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Traditional Catholic Faith => Catholic Living in the Modern World => Topic started by: Capt McQuigg on July 17, 2012, 12:30:49 PM

Title: Rosary Rings - Are the Indulgences to be gained?
Post by: Capt McQuigg on July 17, 2012, 12:30:49 PM
A rosary ring, if blessed by a Trad Priest, does it retain the indulgences that are available for the traditional bead rosary?
Title: Rosary Rings - Are the Indulgences to be gained?
Post by: rowsofvoices9 on July 17, 2012, 12:42:16 PM
I don't see why not.  It's the prayer itself that's indulgenced.  You gain another indulgence by using sacramentals.
Title: Rosary Rings - Are the Indulgences to be gained?
Post by: Capt McQuigg on July 17, 2012, 12:47:55 PM
Quote from: rowsofvoices9
I don't see why not.  It's the prayer itself that's indulgenced.  You gain another indulgence by using sacramentals.


I've read that you gain indulgences by praying the rosary IF you are actually holding a rosary.  Not that it would be a bad thing otherwise.  
Title: Rosary Rings - Are the Indulgences to be gained?
Post by: Capt McQuigg on July 17, 2012, 12:57:53 PM
I sometimes use a rosary ring and it comes in handy while driving.  However, if I'm missing out on indulgences by doing so, please let me know.  
Title: Rosary Rings - Are the Indulgences to be gained?
Post by: rowsofvoices9 on July 17, 2012, 12:58:06 PM
Quote from: Capt McQuigg
Quote from: rowsofvoices9
I don't see why not.  It's the prayer itself that's indulgenced.  You gain another indulgence by using sacramentals.


I've read that you gain indulgences by praying the rosary IF you are actually holding a rosary.  Not that it would be a bad thing otherwise.  


That's not correct.  You can use your fingers to pray the rosary and still gain an indulgence.  If you use rosary beads you actually gain two separate indulgences.  I also don't see why blessed rosary ring wouldn't be considered a sacramental.  
Title: Rosary Rings - Are the Indulgences to be gained?
Post by: Capt McQuigg on July 17, 2012, 01:56:16 PM
Quote from: rowsofvoices9
Quote from: Capt McQuigg
Quote from: rowsofvoices9
I don't see why not.  It's the prayer itself that's indulgenced.  You gain another indulgence by using sacramentals.


I've read that you gain indulgences by praying the rosary IF you are actually holding a rosary.  Not that it would be a bad thing otherwise.  


That's not correct.  You can use your fingers to pray the rosary and still gain an indulgence.  If you use rosary beads you actually gain two separate indulgences.  I also don't see why blessed rosary ring wouldn't be considered a sacramental.  


Maybe I am incorrect but I do remember reading somewhere that if you pray the rosary with just your fingers, you do not gain the indulgences.

Title: Rosary Rings - Are the Indulgences to be gained?
Post by: s2srea on July 17, 2012, 02:03:42 PM
Quote from: Capt McQuigg
Quote from: rowsofvoices9
Quote from: Capt McQuigg
Quote from: rowsofvoices9
I don't see why not.  It's the prayer itself that's indulgenced.  You gain another indulgence by using sacramentals.


I've read that you gain indulgences by praying the rosary IF you are actually holding a rosary.  Not that it would be a bad thing otherwise.  


That's not correct.  You can use your fingers to pray the rosary and still gain an indulgence.  If you use rosary beads you actually gain two separate indulgences.  I also don't see why blessed rosary ring wouldn't be considered a sacramental.  


Maybe I am incorrect but I do remember reading somewhere that if you pray the rosary with just your fingers, you do not gain the indulgences.



