Send CathInfo's owner Matthew a gift from his Amazon wish list:
https://www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls/25M2B8RERL1UO

Author Topic: Lent fast is 40 days not two days  (Read 3195 times)

0 Members and 3 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline Last Tradhican

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6293
  • Reputation: +3330/-1939
  • Gender: Male
Lent fast is 40 days not two days
« on: February 28, 2022, 03:02:03 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Some (many?) SSPX priests are announcing from the pulpit that the Lenten fast consists of 2 days, just like the Novus Ordo clergy. That is not and never has been Catholic. The Lenten fast is 40 days long just like Our Lord fasted 40 days, not just two. I've been told that because I am over 59, I do not have to fast, but nevertheless, though I am now 68, I am in better shape that most 40 year old men, so, in thanksgiving to God I fast as one. I will also abstain from going on the internet except for business. Therefore, I will not even be looking at CI  except maybe on a Sunday.

    I was taught long ago that the fast in the USA consists of one normal meal and two other small meals that do not in total both exceed the one main meal. I find that to not be much of a sacrifice so what I do in practice is 2 eggs in the morning, nothing all day, and the main meal at like 4pm. If at late night I am hungry, I will drink a lot of water and if it is not enough sometimes I have an apple and a small piece of cheese. The Church does not allow fasting on Sundays.  There are certain days when we are not allowed to eat meat and on all Fridays one can't eat meat, no big deal since we never eat meat of Fridays.

    No big deal, so why do SSPX priests not teach the real fast? It's bad for business? They've dumbed down the faith for the influx of Novus Ordo's since covid?  Who cares why they do it, take care of yourselves, learn the faith yourself and do what is Catholic.

    God Bless

    Offline Cryptinox

    • Supporter
    • ***
    • Posts: 1168
    • Reputation: +251/-92
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Lent fast is 40 days not two days
    « Reply #1 on: February 28, 2022, 03:10:49 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Probably because it is one of the few things from the 1983 code they find acceptable
    I recant many opinions on the crisis in the Church and moral theology that I have espoused on here from at least 2019-2021 don't take my postings from that time as well as 2022 possibly too seriously.


    Offline DigitalLogos

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 8304
    • Reputation: +4717/-754
    • Gender: Male
    • Slave to the Sacred Heart
      • Twitter
    Re: Lent fast is 40 days not two days
    « Reply #2 on: February 28, 2022, 03:44:15 PM »
  • Thanks!1
  • No Thanks!0
  • Father went over the fasting rules from the pulpit and highly recommended that we all stick to the traditional fast for the full 40 days, if we are able to do so. It seems to be hit or miss depending on the SSPX priest, unfortunately.
    "Be not therefore solicitous for tomorrow; for the morrow will be solicitous for itself. Sufficient for the day is the evil thereof." [Matt. 6:34]

    "In all thy works remember thy last end, and thou shalt never sin." [Ecclus. 7:40]

    "A holy man continueth in wisdom as the sun: but a fool is changed as the moon." [Ecclus. 27:12]

    Offline Angelus

    • Supporter
    • ***
    • Posts: 1160
    • Reputation: +489/-94
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Lent fast is 40 days not two days
    « Reply #3 on: February 28, 2022, 03:45:51 PM »
  • Thanks!2
  • No Thanks!0
  • Some (many?) SSPX priests are announcing from the pulpit that the Lenten fast consists of 2 days, just like the Novus Ordo clergy. That is not and never has been Catholic. The Lenten fast is 40 days long just like Our Lord fasted 40 days, not just two. I've been told that because I am over 59, I do not have to fast, but nevertheless, though I am now 68, I am in better shape that most 40 year old men, so, in thanksgiving to God I fast as one. I will also abstain from going on the internet except for business. Therefore, I will not even be looking at CI  except maybe on a Sunday.

    I was taught long ago that the fast in the USA consists of one normal meal and two other small meals that do not in total both exceed the one main meal. I find that to not be much of a sacrifice so what I do in practice is 2 eggs in the morning, nothing all day, and the main meal at like 4pm. If at late night I am hungry, I will drink a lot of water and if it is not enough sometimes I have an apple and a small piece of cheese. The Church does not allow fasting on Sundays.  There are certain days when we are not allowed to eat meat and on all Fridays one can't eat meat, no big deal since we never eat meat of Fridays.

