I have also heard from a priest that it took St Frances de Sales 19 years to conquer his natural inclination to anger.  He said that he read that in a book but couldn’t recall the name of the book.  If anyone knows, I would love to know the title of the book so I can read it. 

    St. Jerome also struggled with anger most of his life.  Despite what Father Pfeiffer would say, it's actually the case that those who have largely overcome concupiscence tend to be more afflicted with temptations toward anger.
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    Offline DigitalLogos

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    Re: Saints Who Fell From Grace?
    « Reply #8 on: October 13, 2021, 08:49:38 AM »
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    • Quote from: Ladislaus on October 13, 2021, 08:48:33 AM
    St. Jerome also struggled with anger most of his life.  Despite what Father Pfeiffer would say, it's actually the case that those who have largely overcome concupiscence tend to be more afflicted with temptations toward anger.
    I can confirm this personally. Once I broke the porn addiction, anger became my vice. It's been a harsh struggle.
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    "Be not therefore solicitous for tomorrow; for the morrow will be solicitous for itself. Sufficient for the day is the evil thereof." [Matt. 6:34]

    "In all thy works remember thy last end, and thou shalt never sin." [Ecclus. 7:40]

    "A holy man continueth in wisdom as the sun: but a fool is changed as the moon." [Ecclus. 27:12]

    Offline aegis

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    Re: Saints Who Fell From Grace?
    « Reply #9 on: October 13, 2021, 10:15:01 AM »
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    • Quote from: DigitalLogos on October 13, 2021, 08:49:38 AM
    I can confirm this personally. Once I broke the porn addiction, anger became my vice. It's been a harsh struggle.
    Me too. Since I stopped with porn and other practices concerning the 6th Commandment, I've been more and more wrathful. And man, anger is hard to control sometimes. Especially when you're in a place where you're persecuted for being catholic.
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    Offline Todd The Trad

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    Re: Saints Who Fell From Grace?
    « Reply #10 on: October 13, 2021, 10:43:58 AM »
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    • I also have a problem with anger, and pride too. The crisis in the church tempts me to explode quite often. Please pray that the Lord and our Blessed Mother will help me, and whomever else struggles with anger, to control and eradicate this vice (sinful anger). Although I believe that anger is a good thing in and of itself(righteous anger), like anything it can be abused and lead to other problems, like in my case. It has lead me to bitterness, rage and hatefulness. Certainly beyond just righteous anger. I'm going to start asking Saints Frances De Sales and Jerome for their intercession.  
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    Offline Ascetik

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    Re: Saints Who Fell From Grace?
    « Reply #11 on: October 13, 2021, 11:21:34 AM »
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    • Pretty sure according to St. Teresa of Avila and St. John of the Cross, once you reach the unitive way (divine union, transforming union) after the illuminative way, that you no longer commit any sin whatsoever and will not commit one. You just commit imperfections at that point because your will is locked in grace so to speak, but until you reach this level of perfection it is still entirely possible to commit mortal sin.
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    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Saints Who Fell From Grace?
    « Reply #12 on: October 13, 2021, 12:05:22 PM »
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    • Quote from: Ascetik on October 13, 2021, 11:21:34 AM
    Pretty sure according to St. Teresa of Avila and St. John of the Cross, once you reach the unitive way (divine union, transforming union) after the illuminative way, that you no longer commit any sin whatsoever and will not commit one. You just commit imperfections at that point because your will is locked in grace so to speak, but until you reach this level of perfection it is still entirely possible to commit mortal sin.

    Perhaps, but it's still possible for someone to recede from the unitive way.  I don't believe anyone apart from Our Lord and Our Lady is "confirmed in grace" ... except the tradition is that the Apostles were after Pentecost.  Otherwise, the grace of perseverance would not be a distinct grace, as Trent taught.
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    Offline Matto

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    Re: Saints Who Fell From Grace?
    « Reply #13 on: October 13, 2021, 12:12:12 PM »
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    • Quote from: aegis on October 13, 2021, 10:15:01 AM
    Me too. Since I stopped with porn and other practices concerning the 6th Commandment, I've been more and more wrathful.
    Interesting. Because Bishop Pfeiffer says the opposite. That such sins are the cause of anger (road rage).
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    Offline Ascetik

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    Re: Saints Who Fell From Grace?
    « Reply #14 on: October 13, 2021, 12:14:59 PM »
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    • Quote from: Ladislaus on October 13, 2021, 12:05:22 PM
    Perhaps, but it's still possible for someone to recede from the unitive way.  I don't believe anyone apart from Our Lord and Our Lady is "confirmed in grace" ... except the tradition is that the Apostles were after Pentecost.  Otherwise, the grace of perseverance would not be a distinct grace, as Trent taught.
    I've never heard of any saint coming out of the unitive way, especially not the transforming union, but I'd be open to hearing it.
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