I am still as of this moment a NO Catholic.  I am searching. I am reading, praying, talking with different folks on both sides of the Catholic fence so to speak.

One misconception I have come across is that NO Churches are filled with goofy, hand waving, guoitar strumming, social justice knuckleheads.  Ex Priest married to ex Nuns  :shocked:
Touchy feely Protestant Goof around nonsense.

Well OK we do have those. But they do not make up more than a small minority.  What we do have is an ever growing Conservative Movement, trying to undo the errors of Vat 11.  Many of us are quite uncomfortable with the tone of the Church as a whole. we, at our Parish are somewhat fortunate in having a Conservative Priest. However, due to a good majority of the knuckleheads being Bishops we have an uphill climb.  

I am searching because I need and want answers.  As dis-satisfied as I am with the NO order Church I will be honest in telling you that I am not certain at this moment if leaving it is the answer or not.  

I also take great issue with several sights from SSPX andTraditonal Cahtolics that are very anti-semitic in tone. One woman in my Homeschool Co-Op is SSPX and is quite open in her utter hatred of Jєωs. No can do!

So as you can see I will be honest Still searching, can not abide anti-semitism or racism or bigotry of any kind. God made us all. That is currently my my biggest issue with the Trad and SSPX Churches.  
I am open to what you believe and want ot know it. I am not a critic of any ones beliefs, I am just looking to solidify where I worship.  

Please share you thoughts. I am farily thick skinned.    :scared2:

blestwith8 said:

I also take great issue with several sights from SSPX andTraditonal Cahtolics that are very anti-semitic in tone. One woman in my Homeschool Co-Op is SSPX and is quite open in her utter hatred of Jєωs. No can do!

A Catholic shouldn't hate anyone, but what you may think is hatred might be, let's say, "passionate recognition" of the evil that Jєωs have done, especially in the 20th century, and how they are trying to force the religion of the h0Ɩ0cαųst down our throats.

I don't know how you think about the Jєωs, but if you are in VII, you are almost certainly being indoctrinated into thinking they're innocent, sweet, victimized, great people.  The reality is that they are disproportionately represented in finance, in the government and in the media, and they are moving or have moved all of these EXTREMELY IMPORTANT institutions towards Satanic designs, towards chaos and destruction and an enormous loss of souls.

Take a look at Hollywood and the kind of things they put out, and you will see Christ's words coming true right before your eyes -- "You are the children of the devil, and the desires of your father you will do."  If you deny that Jєωs run Hollywood, or the media in its entirety, you just don't want to know the truth.  Don't you find it a little interesting, at the very least, that the people who historically have been the most hostile to Our Lord now control almost ALL sources of information that you get?  Don't you find it interesting how the Vatican II "Popes" are constantly hanging out with rabbis and licking the feet of the Jєωs?  

Here's a word for you to look up -- "Judaization."  This has been a fear of Catholics since the very beginning, that the Church would be infiltrated by Jєωs.

So if someone seems angry towards the Jєωs, there are many reasons to be -- that is why throughout the ages there have been flare-ups of anti-Jєωιѕн rage like with Hitler, and this isn't about to stop anytime soon -- but at the same time, as Catholics, we shouldn't dream of pogroms and extermination.  We have to love them as potential converts, potential brothers in Christ.  This is harder to do than at any other time in history, since they are no longer confined to ghettos, but are in total control and we live in the filthy stew that they've played an enormously important role in creating.  

Nevertheless, we can't just blame them, we have to blame ourselves as well.  They are 2% of the population.  They wouldn't have as much power as they do, they wouldn't have any power at all, if we didn't go along with them out of greed or fear or whatever other sin you care to name.  It's almost like God allowed us to be delivered into their rapacious hands due to our lukewarmness.  

The Masons, in my opinion, are simply Gentiles who are carrying out the Jєωιѕн project, more or less consciously, and are given power and / or money and / or fame as a result.  Then when Masons get in high positions, doing the Jєωιѕн work, they hire others who will be obedient to their schemes, and those people hire other people of the same ilk, and everything "trickles down" from there, until the whole world is involved, practically.

I fully believe that we as an American culture are to blame for the moral demise of our nation. God gave us this amazing country and its natual beauty and riches and we have crushed this society with our silence. How in the world did abortion ever become legal?  Such an inditement of how selfish we are.  Save the baby seals but murder the unborn. This world is truly upside down.