    No big deal, so why do SSPX priests not teach the real fast? It's bad for business? They've dumbed down the faith for the influx of Novus Ordo's since covid?  Who cares why they do it, take care of yourselves, learn the faith yourself and do what is Catholic.

    God Bless

    Not my SSPX priest. He spent the whole sermon on Sunday explaining the differences between the Novus Ordo guidelines and the traditional guidelines. He denigrated the Novus Ordo guidelines. He exhorted everyone to follow the traditional fasting guidelines, which, by the way, can be found near the beginning of the Angelus Missal.

    Offline TKGS

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 5843
    • Reputation: +4691/-490
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Lent fast is 40 days not two days
    « Reply #4 on: February 28, 2022, 04:21:54 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Frankly, back in the days that I knew actual people who attended the Novus Ordo on a regular basis, they didn't even fast those two days though most of them did actually try not to eat meat on Fridays during Lent.


    Offline Ladislaus

    • Supporter
    • *****
    • Posts: 46494
    • Reputation: +27376/-5058
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Lent fast is 40 days not two days
    « Reply #5 on: February 28, 2022, 05:46:10 PM »
  • Thanks!1
  • No Thanks!0
  • They're just being consistent here.  If the V2 papal claimants are legitimate popes, then they have the power to dispense from the fast, and so the SSPX cannot impose upon consciences under pain of mortal sin something which a legitimate pope has said isn't binding under pain of sin.  It all boils down to whether you accept the V2 popes as popes.  Heck, even simple parish priests could dispense individual faithful from fasting depending on their circuмstances.

    Unfortunately, if we fast when it's not binding, there's one particular mortification lacking there, which is probably the most important one of all, mortification of the will.  It's commonly reported that even people who love seafood find it difficult to abstain from meat on Fridays.  People who think nothing of just eating one meal a day most of the time somehow find it difficult to fast on the days prescribed.  That's because it's one thing to do it because you feel like it and quite another because you are required to under obedience, and it is the will that is being mortified.

    1) If you're a dogmatic sedevacantist, then these would be binding for you under pain of mortal sin.
    2) If you're dogmatic R&R, then these would not be binding under pain of mortal sin.
    3) If you're in doubt, then a doubtful law does not apply (lex dubia non obligat), so technically speaking you're not bound under pain of mortal sin either.

    So it's really only the dogmatic sedevacantists who are bound under pain of mortal sin to keep the Traditional fast.

    One would be foolish not to perform the Traditional fast, but only the Church can bind consciences, and that's one of my biggest beefs with some of the dogmatic types who go around excommunicating people.


    Offline Ladislaus

    • Supporter
    • *****
    • Posts: 46494
    • Reputation: +27376/-5058
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Lent fast is 40 days not two days
    « Reply #6 on: February 28, 2022, 05:48:59 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Frankly, back in the days that I knew actual people who attended the Novus Ordo on a regular basis, they didn't even fast those two days though most of them did actually try not to eat meat on Fridays during Lent.

    Most of them are so ignorant that they don't even know what a "fast" means.

    Offline Ladislaus

    • Supporter
    • *****
    • Posts: 46494
    • Reputation: +27376/-5058
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Lent fast is 40 days not two days
    « Reply #7 on: February 28, 2022, 05:51:22 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Not my SSPX priest. He spent the whole sermon on Sunday explaining the differences between the Novus Ordo guidelines and the traditional guidelines. He denigrated the Novus Ordo guidelines. He exhorted everyone to follow the traditional fasting guidelines, which, by the way, can be found near the beginning of the Angelus Missal.

    Again, there's a huge difference in deriding the NO guidelines, while promoting the traditional, and quite another to think you can bind consciences based on your personal opinion.  SSPX promotes dogmatic sedeplenism.  So, as far as SSPX are concerned, these men are undoubtedly popes and they can't bind consciences over and above a legitimate pope.  SSPX constantly want to have it both ways.


