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Author Topic: Forgive So We Can Live and Let Live  (Read 1707524 times)

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Forgive So We Can Live and Let Live
« on: September 14, 2023, 05:18:55 AM »
Here is a letter from a Father Sean Sheehy, an Irish priest who's homily against abortion went worldwide after he was criticisded for it in Irish media.God works in strange ways.

God has given us emotions so that we can handle all our feelings that are generated by our thoughts. Every time we interpret something – a look, a word, a scene, a touch, a stance, or a principle – feelings, positive or negative, follow from our interpretation. Strong feelings seek expression in action. Action expresses and defines our character – at least in that moment. Feelings never just happen. They’re always preceded by thoughts. Our thoughts lead us to feel good, sad, bad, joyful, happy, anxious, angry, fearful, guilty, responsible, numb, frustrated, etc. Our feelings identify how we want to relate to the world at any given situation. It’s silly to deny feelings. Instead we need to manage them lest they control us and lead us to behavior we regret. So how do we manage our feelings? We use our emotions.
  Emotions and feelings are often confused. People who’re upset or crying are often labeled as “emotional.” But actually they are simply expressing their feelings.  What matters is whether they are being controlled by their feelings or their feelings are being directed by their emotions. Emotions are gifts from God enabling us to decide the most effective way to express how we feel. Four basic emotions are anger, fear, guilt, and love. Anger and fear direct us to protect ourselves from threats to our safety. Guilt directs us to take responsibility for our sins. Love directs us to connect with others. We can use any emotion to direct any feeling, positive or negative. For example, I can have an angry feeling toward someone and express it through the emotion of anger, fear, guilt, or love. I can have an angry feeling toward someone and use my emotion of guilt to express it by taking personal responsibility for it and apologizing for it. I can also express it through the emotion of anger by constructively confronting the person toward whom I have the angry feeling. The relationship between feelings and emotions can be a whole study in itself. When we use emotions to direct our feelings we act rationally. When we let our feelings direct us we lose control and act irrationally. God wants us to be in control of ourselves so we can do His will. This week God speaks to us about anger and mercy.
  As an emotion anger is a gift from God. But In the Book of Sirach (27:30-28:9), God tells us that, “Wrath and anger are hateful things …” Jesus’ Church lists anger as one of the seven deadly sins? How can anger be a gift and a sin at the same time? Wasn’t Jesus angry? “And He looked around at them with anger, grieved at the hardness of their heart …” (Mk 3:5). What are we to make of this?
    God isn’t talking about the emotion of anger, which is a gift from Him. The emotion of anger is part of being human. It generates the energy we need to attack what threatens our security. But it’s how we attack that makes the difference. When we choose our emotion of anger to attack an enemy we’ll be in control of our action and God will be guiding us through His gift. When our angry feeling directs our attack we’ll not be in control and so will act destructively. Anger becomes a hateful thing when we attack destructively. Murder, revenge, self-harm, or wishing evil upon others are the result of angry feelings that are expressed in hateful actions towards others or toward oneself. It’s normal to feel anger when somebody wrongs us and threatens our safety. If we choose our emotion of anger to express our feelings God will lead us to act constructively. Angry feelings move us toward vengeance that blind us to God’s will. We must remember that, “The vengeful will suffer the Lord’s vengeance, for He remembers their sins in detail.”
