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Author Topic: Is refusing to accept an "obvious fact" a sin of lying?  (Read 74635 times)

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Offline DigitalLogos

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Re: Is refusing to accept an "obvious fact" a sin of lying?
« Reply #210 on: December 05, 2021, 11:41:40 AM »
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  • This silly meme is one of those things that actually kind of makes me lean more in the FE camp:

    21369-1080-983


    When the Challenger disaster happened, teachers rolled TVs into the classroom to further indoctrinate the kids.  Do you know that most of the "astronauts" that were "killed" in that disaster are still alive.  Amazingly, 3-4 of them had "identical twins" and the others either slightly changed their names (started using their middle names) and went about their lives (after undoubtedly taking a huge payoff).

    "Be not therefore solicitous for tomorrow; for the morrow will be solicitous for itself. Sufficient for the day is the evil thereof." [Matt. 6:34]

    "In all thy works remember thy last end, and thou shalt never sin." [Ecclus. 7:40]

    "A holy man continueth in wisdom as the sun: but a fool is changed as the moon." [Ecclus. 27:12]

    Online Pax Vobis

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    Re: Is refusing to accept an "obvious fact" a sin of lying?
    « Reply #211 on: December 05, 2021, 01:02:49 PM »
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  • Quote
    2) Could you find that video? I'd be interested in watching it. The detail about the penguins makes a lot of sense, and though the penguins in Antarctica and South Africa belong to different subspecies of penguin,
    It was on YT but I’m not sure where.  A few years ago.


    Offline josefamenendez

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    Re: Is refusing to accept an "obvious fact" a sin of lying?
    « Reply #212 on: December 05, 2021, 02:04:59 PM »
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  • This is my favorite video on why we can't "go back" to the moon....
    Don Pettit from NASA is hysterical. But it seems that the technology to go to Mars is no problem....Did Elon get the memo?


    Offline Romulus

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    Re: Is refusing to accept an "obvious fact" a sin of lying?
    « Reply #213 on: December 05, 2021, 02:07:48 PM »
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  • This is my favorite video on why we can't "go back" to the moon....
    Don Pettit is hysterical. But it seems that the technology to go to Mars is no problem....Did Elon get the memo?
    Elon is kind of on his own boat, at least that's my impression of him. Jeff Bezos hates his guts because one of his satellites blew up that was on one of Elons rockets. 

    Offline josefamenendez

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    Re: Is refusing to accept an "obvious fact" a sin of lying?
    « Reply #214 on: December 05, 2021, 02:10:55 PM »
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  • Satellites don't "orbit". They are usually carried by balloons. Yes ,seriously. Most communications technology is land based anyway.


    Thar she blows


    Offline DigitalLogos

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    Re: Is refusing to accept an "obvious fact" a sin of lying?
    « Reply #215 on: December 05, 2021, 02:29:59 PM »
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  • Satellites don't "orbit". They are usually carried by balloons. Yes ,seriously. Most communications technology is land based anyway.


    Thar she blows
    NASA also has one of the largest helium budgets out there
    "Be not therefore solicitous for tomorrow; for the morrow will be solicitous for itself. Sufficient for the day is the evil thereof." [Matt. 6:34]

    "In all thy works remember thy last end, and thou shalt never sin." [Ecclus. 7:40]

    "A holy man continueth in wisdom as the sun: but a fool is changed as the moon." [Ecclus. 27:12]

    Offline StLouisIX

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    Re: Is refusing to accept an "obvious fact" a sin of lying?
    « Reply #216 on: December 05, 2021, 02:54:04 PM »
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  • It was on YT but I’m not sure where.  A few years ago.
    Ok, I'll see if I can find it or something like it.

    Online moneil

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    Re: Is refusing to accept an "obvious fact" a sin of lying?
    « Reply #217 on: December 05, 2021, 03:47:55 PM »
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  • n reply #159 I asked an honest and simple question regarding why the “edge” of a flat has not been discovered, described, nor pictured, given the amount of exploration that has occurred.

    I cited explorers such as Leif Erikson from the 11h century and Columbus, da Gama, Magellan and Elcano from the 16th century.  To this list can be added James Cook (1773).  Within a year's time in 1820 the Russians Fabian von Bellingshausen and Mikhail Lazarev, the British explorer Edward Bransfield, and the Americans Nathaniel Palmer and John Davis all saw or set foot on Antarctica.  The Norwegian Roald Amundsen reached the South Pole in 1911.  U.S. Admiral Richard Byrd (1888-1957) is another noted Antarctic explorer.

    The only answer my honest, sincere, and simple question received was that because of “the treaty”, and no one could be bothered to even cite its actual name, nor when it was signed, nor by how many countries.

