Author Topic: Male Immodesty Tempts Feminine Women? (Read 11624 times)

Cantarella · « **Reply #105 on:** March 18, 2018, 09:47:24 PM »

* Duplicate

Croix de Fer · « **Reply #106 on:** March 19, 2018, 07:41:13 AM »

It's healthy for a woman to be attracted (not the same as lust) to a shirtless man whose physique is the result of being physically active, just as it's healthy for a man to be attracted (again, not to be confused with lust) to a scantly dressed woman who is in good shape. To be repulsed by a good physique whose form is visible, for whatever reason, by the opposite sex is actually unhealthy.

You can disagree with me, but you will still be wrong.

With above being said, scantly dressed women are immodest and an occasion of sin, while the shirtless men are potentially being immodest, depending on the circuмstances. Women are homemakers, therefore, they have absolutely no reason to be immodestly dressed relative to the circuмstance in public. They are supposed to be dressed modestly in private, too. Conversely, men are the laborers, builders, hunters and defenders, so less clothing, in those situations, can sometimes lend to efficiency and relief from heat and humidity.

Ladislaus · « **Reply #107 on:** March 19, 2018, 07:49:08 AM »

Quote from: Cantarella on March 18, 2018, 09:41:51 PM

I definitely agree. I rather see a handsome man wearing a proper shirt and tie (or even working attire), than the same handsome man without a shirt on!

So, then, would you rather see an ugly man wearing a proper shirt and tie or a handsome man without a shirt on?

Here you just compare two handsome men.

Ladislaus · « **Reply #108 on:** March 19, 2018, 07:54:02 AM »

Quote from: Croix de Fer on March 19, 2018, 07:41:13 AM

It's healthy for a woman to be attracted (not the same as lust) to a shirtless man whose physique is the result of being physically active, just as it's healthy for a man to be attracted (again, not to be confused with lust) to a scantly dressed woman who is in good shape. To be repulsed by a good physique whose form is visible, for whatever reason, by the opposite sex is actually unhealthy.

You can disagree with me, but you will still be wrong.

Sorry, man, but I can't separate the body from a person's soul and a person's character. I am not attracted to a "physique", a piece of meat. If a person is ugly inside, I find the physique repugnant as well. To me, even what might otherwise in the abstract be a "good physique" is utterly repugnant. In fact, it almost becomes MORE repugnant than if the ugly soul had a poor physique ... because of the incongruity. Then, on the other hand, I could, if I were not married, be physically attracted to someone with a beautiful soul but average (to even below-average) physique.

Croix de Fer · « **Reply #109 on:** March 19, 2018, 08:09:44 AM »

Quote from: Ladislaus on March 19, 2018, 07:54:02 AM

Sorry, man, but I can't separate the body from a person's soul and a person's character. I am not attracted to a "physique", a piece of meat. If a person is ugly inside, I find the physique repugnant as well. To me, even what might otherwise in the abstract be a "good physique" is utterly repugnant. In fact, it almost becomes MORE repugnant than if the ugly soul had a poor physique ... because of the incongruity. Then, on the other hand, I could, if I were not married, be physically attracted to someone with a beautiful soul but average (to even below-average) physique.

I absolutely agree with this.

My comment is more in regard to a person seeing another person for the first time and not knowing their character, values, personality, etc. except from what they might be able to immediately gather by the countenance and dress code of the person they're meeting or viewing from a distance.

I'm just saying all things, except the body, being equal and neutral, it's healthy for a chick be attracted to men with good bodies, and vice versa, whose form is visible for whatever reason - right or wrong.

* again, attraction is not the same as lust

Ladislaus · « **Reply #110 on:** March 19, 2018, 08:41:07 AM »

Quote from: Croix de Fer on March 19, 2018, 08:09:44 AM

I absolutely agree with this.

My comment is more in regard to a person seeing another person for the first time and not knowing their character, values, personality, etc. except from what they might be able to immediately gather by the countenance and dress code of the person they're meeting or viewing from a distance.