I agree that the Jєωs run Hollywood. I can see that the Main steam media-tards hate the Church. well they despise all forms or appearances of Christianity.  Hard to play out your hedonistic life when somewhere you know it is sin and have decided to ignore that uncomfortable aspect. Yet, consequences do come.

I also believe the sɛҳuąƖ abuse scandal in the Church is due to the post VAT11 Seminaries allowing in droves of sodomites in a sort of don't ask don't tell attitude. Also I believe the statistics of actual abuse pale in comparison to Protestant Churches, Jєωιѕн ѕуηαgσgυєs and Public Schools and org, such as Boy Scouts.  

Well I have much to read and pray about. People to speak with.  I appreciate yout honesty and answers.

One misconception I have come across is that NO Churches are filled with goofy, hand waving, guoitar strumming, social justice knuckleheads.  Ex Priest married to ex Nuns  :shocked:
Touchy feely Protestant Goof around nonsense.

I hear ya. Before I started going to the Tridentine Mass I used to belong to a rather conservative NO parish. A few people wore veils, Communion in the hand was optional, the priests would be glad to hear your confessions anytime you asked, one of the priests and a couple teachers offered sound doctrinal instruction, mostly everyone was pro life, charismaticism was avoided... I could go on for a while about some of the good things that were at my old parish (despite the fact that about half the parish didnt see a problem voting Liberal Democrat during the election) . However, despite the fact that the parish had it's good points, it wasn't healthy for ones spiritual life. The priests were slaves to human respect, people believed whatever they wanted, Communion in the hand was acceptable (as I suggested above), fund raisers for the Rice Bowl were preferable to personal sacrifices of the heart, feminism was okay... I could spend several days telling you what was WRONG with the parish, but I wont. I think we all can recognize what is WRONG with the N.O. on every level. But personally, between the ages of 10 and 13, I felt I was being cheated out of something more spiritually fulfilling, and after I started attending the Tridentine Mass I found that I was. After going to the Tridentine Low Mass for 4 weeks, we went back to the N.O. on the 5th Sunday.... after Mass was over, I saw clearly saw the difference, and I knew that I could never go back to a shell.

My advice is to judge an organization on its own merits -- its principles -- rather than anecdotal evidence based on individuals.

The traditional movement is right or wrong REGARDLESS of this or that individual. The movement could be wrong and this or that person could just be a saintly individual, or the movement could be right and this or that person could be weak or evil. Or anything in between.

The existence of a couple of kooks doesn't invalidate the movement, or its founding principles. As you get older (you're older than me, I think) you start to notice that EVERY group of human beings attracts a range of people, including some on the "fringe". Another bit of wisdom is that no species is more prone to being deceived, wrong, or exaggerating/downplaying a truth, than human beings. Since Original Sin, it is VERY, VERY hard, if not impossible, for human beings to get things completely right!

If there's one thing I've learned from reading dozens of history books -- that would be it!

Even those "in the right" have this or that area where they go overboard, or not far enough.

Matthew

I also take great issue with several sights from SSPX andTraditonal Cahtolics that are very anti-semitic in tone. One woman in my Homeschool Co-Op is SSPX and is quite open in her utter hatred of Jєωs. No can do!

So as you can see I will be honest Still searching, can not abide anti-semitism or racism or bigotry of any kind. God made us all. That is currently my my biggest issue with the Trad and SSPX Churches.  

The SSPX is not anti-semetic. If they were, they would be anti-Arab, anti-Turkish, etc.  Most Jєωs arent Semetic, they are Euro-Asian. It's one thing to dislike (or hate for that matter) a person's religion or culture, it's another to be against their skin color or whatever. Pretty much anything your going to hear against Judaism is concerning their religion and culture because it is the most oldest and most radically anti-Catholic one out there built on hatred and rejection of Jesus Christ as the Messiah.

 The reason why this is an issue is because we make a great error in associating today's "Jєωs" with the Hebrews of the Old Testament with which they have  nothing in common. For one example, they do NOT have a priesthood, or animal sacrifices for the remission of sins, which was practiced from Adam to Abraham, to Moses, and up till the Crucifixion. They DO have, however, many of the customs and rites of the Pharisees, such as the little boxes of scriptures (I still cannot remember the word for them) that they wear on their heads and arms, their LOUD and public method of individual prayer, the dispensational observance of the law, the RACIAL PREJUDICE AGAINST NON-JєωS, the study of the тαℓмυd (formerly un-compiled during Christ's time), and more, all of which prompted Our Lord to call them "a generation of VIPERS". There is more to it than just Phariseeism, but underneath the surface, modern Judaism is rooted in Paganism and superstition.