    The Antarctic Treaty was signed on December 1, 1959 by 12 countries, but did not enter into force until June 23, 1961.  There are now 50 nations that have signed or accept the treaty.  This treaty that supposedly prevents us from finding the “edge of the earth meeting the dome of the firmament” did not come into existence until years, decades, or even centuries after the explorers I cited.  This pretty much tells any thinking and rational person all they need to know about the credibility of the “flat earth fantasy”.  “If” the earth were flat someone would have been to the edge by now.

    Here is the actual text of the Antarctic treaty https://www.nsf.gov/geo/opp/antarct/anttrty.jsp




    Offline DigitalLogos

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    Re: Is refusing to accept an "obvious fact" a sin of lying?
    « Reply #218 on: December 05, 2021, 04:46:49 PM »
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  • n reply #159 I asked an honest and simple question regarding why the “edge” of a flat has not been discovered, described, nor pictured, given the amount of exploration that has occurred.

    I cited explorers such as Leif Erikson from the 11h century and Columbus, da Gama, Magellan and Elcano from the 16th century.  To this list can be added James Cook (1773).  Within a year's time in 1820 the Russians Fabian von Bellingshausen and Mikhail Lazarev, the British explorer Edward Bransfield, and the Americans Nathaniel Palmer and John Davis all saw or set foot on Antarctica.  The Norwegian Roald Amundsen reached the South Pole in 1911.  U.S. Admiral Richard Byrd (1888-1957) is another noted Antarctic explorer.

    The only answer my honest, sincere, and simple question received was that because of “the treaty”, and no one could be bothered to even cite its actual name, nor when it was signed, nor by how many countries.

    The Antarctic Treaty was signed on December 1, 1959 by 12 countries, but did not enter into force until June 23, 1961.  There are now 50 nations that have signed or accept the treaty.  This treaty that supposedly prevents us from finding the “edge of the earth meeting the dome of the firmament” did not come into existence until years, decades, or even centuries after the explorers I cited.  This pretty much tells any thinking and rational person all they need to know about the credibility of the “flat earth fantasy”.  “If” the earth were flat someone would have been to the edge by now.

    Here is the actual text of the Antarctic treaty https://www.nsf.gov/geo/opp/antarct/anttrty.jsp
    Because there isn't an "edge" as if the water just pours off into open space. There is a 100-ft ice wall on the circuмference of the plane. You're asking simple questions that have already been covered by countless FEarthers.

    https://tv.gab.com/channel/yafer/view/sorry-antarctica-is-closed-60bb158d366ab51bb7dc9a81
    "Be not therefore solicitous for tomorrow; for the morrow will be solicitous for itself. Sufficient for the day is the evil thereof." [Matt. 6:34]

    "In all thy works remember thy last end, and thou shalt never sin." [Ecclus. 7:40]

    "A holy man continueth in wisdom as the sun: but a fool is changed as the moon." [Ecclus. 27:12]

    Offline Stanley N

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    Re: Is refusing to accept an "obvious fact" a sin of lying?
    « Reply #219 on: December 05, 2021, 06:01:37 PM »
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  • The fact that they do conform rail to accommodate low grades, but never add to that to adjust for earth curvature also shows earth is not a globe.

    If the earth is round, nothing would be needed to adjust rails for the earth's curvature.

    This does not require you to believe the earth actually is round. It's really basic physics.

    Draw a circle on a piece of paper. Are all points on the circle the same distance from the center of the circle? Yes. Is the circle curved? Yes.

    Offline Tradman

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    Re: Is refusing to accept an "obvious fact" a sin of lying?
    « Reply #220 on: December 05, 2021, 06:19:26 PM »
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  • If the earth is round, nothing would be needed to adjust rails for the earth's curvature.

    This does not require you to believe the earth actually is round. It's really basic physics.

    Draw a circle on a piece of paper. Are all points on the circle the same distance from the center of the circle? Yes. Is the circle curved? Yes.
    Hey, I don't care what you believe. But if the earth is a sphere, as opposed to a plane with mountains and valleys, then the difference from reality should be accounted for.  Telling me all points on a circle are the same distance from the center does not explain anything about railroads. All I'm saying is that there is a problem with what we've been told about the globe.  Take your time and investigate before you try to defend the indefensible.  I'm not here to argue. God bless.     


    Offline Stanley N

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    Re: Is refusing to accept an "obvious fact" a sin of lying?
    « Reply #221 on: December 05, 2021, 06:37:55 PM »
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  • Telling me all points on a circle are the same distance from the center does not explain anything about railroads. All I'm saying is that there is a problem with what we've been told about the globe.