    Offline Angelus

    • Supporter
    • ***
    • Posts: 1160
    • Reputation: +489/-94
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Lent fast is 40 days not two days
    « Reply #8 on: February 28, 2022, 06:13:35 PM »
  • Thanks!1
  • No Thanks!1
  • Again, there's a huge difference in deriding the NO guidelines, while promoting the traditional, and quite another to think you can bind consciences based on your personal opinion.  SSPX promotes dogmatic sedeplenism.  So, as far as SSPX are concerned, these men are undoubtedly popes and they can't bind consciences over and above a legitimate pope.  SSPX constantly want to have it both ways.

    Oh, so one gains more merit when one acts under compulsion than when one acts with free will? Are you sure you want to say that? Can you produce any magisterial teaching from the Catholic Church to back up your statement?

    Offline Pax Vobis

    • Supporter
    • *****
    • Posts: 12071
    • Reputation: +7596/-2288
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Lent fast is 40 days not two days
    « Reply #9 on: February 28, 2022, 07:22:38 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0

  • Quote
    Oh, so one gains more merit when one acts under compulsion than when one acts with free will?
    This is a common theme in most of the lives of the saints.

    Offline Angelus

    • Supporter
    • ***
    • Posts: 1160
    • Reputation: +489/-94
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Lent fast is 40 days not two days
    « Reply #10 on: February 28, 2022, 07:46:16 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • This is a common theme in most of the lives of the saints.
    The "evangelical counsels" are voluntary. More merit. 

    Keeping the commandments is not voluntary. Less merit.

    Pretty basic distinction in Catholicism. See the link below:

    https://www.newadvent.org/cathen/04435a.htm


    Offline Pax Vobis

    • Supporter
    • *****
    • Posts: 12071
    • Reputation: +7596/-2288
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Lent fast is 40 days not two days
    « Reply #11 on: February 28, 2022, 07:56:00 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0

  • Quote
    The "evangelical counsels" are voluntary. More merit. 
    Uhhhh....yes, of course.  That's what we're talking about - poverty, chastity and obedience - as practiced due to a religious VOW (i.e. done by obedience).  All catholics can practice these virtues but the religious get more merit because they take vows and MUST practice them.

    Offline Angelus

    • Supporter
    • ***
    • Posts: 1160
    • Reputation: +489/-94
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Lent fast is 40 days not two days
    « Reply #12 on: February 28, 2022, 08:17:46 PM »
  • Thanks!1
  • No Thanks!0
  • Uhhhh....yes, of course.  That's what we're talking about - poverty, chastity and obedience - as practiced due to a religious VOW (i.e. done by obedience).  All catholics can practice these virtues but the religious get more merit because they take vows and MUST practice them.

    I'm sorry. You have it exactly backwards. Please read carefully the Catholic Encyclopedia entry, but especially this part:

    Quote
    The difference between a precept and a counsel lies in this, that the precept is a matter of necessity while the counsel is left to the free choice of the person to whom it is proposed.

    A "precept" is a command of law, such as the law of the Church, binding a Catholic to certain behaviors under pain of mortal sin. A "counsel" is a freely-chosen work that, since it is not required and is more difficult, brings the worker much more merit than the former.

    One who is constrained by a religious VOW is under that constraint because he has made a free choice to be under that VOW. A Catholic lay person is constrained only by what is law for him (the post-VII rules). When the Catholic lay person freely chooses to live according to the pre-VII fasting/abstinence rules, he gains more merit because he chooses the more difficult path that is not required for him.

    Offline Pax Vobis

    • Supporter
    • *****
    • Posts: 12071
    • Reputation: +7596/-2288
    • Gender: Male
    Re: Lent fast is 40 days not two days
    « Reply #13 on: February 28, 2022, 10:01:34 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • The lay person who chooses fasting for 40 days gains more merit than one who chooses not to.  The religious who fasts because of a lifelong vow has the most merit.  Fasting + lifelong obedience is > temporary fasting > no fasting.

    It’s a 3 tier comparison.

    Offline Viva Cristo Rey

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 18285
    • Reputation: +5684/-1964
    • Gender: Female
    Re: Lent fast is 40 days not two days
    « Reply #14 on: March 01, 2022, 03:41:45 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Douay-Rheims Bible
    No man can serve two masters. For either he will hate the one, and love the other: or he will sustain the one, and despise the other. You cannot serve God and mammon.


    (We can no longer trust even traditional groups for the true faith.) in the past, older people and even babies fasted.  Fasting and prayer helps  us to be closer to God.
    May God bless you and keep you