Catholic Info
Traditional Catholic Faith => Catholic Living in the Modern World => Topic started by: Kephapaulos on September 14, 2007, 10:15:43 PM
-
1) What should we do about All Hallow's Eve concerning how it is celebrated now in the secular world?
2) I feel like the whole fake Santa Claus story is like a lie to children. Should we just tell them the truth first of all? Like who St. Nicholas really was?
-
Kephapaulos wrote:
1) What should we do about All Hallow's Eve concerning how it is celebrated now in the secular world?
2) I feel like the whole fake Santa Claus story is like a lie to children. Should we just tell them the truth first of all? Like who St. Nicholas really was?
Good topic. With the holidays coming up, I've been thinking about this myself. Dont have any easy answers yet. Here are some thoughts...
...Halloween (the Vigil of the Feast of All Saint's) is the night before a Holy Day of Obligation which also happens to be a very important feast in the Liturgical Year. There must be some good Catholic tradition associated with this Vigil that can be resurrected?
That said, I asked my priest (fairly well known & authoritative in SSPX circles) about Halloween and what we should do as Catholics. His opinion was that it was all right to celebrate along with the common tradition of "trick-or-treating", but not to dress oneself or one's children as anything demonic or that could be interpreted as Satanic, demonic, or in any other way anti-Catholic. I understand his recommendation, but I'm not at all sure that is even the best solution.
Now, Santa Claus... The whole ueber-commercialised, Coca-Cola Elf-thing is starting to wear on my Catholic conscience over the years. The two concepts -- St. Nicholas and Christmas -- are distinct. The Feast of St. Nicholas is celebrated on 6 December and is oriented around that particular saint, whereas Christmas is centred on Christ. Gift-giving, as far as I know, was done on St. Nicholas' Day, and it was originally very modest. Somehow, somewhere along the way, the two got blended together. I dont know why or how.
I do think that the tale of Santa Claus living at the North Pole with a bunch of elves is a ridiculous fairy-tale and I'm not at all convinced it is "Catholic-enough". Moreover, the emphasis on "being a good boy/girl so Santa Claus brings you presents" seems to be directed towards Materialism and Religious Indifferentism. I.e., What does "being a good boy/girl" entail? "Good" according to what standard? And, the gift-giving seems to be an effort to fill the space beneath the tree to overflowing with gifts, most of which probably will be forgotten by next Christmas. So, if you're "good" your tree will be "full"? What if you are poor but live a truly good, Holy life?
Pax tecuŠ¼
-
1) What should we do about All Hallow's Eve concerning how it is celebrated now in the secular world?
2) I feel like the whole fake Santa Claus story is like a lie to children. Should we just tell them the truth first of all? Like who St. Nicholas really was?
Please excuse me, but my answers will not be entirely serious:
1. What should we do? Dress up as the saints, religious, priests, etc. Then, proceed door-to-door, offering to exorcise them and their guests (the trick-or-treat kiddies). :scratchchin:
2. I remember watching a European film once in which a relative would dress up for the Feast of St. Nicholas, bringing the kids gifts then. You may not have to dress up as old man (if you don't want to :rolleyes:), but there is something here to consider. If you wish to get away from the Santa Claus myth as we know it today, why not have, at least, a small celebration for the Feast of St. Nicholas with your family? Go to Mass or Divine Liturgy and then sit down, as a family, for a nice meal! How's that sound?
-
1) What should we do about All Hallow's Eve concerning how it is celebrated now in the secular world?
I haven't figured this one out yet, but as a parent who's not a costume designer, I'm not incredibly fond of the All Saint's Day party idea to have the kids (and often adults too) dress as saints.
2) I feel like the whole fake Santa Claus story is like a lie to children. Should we just tell them the truth first of all? Like who St. Nicholas really was?
Yes, tell them the truth. It's lies like Santa Claus that might make it difficult for a child to understand that God is real and not just a story that they'll someday find to be untrue.
I spoke with a fellow parishioner once about St. Nicholas traditions and she told us about her childhood experiences in Poland. (I think I have the details correct...) The parishioners would wrap and bring gifts on or close to St. Nicholas' Feast Day, one adult would dress as St. Nicholas, he would distribute a gift to each of the children.
I've also read the idea of mentioning that Christmas gifts are presents from baby Jesus. But, I don't see how we could apply that practically as many of the presents clearly say "from Grandpa." :smirk:
-
Here's something re: Halloween:
http://www.traditio.com/tradlib/faq11.txt (http://www.traditio.com/tradlib/faq11.txt)
As always, approach Traditio with caution.