    But I'm trying to explain to you why this is not a problem. They may be other problems with a globe earth, but this isn't one.

    A railroad rail on a globe earth lies on a circle on that globe. It is like the points on a circle. Just like all the points on a circle are the same distance from the center, every point on the rail is the same distance from the center of the earth. It is therefore at the same "grade".

    Gravity always points to the center of the earth. Thus it is always perpendicular to any tangent to the circle of the earth. Each segment of rail is a short tangent on the circle. Thus a rail along the earth's curve is always perpendicular to gravity. Any movement on the rail is perpendicular to gravity, thus at the same grade.

    Offline Dankward

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    Re: Is refusing to accept an "obvious fact" a sin of lying?
    « Reply #222 on: December 05, 2021, 06:55:14 PM »
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  • But I'm trying to explain to you why this is not a problem. They may be other problems with a globe earth, but this isn't one.

    A railroad rail on a globe earth lies on a circle on that globe. It is like the points on a circle. Just like all the points on a circle are the same distance from the center, every point on the rail is the same distance from the center of the earth. It is therefore at the same "grade".

    Gravity always points to the center of the earth. Thus it is always perpendicular to any tangent to the circle of the earth. Each segment of rail is a short tangent on the circle. Thus a rail along the earth's curve is always perpendicular to gravity. Any movement on the rail is perpendicular to gravity, thus at the same grade.
    The problem Tradman has with rails on a globe Earth is that of straight beams on a curved surface. This is because he assumes that rails are perfectly straight for hundreds of kilometers on end, like a perfect, idealized straightness with zero deviation.

    This however is not the case, as the picture that Marion posted, of Helsinki Metro Heavy rails  shows. These beams are not perfectly straight, they just bend. Given the sheer size of the globe, this is a non issue in railway planning. It's 0.667 feet of curvature per mile on an idealized perfect globe with an even surface. We can safely disregard that, that's probably less than the height of such a steel beam itself.

    Offline Marion

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    Re: Is refusing to accept an "obvious fact" a sin of lying?
    « Reply #223 on: December 05, 2021, 07:05:56 PM »
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  • They do lay straight track.  It is always level and is never curved downward whatsoever. 

    Refuted using two images.


    Have you ever seen rail road track?

    Talk about fooling yourself.


    unbent track, the way it's manufactured now, can never wrap around a curve or follow the contours of a ball shaped earth. 

    Refuted using two images.

    Tradman seems to be unaware of the fact, that steel bars of whatever size and profile, bend like spaghetti, if their length is sufficently greater than the dimensions of the transverse section. Also, Tradman could be asked his own question: "Have you ever seen rail road track?"

    I made sure, he at least saw two pictures showing rail road track.


    Clearly you did not read my post.  Rail can be adjusted any which way for immediate terrain.  It is NEVER conformed to take in account earth curvature. 

    C'mon, you're trying to take the mickey of the readers. Rail is laid curved on curved terrain, but it won't adapt to globe earth curvature, which is virtually zero for any 120 meters rail unit?





    Please wind to 2'40", or use this link: https://youtu.be/XwiNaHmOscU?t=160

    Rail bending in y-direction. (Note that the steel rail is flexible like spring steel.)

    Go to 8'15" to see the steel rail swinging like spring steel: https://youtu.be/XwiNaHmOscU?t=495
    That meaning of the sacred dogmas is ever to be maintained which has once been declared by holy mother church. (Dei Filius)

    Offline Dankward

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    Re: Is refusing to accept an "obvious fact" a sin of lying?
    « Reply #224 on: December 05, 2021, 07:11:43 PM »
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  • This silly meme is one of those things that actually kind of makes me lean more in the FE camp:

    [FE meme]

    [challenger inconsistencies]
    While I agree that something about the Challenger disaster is once again fishy (pity on you NASA), the FE meme supposes that we're on a spinning ball hurling through space, which may very well not be the case with Geocentrism which has a perfectly still Earth in the absolute center of the Universe. This makes most of the points in the meme pointless. Apart from that, most points come from a mind with very little imagination. "Jesus sees the whole world" - almighty God would be limited to a flat disc? Come on. "Sun, Moon and stars in the firmament" - on a globe Earth there is no firmament? Ridiculous. And stars/meteorites falling to Earth works on a globe Earth just as well, trust me :laugh1:

    Speaking of the firmament, as of yet no flat earther could present a credible model how it is that there are two hemispheres of the firmament depending on which hemisphere of the Earth you're watching from. How does that work on FE, how can it magically switch from the northern firmament with Polaris at the top to the southern firmament with Sigma Octantis at the top, depending on your longitude on the FE disc? I'd love to hear some explanations for this.