This is correct.
Title: Rosary Rings - Are the Indulgences to be gained?
Post by: Roman55 on July 17, 2012, 02:06:40 PM
If the day ever comes that all metal detectors and 'one world goons' come to take our rosary's, ring rosaries and the like, I will have my fingers to pray the rosary on and will ask for the same indulgences.  It seems to me I remember it said that ring rosaries will gain the same indulgences as it may be more conducive in UN-practical situations where one can use one's time wisely; such as driving etc.  
Title: Rosary Rings - Are the Indulgences to be gained?
Post by: rowsofvoices9 on July 17, 2012, 02:09:53 PM
I've never heard that you absolutely must use a rosary in order to gain an indulgence.  If you don't want to take my advice, ask your priest.  I'm sure he'll tell you the same thing I'm saying.  FYI I'm posting the list of prayers and works for which one can gain indulgences.  Nowhere does it indicate that you can't gain an indulgence if you don't use rosary beads.  The important thing is that you recite the rosary.  What about persecuted Catholics such as those behind the iron curtain or those in nαzι cσncєnтrαтισn cαмρs, do you think they always had a rosary?  They probably would have been tortured and killed if they were caught with one.

Enchiridion of Indulgences (1968)

The contents of this docuмent are taken from the Enchiridion of Indulgences given by the 1968 Decree of the Sacred Apostolic Penitentiary. Note the norms on indulgences. A convenient summary of which are plenary indulgences are also available here.

PARTICULAR GRANTS
Direct, we beg you, O Lord (Actiones nostras)
Acts of the Theological Virtues and of Contrition (Actus virtutum theologalium et contritionis)
Adoration of the Most Blessed Sacrament (Adoratio Ss.mi Sacramenti)
Hidden God (Adoro te devote)
We have come (Adsumus)
To you, O blessed Joseph (Ad te, beate Ioseph)
We give you thanks (Agimus tibi gratias)
Angel of God (Angele Dei)
The Angel of the Lord (Angelus Domini)
Soul of Christ (Anima Christi)
Visit to the Patriarchal Basilicas in Rome (Basilicarum Patriarchalium in Urbe visitatio)
Papal Blessing (Benedictio Papalis)
Visit to a Cemetery (Coemeterii visitatio)
Visit to an early Christian Cemetery or 'catacomb' (Coemeterii veterum christianorum seu 'catacuмbae' visitatio)
Act of Spiritual Communion (Communionis spiritualis actus)
I believe in God (Credo in Deum)
Adoration of the Cross (Crucis Adoratio)
Office of the Dead (Defunctorum officium)
Out of the Depths (De profundis)
Christian Doctrine (Doctrina christiana)
Lord God Almighty (Domine, Deus omnipotens)
Look down upon me, good and gentle Jesus (En ego, o bone et dulcissime Iesu)
Eucharistic Congress (Eucharisticus conventus)
Hear us (Exaudi nos)
Spiritual Exercises (Exercitia spiritualia)
Most sweet Jesus -- Act of Reparation (Iesu dulcissime - Reparationis actus)
Most sweet Jesus, Redeemer -- Act of Dedication of the Human Race to Jesus Christ King (Iesu dulcissime, Redemptor)
The Moment of Death (In articulo mortis)

The Following Litanies (Litaniae) [all with partial indulgences]

the Most Holy Name of Jesus,

the Most Sacred Heart of Jesus,

the Most Precious Blood of Jesus,

the Blessed Virgin Mary,

St. Joseph,

All Saints.