  Forgiveness restores our emotions to their rightful role in managing our feelings when we are wronged. God’s Word teaches us to, “Forgive your neighbor’s injustice; then when you pray, your own sins will be forgiven.” Too often we react to injustice with angry feelings and seek revenge. Vengeful behavior causes destruction, which can’t be healed except by repentance and reconciliation. Sirach asks a reasonable question: “How can you expect healing from the Lord if you nourish anger against another?” Unless we’re hypocritical, we can’t. We have to change our vengeful feelings by replacing our vengeful thoughts with thoughts of repentance, forgiveness, and reconciliation. To live peacefully we must forgive and let live. That doesn’t mean we don’t confront the wrongdoer; we do, but through our God-given emotions that direct our feelings in a positive manner. Sirach asks another reasonable question: “How can a person refuse to be merciful toward another and ask for mercy himself or herself?” Again, we can’t, if we’re honest. God will give us only what we are willing to give others.
  Jesus tells us that in God’s mind forgiveness is reciprocal. To be forgiven we must be willing to forgive.  Jesus made it part of the prayer He gave us: “Forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us” (Mt 6:12). He enshrined it in one of the Beatitudes (Mt 5:7) and instituted it as a special Sacrament of His Church (Jn 20:23). The condition for receiving God’s forgiveness is our willingness to forgive others. That calls for us to change our feelings by changing our thinking through God’s grace. We do that by replacing our thoughts with God’s thoughts. St. Peter asked Jesus if it was enough to forgive his brother who sinned against him seven times. Jews thought that four times was generous. Jesus shocked him by saying, “You must forgive your brother more than seventy-seven times seven times.” In other words, we must forgive every time someone offends us. It’s important to realize that forgiving those who hurt us must not depend on their repentance. Forgiveness is for our own freedom to live in peace in accord with God’s will.
  A man met a monk as he passed a monastery. He asked him, “How often should I forgive my neighbor for slapping me?” The monk queried: “How many times did your neighbor slap you?” The man answered, “Once.” “Then,” said the monk, “forgive him once.” The man then asked, “If he slapped me fifty times, how often should I forgive him?” The monk answered, “You should forgive him forty nine times.” The man said, “But he slapped me fifty times, why shouldn’t I forgive fifty times?” The monk said, “The reason is that you deserved the 50th slap for allowing yourself to be slapped 49 times.” God doesn’t want us to remain in situations where we're being attacked.
  Jesus reinforces God’s revelation through Sirach and emphasizes the reciprocity of forgiveness in the parable of the unjust steward (Mt 18:21-35). The steward begged his master to cancel his debt while he refused to cancel the debt of one who owed him. Upon hearing about this unforgiving steward whom he had previously forgiven, he ordered that he be handed over to “the torturers until he should pay back the whole debt.” Led by his angry feeling toward his debtor the steward lost everything. Jesus warned His listeners, “So my heavenly Father will do to you, unless each of you forgives your brother from your heart.” 
  St Paul reminds us that we don’t live for ourselves, rather we live for the Lord (Rom 14:7-9). In living for Christ we embrace His Beatitudes in which He blesses our emotions so we can direct our feelings in every situation toward him. The Christian life calls us to fully possess ourselves so that we can freely give ourselves to Christ. Thus we use our emotions to direct our feelings toward behavior that is sanctified by the Holy Spirit in the bosom of Jesus’ Church. That’s what makes Christians different from others. There we learn to forgive so we can live and let live using our emotions to direct our feelings toward free, just, loving, and peaceful behavior. (Fr Sean)


