Author Topic: Jeans and t-shirts prohibited from daily life (Read 5126 times)

Centroamerica · « **on:** February 24, 2015, 08:47:08 AM »

I just received an e-mail from a group of laity that men may not wear jeans and must wear dress shirts only. This is referring to daily life and not just while attending Mass. There is a story behind this I have been told. Something of a certain person bringing the protestant attitude into traditionalist circles. It isn't my place to post details about this but rather stick to the point. The laity may be trying to make up there own modesty rules something to the effect that: if you wear jeans and t-shirts you are not really a traditionalist. Coincidently, the last time I visited one of the homes of one of these lay friends I was traveling after a job proposition while wearing jeans.

Does anybody have any authoritave links on this to help me combat this creeping puritanism in lay traditionalist lay circles?

Thanks.

BTNYC · « **Reply #1 on:** February 24, 2015, 09:12:29 AM »

Utterly moronic. I suppose these jackanapses till their earth and harvest their crops and slaughter their cattle in dress shirts and slacks.

Ask these hypocrites why they dress in such modern garb as trousers, collared shirts and crevats and not togas and tunics like the first Catholics did.

St Gertrude · « **Reply #2 on:** February 24, 2015, 09:16:16 AM »

Sounds strange to me. Does this mean that a forensic pathologist needs to wear a white shirt and tie while doing an autopsy? (I am a retired coroner, and we generally wore scrubs.)

Centroamerica · « **Reply #3 on:** February 24, 2015, 09:42:53 AM »

Well I think it's a bit serious. It is coming from a religious woman to the laity I have been told. The same has had problems with priests.

I believe it is very likely a heresy. The claim is that jeans are a modernist material and so jeans for being the material they are, are prohibited to traditionalists. Ironic that this comes to the laity from a woman. There are more heresies circulating I believe. I need to take the problem to the priests I believe.

Again, any docuмent against this puritanism would be appreciated.

Luker · « **Reply #4 on:** February 24, 2015, 11:19:05 AM »

Can you clarify just who is sending out orders banning jeans and t shirts? Is this some kind of a lay group you are a part of? Can you let us know the name so I can be sure to avoid them?

Thanks in advance!

PG · « **Reply #5 on:** February 24, 2015, 11:43:17 AM »

The dress slacks, coat, collar, and tie line is a thorn in the side tradition. I honestly do not see the "dignity" in it that most trad clerics do(requiring such for mass). Our current elites spark these trends, and our elites do not at all carry "dignity" worthy of the sacrament.

Centroamerica - the heresy is known as "fiftiesism"(coined by +Williamson). The dress coat and tie was worn by everyone back then, and many trads unfortunately see the fifties as the high water mark in the history of the church. It is "utterly moronic".

Centroamerica · « **Reply #6 on:** February 24, 2015, 11:49:39 AM »

I will confirm that it is certain before saying anything more about. What I can say is that there is not one priest who has lent his support to such an exaggerated idea. We have all seen how some families become coordinators of chapels and then wage little mini wars with other families. I've seen it in the two SSPX chapels I attended in the US and we can see it as far back as the Medici popes and families trying to control the papacy. The human element of the Church.

Laity have gotten over exaggerated and tried to use the Traditional faith to impose things like that a woman must never sit with her legs crossed or men must never use jeans. If you do these things you're not really a traditionalist and somewhere there is some nun that apparently encourages these attitudes. It's a ridiculous problem that I am working against, and not here to name groups or associations but rather seek some sort of authoritative docuмent on the matter.

PG · « **Reply #7 on:** February 24, 2015, 12:46:57 PM »

Centro - Clerics do not "explicitly" endorse these attitudes, but they certainly do "implicitly" endorse them. Most established trad chapels maintain/enforce the dress code when on chapel property for functions even outside of mass. That is a clear message, and the message is that jeans and non collar w/tie shirts are unbecoming. Do they have something against shades of blue(other colors work for denim)? Is it the low thread count? Is it that they don't make jeans out of polyester(the banksters/elites preference, that most dress slacks are made out of)?

PG · « **Reply #8 on:** February 24, 2015, 06:11:25 PM »

I think that this is serious. The only argument against jeans is that sinners wear them(jeans are very popular in this sinful generation); and we don't want to be associated with them. It is in conformity with scripture - "do not emulate evil doers, nor envy them that commit iniquity". But, then, alongside that approach, the suit, collar, tie, and dressy pants is promoted and enforced. But, what types generally wear this outfit? Politicians(the good yet mostly bad) and elites(the "filthy" rich) wear these outfits. Why then is it expedient to associate with them? It doesn't make and catholic sense.

Croix de Fer · « **Reply #9 on:** February 24, 2015, 09:07:42 PM »

Quote from: Luker

Can you clarify just who is sending out orders banning jeans and t shirts? Is this some kind of a lay group you are a part of? Can you let us know the name so I can be sure to avoid them?

Probably some dogmatic and home-alone sede(s) suffering from schizoid personality disorder and / or schizophrenia.

poche · « **Reply #10 on:** February 24, 2015, 10:50:16 PM »

Quote from: Centroamerica

I just received an e-mail from a group of laity that men may not wear jeans and must wear dress shirts only. This is referring to daily life and not just while attending Mass. There is a story behind this I have been told. Something of a certain person bringing the protestant attitude into traditionalist circles. It isn't my place to post details about this but rather stick to the point. The laity may be trying to make up there own modesty rules something to the effect that: if you wear jeans and t-shirts you are not really a traditionalist. Coincidently, the last time I visited one of the homes of one of these lay friends I was traveling after a job proposition while wearing jeans.

