Author Topic: Question about Baptism (Read 2115 times)

MyrnaM · « **Reply #15 on:** December 16, 2013, 07:58:29 AM »

We never know if God is speaking to the dying person in His way, we do not know the disposition of the dying persons soul, and we should baptise the dying unconscious person, if the person is conscious and refuses then we should not baptize them but continue to pray and encourage them on the right path to salvation.

This is only my common sense speaking.

Ladislaus · « **Reply #16 on:** December 16, 2013, 08:06:42 AM »

Myrna, please leave this to a priest who has training in Pastoral theology. Everything that's been posted suggests that Baptism cannot be conferred unless there's some prior indication of the willingness to receive it. Everyone should consult a well educated priest on this matter and not rely upon "common sense".

As an aside, this prerequisite of the "willingness to receive" the Sacrament, for which the linked Canon cites the Council of Trent, is what Trent was teaching in the famous "without [the Sacrament] or the desire thereof" passage that's wrongly construed to be teaching Baptism of Desire.

MyrnaM · « **Reply #17 on:** December 16, 2013, 09:26:24 AM »

Ladis... with all due respect, my post was exactly why I added it was my own common sense talking, did not want anyone to think I was quoting a priest.

Merry Christmas to all.

Cantarella · « **Reply #18 on:** December 17, 2013, 12:45:36 AM »

The answer is no. Someone who is at the point of death, must explicitly profess the Faith in order to receive Baptism and gain graces. And implicit faith / desire is not sufficient.

Pope Eugene IV:
Whoever wishes to be saved, needs above all else to hold the Catholic Faith; unless each one preserve this whole and entire, he will without a doubt perish in eternity (After defining the Holy Trinity and the Incarnation and the necessity to believe in these truthts) ...This is the Catholic Faith; unless each one believes this faithfully and frimly, he cannot be saved.

Pope St Pius X:
"We declare that a great number of those who are condemned to eternal punishment suffer everlasting calamity because of ignorance of those mysteries of faith which must be known and believed in order to be numbered among the Elect"

Pope Clement XI:
A missionary should not baptize one who does not believe explicitly in the Lord Jesus Christ, but it is bound to instruct him about al those matters which are necessary, by a necessity of means, in accordance with the capacity of the one baptized.

Baptism can never be impossible to receive for anyone, since God has revealed and commanded Baptism for the attainment of eternal salvation and God does not command impossibilities. This is a promise of God Himself. Our Lord says " Ask and it shall be given to you, seek and you SHALL find for everyone who asks receive and who seeks finds...

So Vermont and all those who have non Catholic family or friends, we shall grieve upon those loved ones who irreparably will be damned forever at the moment of death. Let us pray for these souls so they can be converted to the True Faith before they die. Let us do as much as we possibly can during this earthly exile to convert them and take their veils off their eyes!