If any like it I can  post others as they come in.

Re: Forgive So We Can Live and Let Live
« Reply #1 on: September 14, 2023, 08:33:26 AM »
The man then asked, “If he slapped me fifty times, how often should I forgive him?” The monk answered, “You should forgive him forty-nine times.” The man said, “But he slapped me fifty times, why shouldn’t I forgive fifty times?” The monk said, “The reason is that you deserved the 50th slap for allowing yourself to be slapped 49 times.” God doesn’t want us to remain in situations where we're being attacked.

:laugh1:  Another reason why forgiveness can be so difficult. Very often it entails also forgiving oneself, which in turn entails owning up to personal faults and failings that in some way provided an opening for the affront to begin with. Hence the adage, "Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me." :fryingpan:


Re: Forgive So We Can Live and Let Live
« Reply #2 on: September 14, 2023, 09:13:54 AM »
Here is a letter from a Father Sean Sheehy, an Irish priest who's homily against abortion went worldwide after he was criticisded for it in Irish media.God works in strange ways.

God has given us emotions so that we can handle all our feelings that are generated by our thoughts. Every time we interpret something – a look, a word, a scene, a touch, a stance, or a principle – feelings, positive or negative, follow from our interpretation. Strong feelings seek expression in action. Action expresses and defines our character – at least in that moment. Feelings never just happen. They’re always preceded by thoughts. Our thoughts lead us to feel good, sad, bad, joyful, happy, anxious, angry, fearful, guilty, responsible, numb, frustrated, etc. Our feelings identify how we want to relate to the world at any given situation. It’s silly to deny feelings. Instead we need to manage them lest they control us and lead us to behavior we regret. So how do we manage our feelings? We use our emotions.
  Emotions and feelings are often confused. People who’re upset or crying are often labeled as “emotional.” But actually they are simply expressing their feelings.  What matters is whether they are being controlled by their feelings or their feelings are being directed by their emotions. Emotions are gifts from God enabling us to decide the most effective way to express how we feel. Four basic emotions are anger, fear, guilt, and love. Anger and fear direct us to protect ourselves from threats to our safety. Guilt directs us to take responsibility for our sins. Love directs us to connect with others. We can use any emotion to direct any feeling, positive or negative. For example, I can have an angry feeling toward someone and express it through the emotion of anger, fear, guilt, or love. I can have an angry feeling toward someone and use my emotion of guilt to express it by taking personal responsibility for it and apologizing for it. I can also express it through the emotion of anger by constructively confronting the person toward whom I have the angry feeling. The relationship between feelings and emotions can be a whole study in itself. When we use emotions to direct our feelings we act rationally. When we let our feelings direct us we lose control and act irrationally. God wants us to be in control of ourselves so we can do His will. This week God speaks to us about anger and mercy.
  As an emotion anger is a gift from God. But In the Book of Sirach (27:30-28:9), God tells us that, “Wrath and anger are hateful things …” Jesus’ Church lists anger as one of the seven deadly sins? How can anger be a gift and a sin at the same time? Wasn’t Jesus angry? “And He looked around at them with anger, grieved at the hardness of their heart …” (Mk 3:5). What are we to make of this?
    God isn’t talking about the emotion of anger, which is a gift from Him. The emotion of anger is part of being human. It generates the energy we need to attack what threatens our security. But it’s how we attack that makes the difference. When we choose our emotion of anger to attack an enemy we’ll be in control of our action and God will be guiding us through His gift. When our angry feeling directs our attack we’ll not be in control and so will act destructively. Anger becomes a hateful thing when we attack destructively. Murder, revenge, self-harm, or wishing evil upon others are the result of angry feelings that are expressed in hateful actions towards others or toward oneself. It’s normal to feel anger when somebody wrongs us and threatens our safety. If we choose our emotion of anger to express our feelings God will lead us to act constructively. Angry feelings move us toward vengeance that blind us to God’s will. We must remember that, “The vengeful will suffer the Lord’s vengeance, for He remembers their sins in detail.”
