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Author Topic: Fr Jenkins: COVID vaccine  (Read 902 times)

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Offline 2Vermont

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Fr Jenkins: COVID vaccine
« on: December 24, 2020, 02:19:38 PM »
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  • I thought I'd share Fr Jenkins' very recent video on the COVID vaccine:





    For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. (Matthew 24:24)


    Offline Matthew

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    Re: Fr Jenkins: COVID vaccine
    « Reply #1 on: December 24, 2020, 02:24:12 PM »
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  • Can you summarize? A lot of people (myself included) much prefer an article, which I can read quickly, skim, etc. to a video which pretty much has to be watched 1:1 (unless it's on a platform which allows you to speed up the playback, and even then -- who wants to hear commentary from a chipmunk?)

    Is he again' it?
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    Offline 2Vermont

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    Re: Fr Jenkins: COVID vaccine
    « Reply #2 on: December 24, 2020, 03:08:43 PM »
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  • Can you summarize? A lot of people (myself included) much prefer an article, which I can read quickly, skim, etc. to a video which pretty much has to be watched 1:1 (unless it's on a platform which allows you to speed up the playback, and even then -- who wants to hear commentary from a chipmunk?)

    Is he again' it?
    Yes, he is against it, but he doesn't seem to agree that someone who did take it would be guilty of mortal sin due to the abortion connections.  It seems like his issue with this vaccine goes beyond that (which I agree with entirely). I'm actually hoping others will watch it to help me sort it out.  His purpose was to help clarify his position/the issue and how it relates to moral theology, but I'm not sure he succeeded (as far as I am concerned anyway).
    For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. (Matthew 24:24)

    Offline Stubborn

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    Re: Fr Jenkins: COVID vaccine
    « Reply #3 on: December 25, 2020, 07:21:12 AM »
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  • I thought I'd share Fr Jenkins' very recent video on the COVID vaccine:


    He never actually answers the question clearly imo. I wish he would have answered the question first, then referenced theologians' teachings to support that answer, but for most of the talk, what he does is give a lot of different scenarios that may or may not apply and basically ends up leaving the morality of taking the vaccine open.  

    Through it all, I'm getting that Fr. Jenkins is saying it is *not* sinful to take the vaccine - depending on whether or not you need it to save your life or do your job, or to be more precise, he would take it if needed in order for him to perform his duties as a priest.

    He focuses on how taking the vaccine does *not* mean we are complicit in the sin of abortion, but he does so by referencing different theological examples which, imo, do not clearly apply, or, depending on one's views it's perhaps better said, examples which clearly do not apply. He's usually pretty clear when it comes to other subjects, but he makes no sense to me on this matter. It's almost as if he is focusing on an abortion almost as a one time event used to make a vaccine, not an industry.  

    36:40-36:50 He would take it
    40:40-41:10 We are not complicit




    "But Peter and the apostles answering, said: We ought to obey God, rather than men." - Acts 5:29

    The Highest Principle in the Church: "We are first of all under obedience to God, and only then under obedience to man" - Fr. Hesse

    Offline 2Vermont

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    Re: Fr Jenkins: COVID vaccine
    « Reply #4 on: December 25, 2020, 07:35:32 AM »
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  • He never actually answers the question clearly imo. I wish he would have answered the question first, then referenced theologians' teachings to support that answer, but for most of the talk, what he does is give a lot of different scenarios that may or may not apply and basically ends up leaving the morality of taking the vaccine open.  

    Through it all, I'm getting that Fr. Jenkins is saying it is *not* sinful to take the vaccine - depending on whether or not you need it to save your life or do your job, or to be more precise, he would take it if needed in order for him to perform his duties as a priest.

    He focuses on how taking the vaccine does *not* mean we are complicit in the sin of abortion, but he does so by referencing different theological examples which, imo, do not clearly apply, or, depending on one's views it's perhaps better said, examples which clearly do not apply. He's usually pretty clear when it comes to other subjects, but he makes no sense to me on this matter. It's almost as if he is focusing on an abortion almost as a one time event used to make a vaccine, not an industry.  

    36:40-36:50 He would take it
    40:40-41:10 We are not complicit
    Thank you Stubborn.  I think I would concur with most of what you have written.  I would disagree with your comments re: his comments about individual abortion vs the industry because I believe he gave other scenarios/activities where he clearly explains that we would not be complicit in "abortion"...not an abortion.  Although he never says "the industry", it's clear to me that he is talking about the whole issue of abortion and anything that pertains to it.  I can't remember exactly, but I think he mentions that giving our business to companies that give money to Planned Parenthood would not make us complicit in abortion (or something that effect).
    For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. (Matthew 24:24)


    Offline Stubborn

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    Re: Fr Jenkins: COVID vaccine
    « Reply #5 on: December 25, 2020, 08:33:23 AM »
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  • Thank you Stubborn.  I think I would concur with most of what you have written.  I would disagree with your comments re: his comments about individual abortion vs the industry because I believe he gave other scenarios/activities where he clearly explains that we would not be complicit in "abortion"...not an abortion.  Although he never says "the industry", it's clear to me that he is talking about the whole issue of abortion and anything that pertains to it.  I can't remember exactly, but I think he mentions that giving our business to companies that give money to Planned Parenthood would not make us complicit in abortion (or something that effect).
    See, it was not clear to me. I personally do not think many of the scenarios applied, but some could have - the scenarios were  all subjective - imo.  

    To answer the matter, this is how I wish the interview went:
    Q. Father, is it a sin to take a vaccine in which cells of murdered infants are in the vaccine?
    A. Yes, and here's why... / or No, and here's why... / or Maybe and here's why....