Magnificat (Magnificat)
Mary, Mother of Grace (Maria, Mater gratiae)
Remember, O most gracious Virgin Mary (Memorare, o piissima Virgo Maria)
Have mercy on me (Miserere)
Novena Devotions (Novendiales preces)
Use of Articles of Devotion (Obiectorum pietatis usus)
Little Offices (Officia parva)
Prayer for Sacerdotal or Religious Vocations (Oratio ad sacerdotales vel religiosas vocationes impetrandas)
Mental Prayer (Oratio mentalis)
Let us pray for our Sovereign Pontiff (Oremus pro Pontifice)
O Sacred Banquet (O sacrum convivium)
Assistance at Sacred Preaching (Praedicationis sacrae participatio)
First Communion (Prima Communio)
First Mass of newly-ordained Priests (Prima Missa neosacerdotum)
Prayer for Unity of the Church (Pro unitate Ecclesiae oratio)
Monthly Recollection (Recollectio menstrua)
Eternal Rest (Requiem aeternam)
May it please you, O Lord (Retribuere dignare, Domine)
Recitation of the Marian Rosary (Rosarii marialis recitatio)
Jubilees of Sacerdotal Ordination (Sacerdotalis Ordinationis celebrationes iubilares)
Reading of Sacred Scripture (Sacrae Scripturae lectio)
Hail, holy Queen (Salve, Regina)
Holy Mary, help the helpless (Sancta Maria, succurre miseris)
Holy Apostles Peter and Paul (Sancti Apostoli Petre et Paule)
Veneration of the Saints (Sanctorum cultus)
Sign of the Cross (Signum crucis)
A Visit to the Stational Churches of Rome (Stationalium Ecclesiarum Urbis visitatio)
We fly to your Patronage (Sub tuum praesidium)
Diocesan Synod (Synodus dioecesana)
Down in adoration falling (Tantum ergo)
The Te Deum (Te Deum)
Come, Holy Spirit, Creator blest (Veni, Creator)
Come, Holy Spirit (Veni, Sancte Spiritus)
Exercise of the Way of the Cross (Viae Crucis exercitium)
Visit, we beg you, O Lord (Visita, quaesumus, Domine)
Visit to the Parochial Church (Visitatio ecclesiae paroecialis)
Visit to a Church or an Altar on the day of its consecration (Visitatio ecclesiae vel altaris die consecrationis)
Visit to a Church or Oratory on All Souls Day (Visitatio ecclesiae vel oratorii in Commemoratione omnium fidelium defunctorum)
Visit to a Church or Oratory of Religious on the Feast of the Holy Founder (Visitatio ecclesiae vel oratorii Religiosorum die festo Sancti Fundatoris)
Pastoral Visitation (Visitatio pastoralis)
Renewal of Baptismal Promises (Votorum baptismalium renovatio)
Portiuncula Indulgence  

Decree of the Sacred Apostolic Penitentiary issuing the Enchiridion of Indulgences on 29 June 1968. See also the:

Norms on Indulgences,

Three General Grants of Indulgences

Forward

First General Grant

Second General Grant

Third General Grant Foreward

Other Grants of Indulgences

Apostolic Constitution on The Doctrine of Indulgences - 1 January 1967 by pope Paul VI.

Pious Invocations in Use

http://www.ourladyswarriors.org/
Title: Rosary Rings - Are the Indulgences to be gained?
Post by: s2srea on July 17, 2012, 02:16:45 PM
You were right ROV; there are indulgences to be gained without beads, however there are, apparently, many many more to be gained with:

Quote from: Hobbledehoy
Remember, the indulgences mentioned in the 1950 typical edition of the Enchiridion Indulgentiarum (nos. 395-398) for the recitation of the Holy Rosary do not necessitate the actual use of the Rosary beads, as they are given for the Paters and Aves recited whilst meditating upon the sacred Mysteries. [HOWEVER] The use of the Rosaries blessed with the appropriate blessing found in the Roman Ritual have many, many, many, many indulgences attached to them: so many that the Raccolta does not enumerate them.

However, it is ever decorous and edifying (and spiritually safer) to have a Rosary with you, not only when saying the Rosary, but on your person wheresoever you go. It is always feasible to carry a small Rosary, or one linked with woven and sturdy string instead of metal chains that can break easily, in one's pocket, and have others for your vehicle, work (if you work at an office or some other stable locality), and some to give to others when the occasion arises (you never know).

Title: Rosary Rings - Are the Indulgences to be gained?
Post by: Capt McQuigg on July 17, 2012, 02:18:24 PM
Quote from: rowsofvoices9
If you don't want to take my advice, ask your priest.  I'm sure he'll tell you the same thing I'm saying.  


There are rules for attaining indulgences, in addition to doing a certain action there are criteria to be met.  Under the usual conditions.  
Title: Rosary Rings - Are the Indulgences to be gained?
Post by: songbird on July 17, 2012, 05:55:38 PM
Question:  When did the ring rosary begin?  We see Our Lady with a "rosary".  
Title: Rosary Rings - Are the Indulgences to be gained?
Post by: Roman55 on July 17, 2012, 07:40:21 PM
Quote from: songbird
Question:  When did the ring rosary begin?  We see Our Lady with a "rosary".  