  Forgiveness restores our emotions to their rightful role in managing our feelings when we are wronged. God’s Word teaches us to, “Forgive your neighbor’s injustice; then when you pray, your own sins will be forgiven.” Too often we react to injustice with angry feelings and seek revenge. Vengeful behavior causes destruction, which can’t be healed except by repentance and reconciliation. Sirach asks a reasonable question: “How can you expect healing from the Lord if you nourish anger against another?” Unless we’re hypocritical, we can’t. We have to change our vengeful feelings by replacing our vengeful thoughts with thoughts of repentance, forgiveness, and reconciliation. To live peacefully we must forgive and let live. That doesn’t mean we don’t confront the wrongdoer; we do, but through our God-given emotions that direct our feelings in a positive manner. Sirach asks another reasonable question: “How can a person refuse to be merciful toward another and ask for mercy himself or herself?” Again, we can’t, if we’re honest. God will give us only what we are willing to give others.
  Jesus tells us that in God’s mind forgiveness is reciprocal. To be forgiven we must be willing to forgive.  Jesus made it part of the prayer He gave us: “Forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us” (Mt 6:12). He enshrined it in one of the Beatitudes (Mt 5:7) and instituted it as a special Sacrament of His Church (Jn 20:23). The condition for receiving God’s forgiveness is our willingness to forgive others. That calls for us to change our feelings by changing our thinking through God’s grace. We do that by replacing our thoughts with God’s thoughts. St. Peter asked Jesus if it was enough to forgive his brother who sinned against him seven times. Jєωs thought that four times was generous. Jesus shocked him by saying, “You must forgive your brother more than seventy-seven times seven times.” In other words, we must forgive every time someone offends us. It’s important to realize that forgiving those who hurt us must not depend on their repentance. Forgiveness is for our own freedom to live in peace in accord with God’s will.
  A man met a monk as he passed a monastery. He asked him, “How often should I forgive my neighbor for slapping me?” The monk queried: “How many times did your neighbor slap you?” The man answered, “Once.” “Then,” said the monk, “forgive him once.” The man then asked, “If he slapped me fifty times, how often should I forgive him?” The monk answered, “You should forgive him forty nine times.” The man said, “But he slapped me fifty times, why shouldn’t I forgive fifty times?” The monk said, “The reason is that you deserved the 50th slap for allowing yourself to be slapped 49 times.” God doesn’t want us to remain in situations where we're being attacked.
  Jesus reinforces God’s revelation through Sirach and emphasizes the reciprocity of forgiveness in the parable of the unjust steward (Mt 18:21-35). The steward begged his master to cancel his debt while he refused to cancel the debt of one who owed him. Upon hearing about this unforgiving steward whom he had previously forgiven, he ordered that he be handed over to “the torturers until he should pay back the whole debt.” Led by his angry feeling toward his debtor the steward lost everything. Jesus warned His listeners, “So my heavenly Father will do to you, unless each of you forgives your brother from your heart.” 
  St Paul reminds us that we don’t live for ourselves, rather we live for the Lord (Rom 14:7-9). In living for Christ we embrace His Beatitudes in which He blesses our emotions so we can direct our feelings in every situation toward him. The Christian life calls us to fully possess ourselves so that we can freely give ourselves to Christ. Thus we use our emotions to direct our feelings toward behavior that is sanctified by the Holy Spirit in the bosom of Jesus’ Church. That’s what makes Christians different from others. There we learn to forgive so we can live and let live using our emotions to direct our feelings toward free, just, loving, and peaceful behavior. (Fr Sean)


