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Author Topic: Faith exclude Curiosity  (Read 738 times)

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Offline PositaSecuris

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Faith exclude Curiosity
« on: May 27, 2018, 03:17:19 PM »
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  • "I Believe"

    The word believe does not here mean to think, to suppose, or to be of opinion; but, as the Sacred Scriptures teach, it expresses the deepest conviction, by which the mind gives a firm and unhesitating assent to God revealing His mysterious truths. As far, therefore, as regards use of the word here, he who firmly and without hesitation is convinced of anything is said to believe.

    Faith Excludes Doubt

    The knowledge derived through faith must not be considered less certain because its objects are not seen; for the divine light by which we know them, although it does not render them evident, yet suffers us not to doubt them. For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath himself shone in our hearts, that the gospel be not hidden to us, as to those that perish.

    Faith Excludes Curiosity

    From what has been said it follows that he who is gifted with this heavenly knowledge of faith is free from an inquisitive curiosity. For when God commands us to believe He does not propose to us to search into His divine judgments, or inquire into their reason and cause, but demands an unchangeable faith, by which the mind rests content in the knowledge of eternal truth. And indeed, since we have the testimony of the Apostle that God is true; and every man a liar, and since it would argue arrogance and presumption to disbelieve the word of a grave and sensible man affirming anything as true, and to demand that he prove his statements by arguments or witnesses, how rash and foolish are those, who, hearing the words of God Himself, demand reasons for His heavenly and saving doctrines? Faith, therefore, must exclude not only all doubt, but all desire for demonstration.

    Faith Requires Open Profession

    The pastor should also teach that he who says, I believe, besides declaring the inward assent of the mind, which is an internal act of faith, should also openly profess and with alacrity acknowledge and proclaim what he inwardly and in his heart believes. For the faithful should be animated by the same spirit that spoke by the lips of the Prophet when he said: I believe; and therefore did I speak, and should follow the example of the Apostles who replied to the princes of the people: We cannot but speak the things which we have seen and heard. They should be encouraged by these noble words of St. Paul: I am not ashamed of the gospel. For it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; and likewise by those other words; in which the truth of this doctrine is expressly confirmed: With the heart we believe unto justice; but with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.


    Offline forlorn

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    Re: Faith exclude Curiosity
    « Reply #1 on: May 27, 2018, 04:19:22 PM »
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  • Quote
    Faith Excludes Curiosity

    From what has been said it follows that he who is gifted with this heavenly knowledge of faith is free from an inquisitive curiosity. For when God commands us to believe He does not propose to us to search into His divine judgments, or inquire into their reason and cause, but demands an unchangeable faith, by which the mind rests content in the knowledge of eternal truth. And indeed, since we have the testimony of the Apostle that God is true; and every man a liar, and since it would argue arrogance and presumption to disbelieve the word of a grave and sensible man affirming anything as true, and to demand that he prove his statements by arguments or witnesses, how rash and foolish are those, who, hearing the words of God Himself, demand reasons for His heavenly and saving doctrines? Faith, therefore, must exclude not only all doubt, but all desire for demonstration.
    That is what literally every theologian ever has done. And as for scientific pursuits etc., it's dogma that we can know God from his creation and the Church has been a great patron of science and all scholarly pursuits throughout history. 

    Also good luck ever evangelising, which we are all called to do, if you believe trying to prove Catholic beliefs is somehow doubting God. 


    Offline Nandarani

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    Re: Faith exclude Curiosity
    « Reply #2 on: May 27, 2018, 05:59:04 PM »
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  • 'Also good luck ever evangelising, which we are all called to do, if you believe trying to prove Catholic beliefs is somehow doubting God.' 

    Had to inwardly laugh a bit on seeing the name of this thread because I have gotten such tremendous relief from simply stopping with viewing drudgereport, zerohedge and limiting novusordowatch even...

    Curiosity, and words and controversy, are the bane of life and need to be taken in controlled amounts, when at all.  I learned from St. Terese of Jesus' Life that everyone in heaven knows what is going on with everyone else without speech. 

    Curiosity!  What a large space it assumed until curbed. 

    But:  evangelizing yes!  The pictures I copy in multiple, laminate, and give that portray miracles - for example, Our Lady of Good Success has a long story about the painting of the statue of Our Lady, and a beautiful picture of the statue which can be shared.  or articles about same and there are lots of other miraculous pictures, statues, etc., articles about visitors from Hell and purgatory, even an entire museum in Italy devoted to physical proofs of same.  Holy Face medals and history; Miraculous Medal, and history.   

    All this affects protestants regardless of what they think they think. 