I'm just saying all things, except the body, being equal and neutral, it's healthy for a chick be attracted to men with good bodies, and vice versa, whose form is visible for whatever reason - right or wrong.

* again, attraction is not the same as lust

OK. Got it. Then I don't disagree.

Croix de Fer · « **Reply #111 on:** March 19, 2018, 09:15:09 AM »

Quote from: Ladislaus on March 19, 2018, 08:41:07 AM

OK. Got it. Then I don't disagree.

My comment, "You can disagree with me, but you will still be wrong" was more directed as Seraphina and Cantarella.

Ladislaus · « **Reply #112 on:** March 19, 2018, 12:42:48 PM »

Quote from: Croix de Fer on March 19, 2018, 09:15:09 AM

My comment, "You can disagree with me, but you will still be wrong" was more directed as Seraphina and Cantarella.

I know. I was just responding to where you said that you "agree" with me ... by saying that I do not disagree with you, given how you clarified what you were saying.

Your distinction between attraction (even physical attraction) and lust is a very important one, and I'd like to discuss that more later when I have more time. Scrupulous people often confuse the two.

Last Tradhican · « **Reply #113 on:** March 19, 2018, 01:04:06 PM »

Quote from: Last Tradhican on March 14, 2018, 01:39:30 PM

Basically, the provocatively dressed female is telling the man, I am easy. I described in detail how a man is tempted to sin by the provocative fashions of women.

I ask, how exactly is a Catholic woman tempted to commit mortal sin, what exactly takes place?

Only one woman has responded, that was Cantarella, and many women have agreed with her and none has disagreed. My own life's experience confirms everything she wrote and I have written the same observations many times here on CI and how it applies to the Fathers raising their daughters right (more follows) Here is everything Cantarella has said:

Cantarella - I think the temptation for women in this regard is more a vanity issue than physical inchastity. Sure, we can see a good looking man and think to ourselves: "wow, what a handsome man". But from that point of simple awareness, to actually "undressing the man in our minds and imagining"... I just don't think it naturally happens. Or maybe it is just me. What I do remember happening back in my early youth is me instantaneously trying to appear more pretty or even flirtatious, this is, actively seeking attention, when the mentioned good looking young man appeared in the room. It is really an ego issue. If left unchecked, this could lead to sins of vanity or even immodesty.

Cantarella - It was this Fanny by the way, who also made the indecorous comment that those women who are not "frigid", would be tempted to impurity by the sight of men. It was only Fanny who said that, not "many women" in this thread. I disagree. I believe it is part of the ultra - egalitarian revolution that the sexes are not "that different" to pretend that women have the same temptations than the men when it comes to sins of lust or that their needs for sɛҳuąƖ release are the same. As I said before, the temptation is more a pride issue. Last Tradhican is correct when he says is more a self - esteem issue for women. That is why women flirt, not necessarily because they are "undressing the men in their minds and all that", but because they falsely feel better about themselves when receiving validation from the men. It is also a power issue. I would be willing to bet that that the motivation of that "cougar" that Croix de Fer had such an experience with, was not a physical inclination per se; but more of a desperate attempt of hers to feel she "is still got it" and that she has some imaginary power over him. This motivation comes from broken women who realize they have absolutely nothing to offer to a man; but her sex. I agree it is absolutely pathetic.

Cantarella - And the sad thing is that misguided girls fall for these lies so easily! In an attempt to just be "like the guys" they deliberately imitate and exaggerate the "guy's talk" about such matters. It makes them feel "empowered" to be harsh and insensitive, which they perceive men to be like; but it is a lie which actually goes against their nature. It is also a physiological mechanism of defense against the men and their own feelings. Surely, from damaged girls, which sadly account for the vast majority of them out there nowadays. But these girls are broken and damaged. They have been brainwashed. There is a reason why we girls tend to be "copy cats". We tend to imitate other women around us. When all we see as girls is what the media portrays today the role model to be, (this is, basically the "empowered, masculinized slut") well...it is hard for girls to disconnect from that pattern, it takes a special Grace. Role models for girls are crucial because of our malleable, water-like nature. Patriarchal societies are well aware of this nature, and heavy reinforcement (by fathers, husbands, and older women) of honorable conduct for women was an absolute necessity.We have an amazing potential to be and do good; but also great evil.