-
Here's something re: Halloween:
http://www.traditio.com/tradlib/faq11.txt (http://www.traditio.com/tradlib/faq11.txt)
As always, approach Traditio with caution.
Very interesting. I had heard the Irish custom, but the French and English additions to explain today's Halloween were new to me.
I wonder what else the Irish did on that day? Surely it would have been more than just beating a few pots for the tradition to have survived.
-
A mexican lady in my office told me that the mexican custom is to give gifts for twelve days, starting Christmas day, and lasting through the Christmas octave I guess. She said it had something to do with the wise men giving gifts to Christ.
For Christmas, I'd like to do sort of a blending if I have kids in the future. Wait until Christmas eve to put up the tree and have that be something to do to go along with midnight Mass. Then go ahead and have presents on Christmas day, many that show up as a surprise, and from Santa. But just explain to them it's a practice of generosity, giving without getting credit for it. Not that Santa comes down the chimney or anything, just that a "from Santa" represents the spirit of giving. And yes, I'd seriously tone it down compared to the huge amount of gifts I see my niece get every year.
As far as halloween... I'm not sure what to do about that one. It would depend on what my neighborhood did about it, if they had wholesome activities for kids or anything. I certainly wouldn't want it to be the nauseating candy-fest it was for me as a kid.
-
1) What should we do about All Hallow's Eve concerning how it is celebrated now in the secular world?
2) I feel like the whole fake Santa Claus story is like a lie to children. Should we just tell them the truth first of all? Like who St. Nicholas really was?
This a tough one, particularly if your spouse does not agree with you. I have taught my youngest son that there is no such thing as Santa Claus, but rather have taught him about St. Nicholas instead and why it is we celebrate Christmas by giving gifts. My son is no worse for it, in fact he's been fine with the no Santa all along, he'll be 7 the week before Christmas this year.
As for Halloween and all it entails in the secular world, I'd personally like to ditch the whole thing and just celebrate it all the way Catholics were meant to, but my spouse does not agree. I'd like to dress our son as a Saint this year, but I'll probably lose that battle. But there will be no ghoulish costume that's for sure.
-
Dennis is correct.
I have included ahttp://www.ewtn.com/library/FAMILY/TRAPP.TXT link. One thing we should all learn is that the customs of Catholic families had changed greatly since the "New Springtime" of the Church began. Catholic families have more customs and traditions and days to celebrate than "the world" and there is simply no need for us to try to figure out how to fit in and blend with the traditions of the world. My children know Santa Claus was a falsehood started by those against the Church, they know St. Nicolas is a friend of Jesus they can pray to and they know that the gifts are given from the parents to celebrate the birth of Christ.
As far as Halloween, well this was a dilemma only when I was Novus Ordo, (though I must admit it was dumb the few times I went early on with my oldest children as we had to come home quickly because they were so frightened by all of the ghastly sites out there). Then, as soon as I left the Novus Ordo and became Catholic I left Halloween and any other secular, masonic new age garbage far behind and never looked back. We have soooo many days to celebrate and so many real Customs to follow my children do not know the difference and as a matter of fact feel sorry for all those outside the Church and in the world that those people have nothing to make them happy.
-
http://www.ewtn.com/library/FAMILY/TRAPP.TXT
ALL SOULS' DAY
Toward the end of the year, on November 2nd, the Church sets a day aside
which is devoted to the suffering souls in Purgatory. Just as we turn to
our big sisters and brothers, the saints, to intercede for us at the
throne of God, the poor souls are also turning toward us "Have pity on
me, have pity on me, at least you, my friends, because the hand of the
Lord has touched me" (Job 19:21; Office of the Dead). Helpless in
themselves, since the purification they are undergoing is passive
suffering, they can be helped by us. We can pray for them. We can offer
up sacrifices and good works with the desire that God may accept them
and, seeing in them the prayer and suffering rise from the Mystical Body
of His only Son, hasten the delivery of those souls whom He deems worthy
and ready for such help. On the day of "all the faithful departed" the
Church reminds her children to listen to the message of the Scriptures in
her liturgy and to do some thinking and meditating on Purgatory and the
holy souls there.
We know Purgatory is a realm of twilight, so to speak--an in-between
darkness and light, a place of regret and longing. Of the suffering which
is undergone there, we are told that it is bitter and great, that it
surpasses all imaginable suffering here on earth as an ocean surpasses a
little puddle.