    But overall, he seems to divorce the taking of the vaccine, with any complicity or moral implications, but does so based on personal needs and society's habits.

    He said something like this - - "Buying gas from Shell Oil is not a sin because we need the product, it is not our fault Shell Oil uses some of our money to help fund Planned Parenthood....but if no one bought from Shell Oil...."

    And that's where he leaves it, basically saying it's no sin to buy gas from Shell Oil, which I can agree with, but for me, I cannot wholly tie that scenario to the vaccine issue. Using his scenarios to exemplify the vaccine issue can be like a brain teaser if you let it - again, that's just imo.



         
    "But Peter and the apostles answering, said: We ought to obey God, rather than men." - Acts 5:29

    The Highest Principle in the Church: "We are first of all under obedience to God, and only then under obedience to man" - Fr. Hesse

    Offline 2Vermont

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    Re: Fr Jenkins: COVID vaccine
    « Reply #6 on: December 26, 2020, 07:52:11 AM »
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  • See, it was not clear to me. I personally do not think many of the scenarios applied, but some could have - the scenarios were  all subjective - imo.  

    To answer the matter, this is how I wish the interview went:
    Q. Father, is it a sin to take a vaccine in which cells of murdered infants are in the vaccine?
    A. Yes, and here's why... / or No, and here's why... / or Maybe and here's why....

    But overall, he seems to divorce the taking of the vaccine, with any complicity or moral implications, but does so based on personal needs and society's habits.

    He said something like this - - "Buying gas from Shell Oil is not a sin because we need the product, it is not our fault Shell Oil uses some of our money to help fund Planned Parenthood....but if no one bought from Shell Oil...."

    And that's where he leaves it, basically saying it's no sin to buy gas from Shell Oil, which I can agree with, but for me, I cannot wholly tie that scenario to the vaccine issue. Using his scenarios to exemplify the vaccine issue can be like a brain teaser if you let it - again, that's just imo. 
    I thought he did get into the moral theology in the beginning, but as he said, the moral theology is complex (and I think it is because of that complexity that he veered off into those examples hoping that would better explain things for lay folk).  Having said that, I agree that it would have been much better if it was presented as you suggested. I get frustrated when I listen to talks that do not seem to stay focused. 
    For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. (Matthew 24:24)

    Offline gladius_veritatis

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    Re: Fr Jenkins: COVID vaccine
    « Reply #7 on: December 26, 2020, 01:53:54 PM »
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  • Who cares what he has to say?  His grasp of moral theology is little better than that of my dogs.  He (and his buddies at the SSPV) has habitually pursued a course of unjustified refusal of the Sacraments to people who disagree with him about disputable and disputed matters, ironically making himself a public sinner because of his sinful treatment of others.

    As to the vaccine, unless you are brain-dead, it should be crystal clear that willfully accepting it would rank among the worst decisions of your life.  One need not consult ignoramuses like Jenkins (or any other poorly trained priest of Traddieland, none of whom actually holds any office whatsoever) to know The Vaxx is BAD NEWS.
    "Fear God, and keep His commandments: for this is all man."


    Offline 2Vermont

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    Re: Fr Jenkins: COVID vaccine
    « Reply #8 on: December 26, 2020, 02:14:33 PM »
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  • Who cares what he has to say?  His grasp of moral theology is little better than that of my dogs.  He (and his buddies at the SSPV) has habitually pursued a course of unjustified refusal of the Sacraments to people who disagree with him about disputable and disputed matters, ironically making himself a public sinner because of his sinful treatment of others.

    As to the vaccine, unless you are brain-dead, it should be crystal clear that willfully accepting it would rank among the worst decisions of your life.  One need not consult ignoramuses like Jenkins (or any other poorly trained priest of Traddieland, none of whom actually holds any office whatsoever) to know The Vaxx is BAD NEWS.
    Before your re-entry, a number of people here have been discussing the moral theology that pertains to this vaccine despite the fact that we all agree that taking it is "bad news" because there could come a time when Catholics are required to take it.  So the issue of whether it is a SIN to take it is pretty important.  Some care what traditional Catholics priests say despite their positions.  Some even care what Novus Ordo priests say.  I posted this video for those who do care.
    For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. (Matthew 24:24)

    Offline gladius_veritatis

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    Re: Fr Jenkins: COVID vaccine
    « Reply #9 on: December 26, 2020, 02:25:34 PM »
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  • Before your re-entry, a number of people here have been discussing the moral theology that pertains to this vaccine despite the fact that we all agree that taking it is "bad news" because there could come a time when Catholics are required to take it.  So the issue of whether it is a SIN to take it is pretty important.  Some care what traditional Catholics priests say despite their positions.  Some even care what Novus Ordo priests say.  I posted this video for those who do care.

    It is a sin to knowingly put extremely poisonous trash into your bloodstream, period, or to allow it to be put into the bodies of those for whom you are responsible.  One cannot willingly commit a venial sin, even if doing so would save all of creation.  

    I know why you posted the video; you know why I responded as I did. Godspeed.
    "Fear God, and keep His commandments: for this is all man."

    Offline 2Vermont

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    Re: Fr Jenkins: COVID vaccine
    « Reply #10 on: December 26, 2020, 05:53:58 PM »
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  • It is a sin to knowingly put extremely poisonous trash into your bloodstream, period, or to allow it to be put into the bodies of those for whom you are responsible.  One cannot willingly commit a venial sin, even if doing so would save all of creation.  

    I know why you posted the video; you know why I responded as I did. Godspeed.
    Ah, I didn't know at first, but it is coming back to me now.  You think all trad priests are "vagus".
    For there shall arise false Christs and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders, insomuch as to deceive (if possible) even the elect. (Matthew 24:24)