Cantarella - I want to add here that the pornographic industry has profited greatly from the naiveté of sɛҳuąƖly immature of men of hoping to be physically "wanted" by the women just as much as they want them. Reality is, when it comes to sɛҳuąƖ drives, there is a sea separating male nature from female nature. Our great grandfathers knew better. Entire patriarchal civilizations were built upon these truths regarding such differences.

Last Tradhican · « **Reply #114 on:** March 19, 2018, 01:18:39 PM »

The objective of all of my postings on proper dress is to teach the young ladies how to dress modestly and conduct themselves as Catholic ladies. The young girls need to be made aware of why women act the way they do, so they can be aware of it. This is foundational. I did not find that I had posted that here, I thought I had, but in going over the whole thread I realized that I never posted this. As it turns out, Cantarella spelled it out. Nevertheless, I'll repeat it here for the other fathers of young girls.

Here is the lesson I teach my daughters from the time they start noticing boys:

Women erroneously learn from other women that their beauty and value comes from the attraction they can bring to themselves from men. They are taught that the way to attract men is to dress provocatively and to flirt. In poor countries this is the way a woman can become rich overnight, however, it is like the lottery, 99+% of the women will lose and will spend an entire life of misery, always wondering why they go from man to man, till their grave.

Once a young girl is infected with this mindset, they are caught for life.

Practically all women have this decease. It is the foundation of all immodesty and immorality.

Those that have eyes to see, let them see.

Last Tradhican · « **Reply #115 on:** March 19, 2018, 02:00:08 PM »

"Before all decision to create the world, the infinite knowledge of God presents to Him all the graces, and different series of graces, which He can prepare for each soul, along with the consent or refusal which would follow in each circuмstance, and that in millions of possible combinations ... Thus, for each man in particular there are in the thought of God, limitless possible histories, some histories of virtue and salvation, others of crime and damnation; and God will be free in choosing such a world, such a series of graces, and in determining the future history and final destiny of each soul. And this is precisely what He does when among all possible worlds, by an absolutely free act, he decides to realize the actual world with all the circuмstances of its historic evolutions, with all the graces which in fact have been and will be distributed until the end of the world, and consequently with all the elect and all the reprobate who God foresaw would be in it if de facto He created it." [The Catholic Encyclopedia Appleton, 1909, on Augustine, pg 97]

In other words before a man is conceived, God in his infinite knowledge has already put that person through the test with millions of possible combinations and possible histories, some histories of virtue and salvation, others of crime and damnation;along with the consent or refusal which would follow in each circuмstance (of millions of possible combinations!!!) and God will be free in determining which future history and final destiny He assigns each soul.

God chose to place the Jew gangster Dutch Schultz (you can read the whole article at http://www.killthedutchman.net/chapter_IX.htm ) into the circuмstances into which he was born. Dutch was a gangster and a killer, growing up surrounded by his allies and adversarial Italian and Irish gangsters. He was ambushed one day and shot many times, and mortally wounded he was taken to the hospital where he died. But before he died he asked for a priest and asked to be baptized, and his request was granted. If Dutch Schultz was sincere in his conversion, he went straight to heaven. I doubt anyone here on CI will go straight to heaven, unless we are martyred.

I explain all of that above to say that for some reason God has put us in the circuмstances and surroundings that we have been since our childhood till present. We are what we are because of our circuмstances and how we reacted to them, just like Dutch Schultz. Had we been put in Dutch Schultz place we would have been much worse and gone to hell.