    To Lutheran relatives who were so materially successful that examining the religion they follow wasn't even thought of as necessary, I gave the information about Dr. Luther, and compared what he thought with Catholic thinking.  Pretty much, no comment was possible.  Close to the end of life these older relatives do not have but what I have given them, exhorting them to prayer by telling them of my own joy in it and suggesting possible approaches since they, really, do not have any within Lutheranism.  So well, did St. Terese of Jesus see Lutheranism for what it is. 

    Their own approach stipulates that all is forgiven - as Luther said, sin boldly - not that these relatives have - far from it and they have achieved what Protestantism has as its core belief:  material success and respect, all five males with doctorates, talk about curiosity - and not one of Divinity - every son of the Lutheran minister, seminary professor who came from Germany on a mission to Canada before I was born.

    I also work with a few people on the street every so often, these people who actually have a gift, a big one, to viscerally see the situation of life for what it is after large self-created suffering.  Actually when is it ever not self-created?

    St. Philip Neri, born in 1515 as was St. Terese of Jesus made a change in his life early on to become familiar with street people and able to connect with them. 

    Offline PositaSecuris

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    Re: Faith exclude Curiosity
    « Reply #3 on: May 27, 2018, 09:40:00 PM »
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  • Offline Mithrandylan

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    Re: Faith exclude Curiosity
    « Reply #4 on: May 27, 2018, 10:19:36 PM »
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  • Quote
    Faith, therefore, must exclude not only all doubt, but all desire for demonstration.

    .
    Just all desire for, or all actual demonstration?  Is theology OK so long as it's done miserably and reluctantly?
    .
    That's a rhetorical question.  I'm not entirely sure, if you really think everything you've put in your post is true, how you can justify actually posting it.  Is not your very post an attempted demonstration of the nature of faith, as you see it?
    .
    I think we have to distinguish between the initial acquisition of faith as a supernatural virtue, which is ultimately a grace, and a growth in that virtue, which is also a grace, but one which can be merited by contemplating the mysteries.  Not in a vague, pagan type of way but even in a rigorous, systemic, scholastic, and logical way.  In this latter sense faith not only doesn't exclude a desire for demonstration, but is indeed aided and cultivated by demonstration.
    .
    "Be kind; do not seek the malicious satisfaction of having discovered an additional enemy to the Church... And, above all, be scrupulously truthful. To all, friends and foes alike, give that serious attention which does not misrepresent any opinion, does not distort any statement, does not mutilate any quotation. We need not fear to serve the cause of Christ less efficiently by putting on His spirit". (Vermeersch, 1913).


    Offline Stubborn

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    Re: Faith exclude Curiosity
    « Reply #5 on: May 28, 2018, 06:12:07 AM »
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  • "I Believe"

    The word believe does not here mean to think, to suppose, or to be of opinion; but, as the Sacred Scriptures teach, it expresses the deepest conviction, by which the mind gives a firm and unhesitating assent to God revealing His mysterious truths. As far, therefore, as regards use of the word here, he who firmly and without hesitation is convinced of anything is said to believe.

    Faith Excludes Doubt

    The knowledge derived through faith must not be considered less certain because its objects are not seen; for the divine light by which we know them, although it does not render them evident, yet suffers us not to doubt them. For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath himself shone in our hearts, that the gospel be not hidden to us, as to those that perish.

    Faith Excludes Curiosity

    From what has been said it follows that he who is gifted with this heavenly knowledge of faith is free from an inquisitive curiosity. For when God commands us to believe He does not propose to us to search into His divine judgments, or inquire into their reason and cause, but demands an unchangeable faith, by which the mind rests content in the knowledge of eternal truth. And indeed, since we have the testimony of the Apostle that God is true; and every man a liar, and since it would argue arrogance and presumption to disbelieve the word of a grave and sensible man affirming anything as true, and to demand that he prove his statements by arguments or witnesses, how rash and foolish are those, who, hearing the words of God Himself, demand reasons for His heavenly and saving doctrines? Faith, therefore, must exclude not only all doubt, but all desire for demonstration.

    Faith Requires Open Profession

    The pastor should also teach that he who says, I believe, besides declaring the inward assent of the mind, which is an internal act of faith, should also openly profess and with alacrity acknowledge and proclaim what he inwardly and in his heart believes. For the faithful should be animated by the same spirit that spoke by the lips of the Prophet when he said: I believe; and therefore did I speak, and should follow the example of the Apostles who replied to the princes of the people: We cannot but speak the things which we have seen and heard. They should be encouraged by these noble words of St. Paul: I am not ashamed of the gospel. For it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; and likewise by those other words; in which the truth of this doctrine is expressly confirmed: With the heart we believe unto justice; but with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
    :applause:
    OP, you will like this short sermon given by Fr. Wathen: You must have great faith.
    "But Peter and the apostles answering, said: We ought to obey God, rather than men." - Acts 5:29

    The Highest Principle in the Church: "We are first of all under obedience to God, and only then under obedience to man" - Fr. Hesse