Does anybody have any authoritave links on this to help me combat this creeping puritanism in lay traditionalist lay circles?

Thanks.

It looks like somebody has too much time on their hands.

ClarkSmith · « **Reply #11 on:** February 25, 2015, 10:41:34 AM »

Quote from: + PG +

I think that this is serious. The only argument against jeans is that sinners wear them(jeans are very popular in this sinful generation); and we don't want to be associated with them. It is in conformity with scripture - "do not emulate evil doers, nor envy them that commit iniquity". But, then, alongside that approach, the suit, collar, tie, and dressy pants is promoted and enforced. But, what types generally wear this outfit? Politicians(the good yet mostly bad) and elites(the "filthy" rich) wear these outfits. Why then is it expedient to associate with them? It doesn't make and catholic sense.

Generally I think politicians dress for their audience. It's not strange to see a politician wearing a button down shirt and jeans if they're talking to a farming community. Mitt Romney did it.

During the middle ages the nobility wore clothing to differentiate themselves from other classes. In democracy we see the elites trying to appear more average to fool the masses in believing we are all the same.

Are we dressing like the elites or are the elites dressing more like us? Look at Steve Jobs. He led a giant company but wore a turtle neck and jeans all the time

Wearing t-shirts and jeans was popularized by Hollywood and Marlon Brando. I can understand why people that grew up in that era might see it a little different. It was a clear cultural shift..

The French Revolution started the largest cultural shift in fashion. During the revolution breeches were a symbol of the nobility. The revolutionaries instead wore pants to look more like the poor. Read the bold text below. This is why the elites of today dress more like the average man.

Quote

The sans-culotte consisted of the working-class. During the height of the sans-culottes movement, Momoro remarked, "A sans-culotte is someone who goes everywhere on foot, who isn't loaded with money like the rest of you, but lives quietly with his wife and children . . . on the fourth or fifth floor" (Lewis, 102). The reference to the upper floors comes from the fact that the poorer workers tended to occupy the top floors or attics of apartment blocks. Such descriptions are evocative, but misleading. The sans-culotte did not necessarily represent the poorest section of the urban crowd, as pictured above. Some were poor, but the militant sans-culottes were more often than not skilled workers and shopkeepers from the middle class.

The elite members of the sans-culotte preferred the trousers of the working-man. They disdained the breeches of the aristocracy or upper-middle classes. They felt that all classes were equal and, therefore, should not be segregated by fashion. .

Link

Centroamerica · « **Reply #12 on:** February 25, 2015, 10:47:44 AM »

Well, I will confirm that the message does not come from home aloners or sedes, these are friends from Mass. What I am afraid of is that it is the orientation from a nun. I received an excellent response from a priest last night. he said that there is nothing wrong with discouraging jeans, but they should not be prohibited. The attitude that is exagerrated about what you wear sometimes seems very anti-modernist on the outside and lacking virtue on the inside. Young men and laity should take their advice from padres (priests) and not madres (nun superiors). Also jeans are made from cotton while slacks and dress pants are made from polyester, (so which material is more modern?).

Someone said that sinners wear jeans!!! Sinners do lots of things, like breath air and smoke cigarretes, drink beer, but these things are not prohibited.

Like I said originally, I think that it is an inculturation coming from converts from the protestant sects. Johovah's witnesses walk down the street wearing their uniforms so now some newbies who converted 3 years ago want to impose their will on all Catholics that we must never wear jeans.

The serious of the matter is that the email I receieved uses some interesting language.

For example, regarding modesty "we don't have opinions" and "submission" in "all occasions" the modesty must be submitted to "what the Holy Mother Church teaches" and as a "general orientation men must only wear dress pants and dress shirts".

So now I am being told that it is the teaching of the Church that I must never wear a t-shirt and jeans in my daily life, or I am a modernist, not submitting to Holy Mother Church.

Again any docuмents against this creeping puritanism would be very appreciated. If they want to be puritans they can go join the thousand something heretical sects that walk the streets.

Centroamerica · « **Reply #13 on:** February 25, 2015, 10:52:42 AM »

The heart of the issue is if wearing jeans is: against the submission to holy Mother Church regarding modesty.

Is wearing jeans considered immodest, for example when going to the neighborhood grocery store with your wife and more so does the Church teach this?

Does it mean you are not really a traditionalist if you choose to do so?

Elizabeth · « **Reply #14 on:** February 25, 2015, 11:09:34 AM »

Quote from: Centroamerica

The heart of the issue is if wearing jeans is: against the submission to holy Mother Church regarding modesty.

Is wearing jeans considered immodest, for example when going to the neighborhood grocery store with your wife and more so does the Church teach this?

Does it mean you are not really a traditionalist if you choose to do so?

No, men wearing jeans is no sin against modesty.

You may wear your jeans to Mass if you work in them, or if that was all you owned.

The question of whether one is really a traditionalist if he chooses to wear jeans is sad. I am sorry that some bully is trying to dominate whatever group you are in. If this is tolerated by the rest of your group, I hope you will consider keeping an eye out lest it become yet another cult.