If a man were born in a "Sin City" tropical tourist destination and grew up on the beach and ended up working in say a Club Med from the time he was 12 years old till he was 40, that person would be exposed to many women who are there to do what they can't do in their home town. That boy's life would be like the movie "Groundhog Day", where any mistakes he made with a girl, could be corrected with the next one that comes in and no one would know of his mistake or his reputation. New girls would come in every 2-3 days, so he would learn everything there is to know and correct himself as he goes along. If that person grew up doing this all his life, he would eventually become wise or shot by someone. That is a parable of my life and like Dutch Schultz, by God's grace, one day I was enlightened by God and I left that life behind almost instantly. I can't erase my life, God allowed me to go through it for some reason. I believe that all the daughters God has given to me is the reason, as well as all the other young ladies that are put in my path.

"But he that received the seed upon good ground, is he that heareth the word, and understandeth, and beareth fruit, and yieldeth the one an hundredfold"

Last Tradhican · « **Reply #116 on:** March 19, 2018, 02:21:08 PM »

Quote from: Croix de Fer on March 17, 2018, 10:17:13 PM

I could give you an example, but I won't because people will say I'm bragging; and I don't know how to explain it while keeping it Catholic-friendly and not sounding like some short erotic story. It would probably be an occasion of sin for chicks.

The examples that you gave are mild for women in the world, they can also be explained by the descriptions given by Cantarella, those girls were not necessarily acting like men do when they take the same actions. Like I said before, nothing is 100%, there are women who are so corrupted, that they can become like the men of the world that I described. It is analogous to a man becoming a sodomite. Sodomites are mentally disturbed, possessed. Women who act as men will always be older and unattractive, as no one wants them anymore, but the self esteem factor is still there too. Since men will go after anything with a pulse, those women will always find someone.

I have never known of any young girl who was corrupted like that, and we are talking about young girls here and Catholic women. All men and women were once joyful children with no such thoughts on their mind. "To God, the joy of my youth"

Croix de Fer · « **Reply #117 on:** March 19, 2018, 02:28:01 PM »

Quote from: Last Tradhican on March 19, 2018, 02:21:08 PM

The examples that you gave are mild for women in the world, they can also be explained by the descriptions given by Cantarella, those girls were not necessarily acting like men do when they take the same actions. Like I said before, nothing is 100%, there are women who are so corrupted, that they can become like the men of the world that I described. It is analogous to man becoming a sodomite. Sodomites are mentally disturbed, possessed. Women who act as men will always be older, as no one wants them anymore, but the self esteem factor is still there too. Since men will go after anything with a pulse, those women will always find someone.

I have never known of any young girl who was corrupted like that, and we are talking about young girls here and Catholic women.

Nah, brah, the example I'm withholding isn't the mild examples I already stated on this thread. I'm withholding it for the reasons in my quote to which you responded. Also, the chick acting on lust activated by her sight of me without a shirt was 19 years old, not some older lady whom no man wants anymore.

Last Tradhican · « **Reply #118 on:** March 19, 2018, 02:58:01 PM »

Quote from: Croix de Fer on March 19, 2018, 02:28:01 PM

Also, the chick acting on lust activated by her sight of me without a shirt was 19 years old, not some older lady whom no man wants anymore.

Her actions are mild for any woman of the world. It still can be explained as Cantarella has described. Her explanation can't be outright dismissed in the case you give.

You and I are then down to that:

Great Tradhican - Only corrupted older and unattractive ladies act like men

Croix De Fer - normal young (like a 19 years old) good looking girls pursue men for the same reason men pursue women. (What is the % vs girls who flirt to gain self esteem?)

Fanny · « **Reply #119 on:** March 19, 2018, 03:57:40 PM »

Quote from: Croix de Fer on March 19, 2018, 02:28:01 PM

Also, the chick acting on lust activated by her sight of me without a shirt was 19 years old, not some older lady whom no man wants anymore.

Some men like older women.

Author Topic: Male Immodesty Tempts Feminine Women? (Read 11624 times)

Cantarella

Re: Male Immodesty Tempts Feminine Women?

Croix de Fer

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Ladislaus

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Ladislaus

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Croix de Fer

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Ladislaus

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Croix de Fer

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Ladislaus

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Last Tradhican

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Last Tradhican

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Last Tradhican

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Last Tradhican

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Croix de Fer

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Last Tradhican

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Fanny

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