Author Topic: Choosing your childrens spouses (Read 3883 times)

Thursday · « **on:** March 22, 2013, 06:19:54 PM »

I've never reall been against arranged marriages, provided that both parties aren't forced into marrying someone they don't want to.

In Korea, things are often arranged but in most nobody is forced to marry someone they don't want although it's becoming more westernized here.

One way parents control their children is by keeping all their money until they get married. If the have jobs the parents will take their money and give them some pocket money and save the rest for the child's marriage.

Now, I was thinking of the future, and I think it would be a good idea for Catholic families with marriable children to try to arrange a marriage with another traditional Catholic child. When the children are adults of course.

Thoughts?

SeanJohnson · « **Reply #1 on:** March 22, 2013, 07:08:53 PM »

Arranged marriages are an excellent tradition, and will keep your boys from marrying manly, pants-wearing women.

I'm all for it.

gladius_veritatis · « **Reply #2 on:** March 22, 2013, 07:19:40 PM »

While there are several excellent points (objectively) in favor of arranged marriages, it is contrary to reason and present experience to think any normal, modern child (or adult) will go along with it. It might seem like a solution to a serious problem, but it is more of a pipe dream than anything. Perhaps after a chastisement it could work once again, but then the women will supposedly (i.e., according to prophecy) outnumber the men 7 or 12 to 1, so it will not be necessary. Cheers :)

SeanJohnson · « **Reply #3 on:** March 22, 2013, 07:21:41 PM »

Quote from: gladius_veritatis

While there are several excellent points (objectively) in favor of arranged marriages, it is contrary to reason and present experience to think any normal, modern child (or adult) will go along with it. It might seem like a solution to a serious problem, but it is more of a pipe dream than anything. Perhaps after a chastisement it could work once again, but then the women will supposedly (i.e., according to prophecy) outnumber the men 7 or 12 to 1, so it will not be necessary. Cheers :)

Yes, if they are tv watchers, it will be difficult to get them to go along with it,

gladius_veritatis · « **Reply #4 on:** March 22, 2013, 07:32:11 PM »

Television is certainly an issue, but even many who are far less influenced by modern culture will be very unlikely to go along with the idea of an arranged marriage. All talk to the contrary is, in my notable experience, nonsense. We are not in the ancient world or medieval Europe. In some ways, would that we were, but we are not.

Sigismund · « **Reply #5 on:** March 22, 2013, 08:06:37 PM »

In reality, when your children are adults you have no right to chose spouses for them. If you force them to marry underage the marriages are canonically invalid anyway.

Matto · « **Reply #6 on:** March 22, 2013, 08:09:15 PM »

As much as it seems appealing for parents to arrange their children's marriages, doesn't the Church teach that the children should be free to marry whoever they like?

Telesphorus · « **Reply #7 on:** March 22, 2013, 08:26:29 PM »

These fathers who send away the honest men will more than likely find themselves putting up with the dishonest ones.

I don't think you people are capable (neither having the ability, the connections, nor the judgment) to choose spouses for your children.

Telesphorus · « **Reply #8 on:** March 22, 2013, 08:29:19 PM »

Quote from: St. Thomas Aquinas

Reply to Objection 1: The maid is in her father's power, not as a female slave without power over her own body, but as a daughter, for the purpose of education. Hence, in so far as she is free, she can give herself into another's power without her father's consent, even as a son or daughter, since they are free, may enter religion without their parent's consent.

gladius_veritatis · « **Reply #9 on:** March 22, 2013, 08:57:42 PM »

Quote from: Telesphorus

I don't think you people are capable (neither having the ability, the connections, nor the judgment) to choose spouses for your children.

I (tend to) agree, yet I understand where the desire comes from. It is such an f-d up world (sorry, Matthew, but that is reality, tender consciences aside) that it is understandable that concerned parents consider all avenues, even those which make it SEEM as safe as it was in the ancient world. Frankly, even in the ancient world, you can rest assured that 999 marriages were miserable and abusive for every one involving a Jacob and Rachel. Our take on everything -- even things holy and healthy and happy -- tends to be skewed.

Thursday · « **Reply #10 on:** March 22, 2013, 09:16:49 PM »

I think some of the negative comments are due to a too rigid interpretation of 'arrangement.' I'm not talking about a formal arrangement but more like trying to make a deal, kind of like a business merger, if everyone is happy with the particulars then the marriage goes forth.

Matthew · « **Reply #11 on:** March 22, 2013, 09:21:24 PM »

Quote from: Telesphorus

These fathers who send away the honest men will more than likely find themselves putting up with the dishonest ones.

I don't think you people are capable (neither having the ability, the connections, nor the judgment) to choose spouses for your children.

Tele,

That seems like a sweeping judgement to make of a bunch of men you don't know.

It's obvious (at least to me) that you're extrapolating ONE case you experienced in your own personal life ("you know who"), and applying that to every Trad father. Which is quite ridiculous, I hope you realize.

Because when you take your statement (above) at face value, it really seems baseless.

Telesphorus · « **Reply #12 on:** March 22, 2013, 09:29:16 PM »

Quote from: Thursday

I think some of the negative comments are due to a too rigid interpretation of 'arrangement.' I'm not talking about a formal arrangement but more like trying to make a dea,l kind of like a business merger, if everyone is happy with the particulars then the marriage goes forth.

If you're interested in something like that then it's best to make it informal. It's obvious enough when a parent is interested. I recall meeting a mother of an SSPX priest who introduced herself to me and was very friendly towards me. Not long after her youngest daughter came up to us pushing her grandmother's wheelchair. Now you could say I'm wrong to suspect what her interest in me was, however, when I told her my age she was very much shocked. Her youngest daughter was little older than 20.

Now I could be wrong about what her motives were, but when middle aged women with grown daughters take an interest in getting to know me - hmmmm, when has that happened? There aren't many contexts.

There was another who came up to me and interviewed me several times, but that was after I'd already met her daughter. I'd told her daughter my age and job circuмstances (which I said were poor) from the moment we met - the first thing she asked me was "what do you do"

Her mother, however, was not informed of my age, and finally took the opportunity to ask me a few weeks later. You should have seen the look on her face.

Telesphorus · « **Reply #13 on:** March 22, 2013, 09:31:23 PM »

Quote from: Matthew

That seems like a sweeping judgement to make of a bunch of men you don't know.

We don't live in the old days when marriage was not only indissoluble but also treated that way in the law.

People who live in cultures where arranged marriages are normal sometimes screw up royally.

I really don't think trads have a clue what they're doing when they try stuff like this.

Matthew · « **Reply #14 on:** March 22, 2013, 10:01:39 PM »

Quote from: Telesphorus

Quote from: Matthew
That seems like a sweeping judgement to make of a bunch of men you don't know.

We don't live in the old days when marriage was not only indissoluble but also treated that way in the law.

People who live in cultures where arranged marriages are normal sometimes screw up royally.

I really don't think trads have a clue what they're doing when they try stuff like this.

Well I'll grant that being a matchmaker is a particular skill, like being a teacher.

I think that some people CAN do it well. But as we've all heard and read horror stories about "arranged dates" from co-workers, family, and friends -- apparently it's a gift that not everyone possesses.

The people who aren't good at it don't consider things deeply enough. For example, you would never want to pair two "alpha" personalities together.