If any like it I can  post others as they come in.
What about family abuse and being abused as a child by your parent. How can the example of the monk be applied to that situation? Children aren't capable of removing themselves from abusive situations or defending themselves. So how do you approach forgiveness when you were mistreated as a child?

Re: Forgive So We Can Live and Let Live
« Reply #3 on: September 14, 2023, 10:15:52 AM »
What about family abuse and being abused as a child by your parent. How can the example of the monk be applied to that situation? Children aren't capable of removing themselves from abusive situations or defending themselves. So how do you approach forgiveness when you were mistreated as a child?

Other more able members here have dealt with the theology of permissive will, basically that The Lord indirectly allows things to happen which will eventually bring a greater good out of whatever evil occurred.

What I can say in practice is that first you pray, a lot. Once we slowly begin to get our own souls in order, then it becomes easier to see habitual abusers less as oppressors and more as the mistaken and broken creatures that they really are. It can be a two-steps-forward, one-step-back process for a long time, and the sense of bafflement does persist. But acceptance, forgiveness, and a definite sort of freedom do follow.

Re: Forgive So We Can Live and Let Live
« Reply #4 on: September 20, 2023, 11:57:35 AM »
Fr Sean again:

My Way or God’s Way?
  A well-known singer told the world in a song, “I did it my way.” Should he be proud of that? I don’t think so because it was all a lie. People often claim to be living their way, when in fact they’re influenced by someone else. As God revealed in Ecclesiastes 1:9-10, none of us is original. “What has been, that will be; what has been done, that will be done. Nothing is new under the sun. Even the thing of which we say, ‘See, this is new!’ has already existed in the ages that preceded us.” The only two ways we do things in this world are either God’s way or Satan’s way. There’s no truly original way, despite those who think so. This is why the Holy Spirit speaks urgently through Isaiah (55:6-9) warning us to, “Seek the Lord while He may be found, call Him while He is near,” if we want to follow God’s way. If we don’t take full advantage of God where He said He could be found and where He is near to us, we won’t be able to benefit from His thoughts and Commandments that show us His way. He reminds us that, “As high as the heavens are above the earth, so high are my ways above your ways, and my thoughts above your thoughts.” Where has God enabled us to find Him? We find God in the Person of Jesus Christ who is present in His Church. Through His Church, Jesus, by the power of the Holy Spirit, teaches us God’s thoughts and leads us along His way, the Way of the Cross – the way to freedom, justice, love, peace, and joy.
  The opposite to the Way of the Cross is the way of selfishness, which is the way of Satan – pride, envy, wrath, lust, greed, sloth, and gluttony. The Holy Spirit warns those following the evil way, “Let the scoundrel forsake his way, and the wicked his thoughts.” Since the Way of the Cross is the only way that leads to Heaven, God wants everyone to choose that way and abandon other ways we might be tempted to do things. Satan’s way is literally a dead end - eternal death - preceded by spiritual starvation, emptiness, and loneliness. God’s way, on the other hand, never leaves a person feeling disappointed because He is always true to His promise that all who embrace Him will experience joy and eternal happiness. Why can we believe in God? Because, “The Lord is just in all His ways and holy in all His works. The Lord is near to all who call upon Him, to all who call upon Him in truth” (Ps 145: 2-18).
  Having chosen God’s way, by embracing Jesus as His Lord and Saviour, St. Paul urges us to, “conduct yourselves in a way worthy of the Gospel” (Phil 1:20-27). Jesus spells out for us what that conduct entails in His parable about the labourers in the vineyard (Mt 20:1-16). By conducting ourselves in a manner worthy of the Gospel we privately and publicly witness our faith in Jesus who gives us membership in God’s kingdom on earth, made visible in His Church.  Jesus tells us that God is like the landowner who, in this story, calls people to work in his vineyard. He continuously searched for workers throughout the day, at 9.00 A.M, Noon, 3.00, and 5.00 P.M. At the end of the day he paid all the workers the same wage beginning with those hired last. Those who worked a full day complained thinking that they should get more. The owner said to one of them, “‘My friend, I do you no injustice. You agreed to the usual wage, did you not? … I am free to do as I please with my money, am I not? Or are you envious because I am generous?’ Thus the last shall be first and the first shall be last.” God is the “landowner” and the “workers” are sinners whom God wants to continually save whenever and wherever He can find them. Those who worked the full day are the Jews who thought their reward should be greater than others, and those hired late in the day are the Gentiles. Jesus’ message is that God’s way provides those who answer His call with what they need, not with what they want.
  Here we see the difference between God’s ways and our ways. A just wage is one that meets the needs of the worker, which are to take care of his family. Those who were hired in the afternoon and evening wanted to work but didn’t have the opportunity. The landowner, in his generosity, gave them that opportunity so that they could feed, clothe, and house their family. God’s way is the way of generosity. On the other hand the selfish human way - the way of Satan - is to look out for ourselves and be envious of those whom we view as getting preferential treatment. It is called begrudgery. Jesus was highlighting what God revealed in Deuteronomy 15:4, namely that, “There should be no one of you in need.” Those who worked all day received a full wage that enabled them to take care of their needs. Those who weren’t hired couldn’t take care of their needs. The last hired were first to be paid so that the first hired could witness the generosity of the owner and face their own envy. Thus God confronts us with the difference between His way and thoughts and Satan’s ways and thoughts. God deals with us in accord with our needs while Satan’s way encourages us to deal with one another in accord with our wants.
  God’s way provides for our needs through nature and through His Son. Our bodies need water, air, food, and light to live. Our soul also needs water, air, food, and light to be fully alive and magnify the Lord. God provides for our physical needs through creation. He provides for our spiritual needs through Jesus Christ, sacramentally present in His Church. Someone pointed out that in Jesus our soul finds Living Water, the Breath of Life, the Bread of Life, and the Light of the World. Our soul receives these necessities when we embrace Jesus in His Church. Through His Church Jesus continuously calls sinners whenever and wherever He can find them to embrace His thoughts and ways in their daily lives. There is no other way that leads us to become fully human and fully alive, physically and spiritually. Knowing the Gospel and striving to be worthy of it enables us to make sure that the way we do things isn’t Satan’s way but God’s way, the way of the Cross and to Way to Heaven. (fr sean)