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Author Topic: Holy Ghost or Holy Spirit?  (Read 730 times)

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Offline cassini

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Holy Ghost or Holy Spirit?
« on: July 30, 2020, 02:40:57 PM »
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  • Some time back, my wife was attending Monday devotions in which the rosary is said. Throughout the rosary she referred to the Holy Ghost while the priest and others referred to the Holy Spirit.

    Anyway, after the devotions were over the priest came over to my wife and asked her not to be using the term Holy Ghost out loud and to follow the example of the priest at the altar and the reply from the congregation.

    My wife replied she was reared referring the Holy Ghost and would remain calling Him the Holy Ghost. The priest said he was a man of the 60s (a Vatican II victim) and it was the Holy Spirit for him.

    Needless to say this incident was debated among a few friends. The outcome was that this is perhaps one of the more subtle moves towards the one world religion that is ahead of us. You see the Holy Ghost is one distinct person of the Holy Trinity, whereas the Holy Spirit can mean anything. Did you know the Holy Spirit is referred to four times in the Quran, a religion that do not believe in the Trinity God of Catholics. Their Holy Spirit is the Angel Gabrial who we know is not God.

    In the Middle Ages, the title “Holy Spirit” was used to describe or pertain to God's Spirit or the Spirit of the Lord, whereas “Holy Ghost” was used to describe the third person in the Holy Trinity.

    For me I will not use the term Holy Spirit as I consider it the modernising of the Holy Ghost in order to be able to unite the Trinity with the god of pagans. I, and needless to say my wife, will stick to our pre-Vatican II Holy Ghost and they can have their Holy Spirit.

    Just thought I would mention this for discussion.





    Offline forlorn

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    Re: Holy Ghost or Holy Spirit?
    « Reply #1 on: July 30, 2020, 02:52:54 PM »
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  • Spiritus Sanctus in Latin. 

    The Douay-Rheims uses both, so I really don't see the issue with it. The only problem IMO is the priest trying to force its usage. 


    Offline songbird

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    Re: Holy Ghost or Holy Spirit?
    « Reply #2 on: July 30, 2020, 03:18:22 PM »
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  • Holy Ghost.  Holy Spirit came more to be said at Vatican II.  It is explained well on www.traditio.com  Go to library.

    Offline Matthew

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    Re: Holy Ghost or Holy Spirit?
    « Reply #3 on: July 30, 2020, 03:28:24 PM »
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  • This gets brought up all the time.

    Heiliger Geist is Holy Ghost in German.
    Sanctus Spiritus is the same thing in Latin.

    There is no dogmatic reason to use either. NEVERTHELESS, saying "Holy Ghost" is a shibboleth to declare to the world you are Traditional, that you hate Vatican II, etc. -- so we should all use it for that reason alone. Why cause anyone to think you're a Novus Ordo Catholic?

    Even though the term "Holy Spirit" in innocuous, the men behind it were NOT so innocent. They released this new term for the Third Person of the Holy Trinity at the same time they released "the Spirit of Vatican II" on the world. There are many spirits (some good, some evil) but only one Holy Ghost.

    Guess which one Holy Ghost came from? The German. There are a LOT of German descendants in America. There is even a legend that at one point, a single vote prevent the official language of the United States from being German! Even if that is an urban legend, it does show how prevalent German descendants are in America.

    Holy Spirit is a -- I don't want to use negative terms when talking about the Third Person of the Holy Trinity -- let's say an INAPPROPRIATE mix of the German and Latin. Holy from German, and Spirit from Latin.

    Much like using Latin endings to a German word makes it sound ridiculous:
    "I was embiggened by his resolve."

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    Offline SimpleMan

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    Re: Holy Ghost or Holy Spirit?
    « Reply #4 on: July 30, 2020, 03:37:41 PM »
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  • I use "Holy Ghost" in prayer and "Holy Spirit" in theological discourse, teaching, and so on.


    Offline Pax Vobis

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    Re: Holy Ghost or Holy Spirit?
    « Reply #5 on: July 30, 2020, 04:19:00 PM »
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  • And Protestants use the term “spirit” so Holy Ghost is another pro-Catholic reason.  

    Offline Nadir

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    Re: Holy Ghost or Holy Spirit?
    « Reply #6 on: July 30, 2020, 04:29:03 PM »
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  • Storm in a teacup!

    There are numerous threads on this. No need to reinvent the wheel.
    Help of Christians, guard our land from assault or inward stain,
    Let it be what God has planned, His new Eden where You reign.