I've looked high and low for an answer to this, but to no avail.  Anyone else?
Title: Rosary Rings - Are the Indulgences to be gained?
Post by: Philomena on July 17, 2012, 07:51:54 PM
Quote from: Roman55
Quote from: songbird
Question:  When did the ring rosary begin?  We see Our Lady with a "rosary".  


I've looked high and low for an answer to this, but to no avail.  Anyone else?


There is an early 16th c. one in the Victoria and Albert Museum.  

Then what about the Franciscan Rosary, certainly different than a traditional 5 decade one?  I don't think it has to necessarily be a Rosary with the five decades to receive indulgence.  We can pray using a Franciscan, traditional, or even a decade Rosary which many do while driving or walking.  Of course those prayers still have merit if prayed with piety!  HOW we pray is more important than to put the emphasis on whether we use a traditional Rosary, or a decade Rosary.
Title: Rosary Rings - Are the Indulgences to be gained?
Post by: Hobbledehoy on July 17, 2012, 08:30:30 PM
This precise question had been answered long ago in a query submitted to the Irish Ecclesiastical Record, found in the tome Problems in the Liturgy by Rev. Fr. Gerard Montague (Westminster, MD: The Newman Press, 1958).


(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d89/platonic123/Sacred%20Texts/More%20Sacred%20Texts/RosaryRings1.jpg)

(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d89/platonic123/Sacred%20Texts/More%20Sacred%20Texts/RosaryRings2.jpg)
Title: Rosary Rings - Are the Indulgences to be gained?
Post by: Roman55 on July 17, 2012, 08:42:57 PM
Philomena and Hobbledehoy are the 'go to resources' here!  Way to go!  :cool:
Thank You
Title: Rosary Rings - Are the Indulgences to be gained?
Post by: Hobbledehoy on July 17, 2012, 11:59:56 PM
Right before the question of the Rosary Rings, a query submitted to the Irish Ecclesiastical Record regarding string Rosaries or single-decade Rosaries is found in the above-mentioned tome Problems in the Liturgy by Rev. Fr. Gerard Montague (Westminster, MD: The Newman Press, 1958). As it has some bearing on this discussion, I thought it best to post it.


(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d89/platonic123/Sacred%20Texts/More%20Sacred%20Texts/StringorSingleDecadeRosary1.jpg)

(http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d89/platonic123/Sacred%20Texts/More%20Sacred%20Texts/StringorSingleDecadeRosary2.jpg)
Title: Rosary Rings - Are the Indulgences to be gained?
Post by: poche on August 02, 2012, 04:15:25 AM
Doesn't the indulgence go to the prayer?
Title: Rosary Rings - Are the Indulgences to be gained?
Post by: Neil Obstat on August 05, 2012, 04:25:56 AM
The Rosary of the Blessed Virgin Mary is the most highly indulgenced sacramental
or prayer in the Church, outside of Holy Mass.

There are separate indulgences for every part of the Rosary:

For saying the Apostles' Creed
For saying the Our Father
For saying the Hail Mary
For saying the Glory Be to the Father
For praying an entire 5-decade Rosary with Creed, Pater, 3xAves, Glory Be, and then 5 decades while meditating on the 5 mysteries
For praying the entire 15-decade Rosary with all 15 mysteries
For praying the daily Rosary for a month, at least 5 decades a day
For holding standard, blessed, 5 decade or 15 decade Rosary beads while praying
For being in a group where someone is holding a blessed Rosary but you cannot because you are driving the car, or somehow unable to hold the beads yourself, so long as you join in the prayers
For praying the Rosary with a group of other people, in which case each individual gets the indulgences earned by the other individuals combined, such that 10 people each get 10 Rosary indulgences, and as a group, earn 100 indulgences together
For praying the Rosary in the presence of the Blessed Sacrament
For praying the Rosary in a church or oratory sacramentally dedicated for Catholic prayer
For praying the Rosary on certain feast days, such as the Feast of the Holy Rosary, October 7th
For adding prayers for the Holy Father, an Our Father, Hail Mary and Glory Be at the end of the Rosary

There may be more. These are cuмulative indulgences. That means, if you join a
group of 100 people on the Feast of the Holy Rosary, in a church, with the Blessed
Sacrament in the tabernacle, and each person holds their own blessed rosary
beads unless they are somehow unable, such as quadripelegic, and you pray 5
decades with the extra prayers for the Holy Father, then each person gets the
following:

100 Rosaries, before the Eucharist, on this Feast day, in a church, and prayers for
the Holy Father, holding blessed beads. That's 6 categories times 100 Rosaries, or
600 indulgences.