The opinions in the writings of Judaism also contrast with that of other religions in regard to Christ and Our Lady. The Koran while only recognizing Jesus as a prophet call Our Lady "Blessed among all women". The Rabbinical тαℓмυd calls Our Lord a deceiving magician who is now boiling in hell in a pot of his own #####, and calls Our Blessed Mother a h#####.

Having said all that, it is not of God and is opposed to the Kingship of Christ, and is deserving of condemnation. Does this mean that every Jєωιѕн person is bad or anti-Catholic for that matter? Needless to say, no. But it is undeniable and history shows that those who drive the chariot of Judaism are children of the devil who share their father's hatred for God and His Church.

I strongly recommend you read an old book by Fr.Denis Fahey called The Kingship of Christ and the Conversion of the Jєωιѕн Nation. It will give you a better understanding about what the SSPX believes in regard to the matter.


However, understand that there is going to be bitter friction between us common people and the Jєωs, simply because they hold the most influence over many aspects of our lives, and are the least friendly towards the traditional values the majority of people more or less hold.

I think what I'm trying to say is dont be scandalized if I or someone else say's something anti-Judaic and associate it with the SSPX, because it's just our personal opinion, and we're pissed. That doesnt mean we hate anyone.

Personally, my great grandfather came from a family of crypto-Jєωs. Does this change my love for my great grandfather or his people? No.  Do I hate the some of the things that he did? Yes. Probably the only people I actually "hate" are the people who were his associates who were enemies of the Church, because they hate Our Lord and Our Lady, and not out of ignorance.

Another thing I thought I should mention....

If the SSPX was "racist" as some like to pretend, we wouldnt have Hispanic, African, Vietnamese, and a few ex-Jєωιѕн priests in our ranks, let alone congregations of laity. Nor would we bother with evangelization efforts in the 3rd world countries. The SSPX is actually quite a diverse group when it comes to race.

I so appreciate all your answers and help. You are so kind and careful in your responses I am so thankfull.

I do not think nor do I fear losing my salvation if I stay or leave NO.  Nor am I in a panick and this is a decision my husband and i will take our time on. Admittedly we are completely ignorant when it comes to the Churches that Rome sees as schisms.  

I am however, responsible for 6 young lives and their faith formation.  That is where this all started for me. What are my children learning?  DO they understand how that really is the Body and blood of Christ. How am I modeling my faith?
I so love the Mass especially the consecration. Am I imparting my love for Christ, The Blessed Mother, St., Jude and the Church to these children.

As a young child and again as a teen I was a daily communicant.  WHy I left the Church was odd, but it was the 70's and we were continually being evangelized by the Jesus movement of the time.  I was not well catechised and I want my children to be able to defend their faith.

Frankly I was ignorant of mine until I attended RCIA classes with my husband last year. Then I had some qualms, but again was ignorant of any Trad church.

I am a very careful plodder and I do not jump into things. So bear with me.

I am praying, fasting reading and honestly just listening. My heart is heavy over the Parish I now attend. People seem so clueless. Yet, if I make a change it will  only be once.  I know God will direct my path.  

I will speak to several people because it helps me understand their beliefs, and eachsects  strengths and weaknesses.

I have been in many Protestant Churches. A few very well intentioned ones. Many very mediocre and some absolutely horrible heretical in every sense of the word.  The Lord has always directed my steps while I remain faitful to Him.

I have no doubt that I will know beyond any question where I belong.
I can tell you every issue I see in the NO church.  Lack of reverence is huge! :Lack of respect for the Pastor's authority is terrible. Why should they respect him, once they took Christ off the Altar and shoved Him in a mini cry room that helped  diminish His Authority, so naturally the Priest no longer garners any.

Please pray for our Pastor. He is a good and holy man.  He is very humble. Pray for him and for us as we venture on this journey.   He feels tied right now. BUT!  God can change hearts.  I know I avoided Mt. St. Michaels folks for years.

I have a feeling that my husband ( i do defer to him) will know after attending just a few Masses.  He is very well versed not only in Scripture but in Catholicism.  A deeply spiritual man he will be an asset to any Church we attend.

Thank you for clearing a few things up.  I have some doozies for my NO friends as well.  
Bless  you all.