A knowledge of Purgatory we find already in the Old Testament. Two
hundred years before Christ Judas Machabeus "making a gathering...sent
twelve thousand drachms of silver to Jerusalem for sacrifice to be
offered for the sins of the dead, thinking well and religiously
concerning the resurrection, (for if he had not hoped that they that were
slain should rise again, it would have seemed superfluous and vain to
pray for the dead); and because he considered that they who had fallen
asleep with godliness, had great grace laid up for them. It is,
therefore, a holy and wholesome thought to pray for the dead, that they
may be loosed from their sins" (II Macc. 12:43-46).
All Souls' Day is a solemn day for families. We mothers must tell our
children again about the Communion of Saints, which functions in the same
way as life in a large family, where each member depends on the others.
In this case, the poor souls depend on us. They depend on our love, but
love does not consist in words only, it consists in deeds. The sooner the
little ones learn to understand this, the better it is for their whole
life. On All Souls' Day they will be encouraged to bring little
sacrifices, to say special prayers. They will be told about the
"thesaurus ecclesiae," the golden treasure chest of Holy Church filled
with the atoning sacrifice of Christ, the merits of the Blessed Virgin,
of the saints--canonized and uncanonized--into which we may delve. It was
given to Peter to bind and loosen, and his successor, making use of that
very power, sets the conditions under which this can be done. One such
disposition is the "toties quoties" indulgence each time we visit a
parish church on the second of November and say six "Our Fathers," six
"Hail Marys," and six "Glorys," we may gain a plenary indulgence
applicable to the poor souls.
All Souls' Day is also the date when we remind our children that on the
solemn day of their baptism the Church lit the baptismal candle and said:
"Receive this burning light and see thou guard the grace of thy baptism
without blame. Keep the Commandments of God so that when the Lord shall
come to call thee to the nuptials, thou mayst meet Him with all the
Saints in the heavenly court, there to live forever and ever." This
baptismal candle of our children we should wrap reverently and keep in a
special place together with our own. If, as happened to us, these candles
are no longer in the family (we could not take along such things from the
old country), one can take candles blessed on Candlemas Day, tie the
names of each child to a candle, and keep them in a special place. This
is what we did. Only Johannes, being born in this country, has his own
original baptismal candle. On All Souls' Day we take the candles out and
look at them and remind each other to light our candle for any of us in
case of sudden death, as a symbol that we want to die in our baptismal
innocence, that the light which was kindled at that solemn moment has not
been extinguished voluntarily by us. It is always a solemn moment when
the children are called to think of their parents' death.
In the old country the great event of the day used to be the visit to the
cemetery. First I have to describe an Austrian cemetery. Out in the
country every village has its cemetery around the church; bigger towns
have them on the outskirts. Every grave is a flower bed at the head of
which is a crucifix, sometimes of wrought iron, sometimes carved in wood.
Occasionally there are also tombstones. Families take care of their
graves individually. People who have moved elsewhere will pay the
cemetery keeper to do it for them. The German word for cemetery is
"Gottesacker," meaning "God's acre." In the summer it looks like a big
flower garden. People are constantly coming and going, working on their
graves, or just praying for their loved ones. On anniversaries you will
see vigil lights burning and on All Souls' Day every grave will have its
little vigil light as a token that we do remember. People will flock out
to the cemeteries in the early evening because it is such a sight--those
many, many flames and all the mounds covered with flowers. Slowly one
walks up and down the aisles, stopping at the graves of relatives and
friends to say a short prayer and sprinkle them with holy water.
When the father of our family died several years ago, we started our own
old-world cemetery. Soon one of his children followed him and now there
are two flower-covered mounds under the large carved-wood crucifix. The
lanterns are lit not only on the anniversaries and on All Souls' Day, but
every Saturday night. A hedge of "rosa multiflora" encircles this holy
spot. Inside the hedge there is a bench and we often sit there in the
peace and quiet of our little acre of God.
-
"As for Halloween and all it entails in the secular world, I'd personally like to ditch the whole thing and just celebrate it all the way Catholics were meant to,..."
And how, exactly, are Catholics meant to celebrate Halloween? If I understand things correctly, Halloween is (or was) simply the Vigil of All Saint's Day. But, does the Church celebrate Halloween as a Vigil anymore? It would seem to me that, that would be the answer for Catholics.
-
-
In my area, the home schoolers get together every year and have an all saints party. Volunteering adults make up games for various ages, but kids get a piece of candy whether they win or loose. They are invited to come dressed as anything God created, (though preferably not the devil), and dressing as a saint was popular... Also, I might add, that as the kids asked one another "who are you supposed to be?" they learned a thing or two about the various saints that perhaps they didn't know before. Some of the games, also, were religious... like identifying the various pictures of Mary according to her titles, like Our Lady of Fatima.