    Offline Matthew

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    Re: Holy Ghost or Holy Spirit?
    « Reply #7 on: July 30, 2020, 05:52:52 PM »
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  • The spelling is: Heiliger Geist.
    Thanks for the correction. I corrected my post.
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    Offline claudel

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    Re: Holy Ghost or Holy Spirit?
    « Reply #8 on: July 30, 2020, 10:20:17 PM »
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  • Guess which one Holy Ghost came from? The German.

    Strictly speaking, not really. The phrase has been native English since the Anglo-Saxons drove the Brythonic Celts into Wales, Cornwall, Scotland, and the sea. The phrase used by Bede, if I recall aright, is "Hālga Gāst" or "Hālig Gāst."

    Anglo-Saxon—Old English, as it is also called—is a member of the Germanic language family, but at the time it was being spoken, the ancestral equivalent of modern German was, earlier, Old Frisian or Old Saxon and, later, Old High German. In short, the earliest form of a language called English slightly antedates the earliest form of a language called German.

    Thus, "Holy Ghost" is not an import. It has been a term native to English from the beginnings of the language. In Chaucer's dialect, now called Middle English, the form was usually "hooly goost," but probably half a dozen other forms also appear in print.

    Offline fatimarevelation23

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    Re: Holy Ghost or Holy Spirit?
    « Reply #9 on: July 31, 2020, 04:47:35 AM »
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  • Strictly speaking, not really. The phrase has been native English since the Anglo-Saxons drove the Brythonic Celts into Wales, Cornwall, Scotland, and the sea. The phrase used by Bede, if I recall aright, is "Hālga Gāst" or "Hālig Gāst."

    Anglo-Saxon—Old English, as it is also called—is a member of the Germanic language family, but at the time it was being spoken, the ancestral equivalent of modern German was, earlier, Old Frisian or Old Saxon and, later, Old High German. In short, the earliest form of a language called English slightly antedates the earliest form of a language called German.

    Thus, "Holy Ghost" is not an import. It has been a term native to English from the beginnings of the language. In Chaucer's dialect, now called Middle English, the form was usually "hooly goost," but probably half a dozen other forms also appear in print.

    In Novus Ordo Vatican II Churches, you never hear the term Holy Ghost. Trust me I've experienced it.
    If somebody wants to shoot me from a window with a rifle, Nobody can stop it, so why worry about it? - John F. Kennedy, The Morning of November 22nd, 1963.

    Offline Stubborn

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    Re: Holy Ghost or Holy Spirit?
    « Reply #10 on: July 31, 2020, 05:31:50 AM »
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  • "Holy Spirit" became the standard thanks to V2. It is one of those things that changed for the sake of change. Same as "You" and "Your" replaced "Thee" and "Thine," same as the last book of the Bible is now more often referred to as "the book of Revelation" which replaced the "Apocalypse" etc., and so on.

    All changed for the sake of change, all part of the revolution, designed to add to the confusion of the times while helping to promote the idea that, "only the externals changed, all things essential to the Mass and faith remained".

    Do these things above really have a different meaning? No, they all say the same thing, only in terms and a language approved and promoted through the new "church of the New Advent."            
    "But Peter and the apostles answering, said: We ought to obey God, rather than men." - Acts 5:29

    The Highest Principle in the Church: "We are first of all under obedience to God, and only then under obedience to man" - Fr. Hesse


    Offline Kolar

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    Re: Holy Ghost or Holy Spirit?
    « Reply #11 on: July 31, 2020, 07:11:20 AM »
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  • There is only one Holy Ghost.
    There are many holy spirits.

    Online Ladislaus

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    Re: Holy Ghost or Holy Spirit?
    « Reply #12 on: July 31, 2020, 07:15:20 AM »
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  • I actually have a personal preference for Spirit ...

    1) because it's more Latinate, and I'm more inclined to the Latin

    2) Ghost has picked up some unwanted connotations in recent decades, as in Casper the Friendly ...

    but either one is OK and valid.

    I knew of one person who doubted his kids' Baptism because the priest used Holy Spirit instead of Holy Ghost.  That's nonsense.

    To Matthew's point, however, if I do use Holy Spirit among Traditional Catholics, I immediately become suspect of Modernism, so I tend to use Holy Ghost among Traditional Catholics.  Most of the time when I pray the Rosary on my own, however, I just say it in Latin, so it's a non-issue for me.

    Online Ladislaus

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    Re: Holy Ghost or Holy Spirit?
    « Reply #13 on: July 31, 2020, 07:17:45 AM »
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  • There is only one Holy Ghost.
    There are many holy spirits.

    There is only one Holy Spirit, but many holy ghosts.

    Offline cassini

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    Re: Holy Ghost or Holy Spirit?
    « Reply #14 on: July 31, 2020, 07:25:42 AM »
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  • Thanks for the correction. I corrected my post.

    Lucky you Matthew, we're stuck with our mistakes.