That would not be 100 or 600 plenary indulgences, because you can only get one
of those a day, except under rare conditions. But still, it's 600 partial indulgences
for each person, under the usual conditions.

Now, if you only pray one decade, there is only the indulgences for the individual
prayers, not for a Rosary. You have to pray in increments of 5 decades. You can
pray 10 decades, and that would be two Rosaries. Or you can pray 15 decades,
and that would be 3 Rosaries. When you do so, you don't have to repeat the
Credo, Pater, 3 Hail Mary's and Glory Be between each set of 5 decades in the
same day.

I went to a "Rosary" for a deceased friend and was alarmed to hear the
"permanent Deacon" announce that they would have a "decade," not a Rosary.
Then they led the Creed, Our Father, three Hail Mary's, Glory Be, and followed
that with the Resurrection decade (surprise, surprise). I made it a point to speak
with the "permanent Deacon" afterwards, to find that a "bereavement ministry"
couple had met with the family and asked questions, and checked boxes on their
form papers, including "Would you like to have a Rosary or a 'decade' for the
'viewing' ceremony?" The family answered that since many of the attendees would
be Protestants, they thought that a decade would be less offensive to them. I
asked the "permanent Deacon" if he knew anything about the indulgences for the
prayer of the Rosary. He said, "no." He's a "permanent Deacon" and he doesn't
know anything about indulgences. Right.

I asked him if the "bereavement ministry" form work has any mention of
indulgences for the Rosary, and he said, "no." I asked him if the "bereavement
ministry couple" ever explains to the family of the deceased anything about the
indulgences of the Rosary, and he said "no." Then I asked him, "Today, we had
about 150 people present, and if each one had prayed the 5 decade Rosary, how
many indulgences would that have been?" He replied, "I don't know." I informed
him that it could have been 22,500 Rosary indulgences for the repose of the soul
of the deceased, but instead, we only have one indulgence. So there are 22
thousand, four hundred and ninety nine indulgences lost today. He stared at me. I
asked him how there was one Rosary indulgence today, and he did not know that
either. That makes 5 for 5 for the "permanent Deacon." I have to wonder what
kind of "permanence" it refers to! I said that there was one Rosary indulgence
because I prayed one Rosary while they were goofing around with all the other
rigamarole that amounts to nothing but a performance for the entertainment
of the "assembly," I suppose, right in front of the deceased, who was a mother of
10 children, who always had a family Rosary at home or whenever they had a
road trip in the car (to keep the kids quiet!) but for her "veiwing" there was no
Rosary.

I went around and asked members of the assembly since everyone was chatting
in the church, like it's a stadium or theater or boxing arena, if they would have
been offended if we had prayed the 5-decade Rosary, and nobody said they
would have minded, in fact two thought it was odd that we had not done so.

You should always pray an entire decade without interruption. If you do get
interrupted, you should only stop at the end of a decade, lest you have to start
the decade over again when you resume. That's why an occupation with too many
interruptions is not conducive to praying the Rosary, unless you can manage to  
keep track of your prayers while doing something else.

Using the "ring" rosaries have not been useful for me, personally, because I do
not remember how many decades I have prayed. Sometimes I forget which
mystery I'm on, and then I don't know if it was one decade or two, or four or
three, or whatever. Therefore, I don't use the ring rosary beads. I found it
humorous when a friend of mine was promoting them by handing them out to
people after Mass, and when I went on a road trip with him, we prayed a Rosary
on three occasions, and each time, he forgot which mystery we were on! Too
much! I controlled my urge to tease him about it!