In this way, kids didn't have to go out on the streets and see gruesome things and perhaps get teased by other, older kids for being something that wasn't demonic. They got plenty of candy, but not enough to rot the teeth out of their heads. They got to meet other Catholic kids and play in an environment where being Catholic was normal, not awkward. And they had the fun of playing the games. There were also treats and refreshments for both kids and adults baked by volunteers. Admission was one bag of candy. It was held in the basement of a Catholic or Christian school, I believe.
Such gatherings I think are all around good for kids, and help stamp out the idea that trick or treat is cool/good, and being good is lame.
As for Santa Claus... one very nice idea I heard was a family that attributed the gifts to the Christ Child. How true, since all blessings come from Him.
Hats off to the people who are doing things like this, to make kids feel good about their Catholicism in a world that tries to make them ashamed of it.
-
I simply cannot agree with the heavy use of candy and "refreshments" (read: cookies, cake, brownies, sugary drinks, etc.) in celebrating important religious feasts!!! Would you show up for Mass intoxicated? Would you invite belly dancers to your wedding? Our culture is so besotted by sugar that we have forgotten that it is NOT food. Research the history of sugar and you will see clearly Satan's hand at work. The book SUGAR BLUES is an excellent resource.
If you are scoffing at me at this moment, think to yourself whether you can imagine your life with NO sugar at all. You cannot live without water or oxygen, but if you cannot imagine having to live without sugar, then you are beholden to it and not the other way around.
See http://ratiocinationandtheinexplicable.blogspot.com/2007/10/separate-but-equal-is-this-really-what.html
for further discussion of this topic.
What does this have to do with Halloween and Santa Claus? Halloween has really become little more than a holiday that revolves around candy to a point that no serious person could say that it is not gluttonous! How can we teach children virtue among gluttony?
Sharing a meal among friends is a good thing; eating every time you have a get-together of any size or duration is not. The best gift you can give your children is to teach them continence in this respect. If you choose to have sugar, limit it to small amounts for special occasions, and not religious ones.
Ok, sorry, I'll step off my soapbox now.
-
I agree completely.
We've lost track of just how far off course we are. The ONLY time I see things clearly -- objectively -- is after I've read a book on the life of a saint. It gives a window on more normal times, and Catholic living.
It's true -- how can one teach mortification, when indulgence is all around you? When a child never has to suffer a temperature lower than 70, or higher than 78, how can that child learn to suffer? Life is about suffering WELL, in union with Christ.
My general philosophy on food is "If God made it, eat it. If man made it, avoid it like poison" but it's very hard to be "perfect" in this regard.
If we ever want to eat out, eat food from relatives, etc. we have to eat a bit of margarine, etc. but even then, we avoid the plague of "Splenda" that some of our relatives have fallen pray to.
Matthew
-
:scratchchin:
Nothing like equating sugar and satan to really kill a conversation, eh?
-
If sugar is not food, then what can it be used for? Don't we need glucose, which is a sugar, for our energy though? Sucrose, or table sugar, has glucose in it I think.
-
That's one of my favorite questions, because it really sums up the dichotomy between modern medicine and traditional care of the body.
Yes, your body more or less runs on glucose, and yes, sugar is composed of glucose and fructose. Therefore it technically does contain this necessary ingredient in a very simple, easy form; it also supplies a large number of calories in a small package. Sounds ideal, doctor.
Unfortunately, when you remove the terms "glucose" "sugar" and "calories" from the vacuum in which we just spoke of them, you find that "food" equals more than just "glucose" and "calories" and that your body needs a great deal more than just "sugar" to function properly.
Your body needs a broad spectrum of nutrients, vitamins and minerals, without which it cannot properly regulate your blood sugar (or anything else for that matter). Sugar has no vitamins, minerals, or nutrients of any sort. That's why you've often heard it referred to as "empty calories". Our body gets more than enough sugar from the carbohydrates we eat, be they grains, vegetables or fruits. It has no need whatsoever for any sugar other than what is already contained in these whole foods that also provide it with necessary vitamins, minerals and fiber.
One of the worst things you can do for your body is to feed it with foods that have been stripped, denuded and denatured, which covers everything from white rice to white flour to hydrolyzed anything to partially hydrogenated anything. Our bodies cannot use these substances, nor can it clean them up and get them back out of your body without using up a lot of vitamins, minerals, etc.
Bottom line: when you eat nutrient-depleted foods, not only do you not get nutrients from them that your body needs, your poor body has to use what nutrients it has stored up (if any) to clean up the mess the nutrient-depleted "foods" make inside your body.
Nike says "just do it"
Your body is God's temple, and it says "just stop it!!!"