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Author Topic: Attempted Episcopal Consecration in Spain  (Read 1487 times)

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Offline SeanJohnson

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Attempted Episcopal Consecration in Spain
« on: March 12, 2023, 05:24:54 PM »
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    • Assisting at this attempted consecration is Br. Thiago (i.e., the conciliar Carmelite from Brazil, who moved to Europe and tried to latch on to the Resistance, after claiming he was being persecuted by the conciliar bishop for his traditionalism, then later drifted into flat earth sedevacantism).

    No idea about the lineage of the supposed "consecrating" Bishop Aonzo, but according to a Resistance priest, and the comments at the link provided, the one consecrated is married (but separated) with children:

    :facepalm:

    Be warned.

     
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    Offline Quo vadis Domine

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    Re: Attempted Episcopal Consecration in Spain
    « Reply #1 on: March 12, 2023, 05:29:16 PM »
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    • Quote from: SeanJohnson on March 12, 2023, 05:24:54 PM
    Assisting at this attempted consecration is Br. Thiago (i.e., the conciliar Carmelite from Brazil, who moved to Europe and tried to latch on to the Resistance, after claiming he was being persecuted by the conciliar bishop for his traditionalism, then later drifted into flat earth sedevacantism).

    I’m happy I’m just a sedevacantist and not a flat Earth one! :laugh2:
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    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Attempted Episcopal Consecration in Spain
    « Reply #2 on: March 12, 2023, 05:29:31 PM »
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    • What exactly is "flat earth sedevacantism"?  FlatEarthTrads group are Resistance folks and backers of Bishop Wiliamson.  :laugh1:
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    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Attempted Episcopal Consecration in Spain
    « Reply #3 on: March 12, 2023, 05:30:23 PM »
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    • Quote from: Quo vadis Domine on March 12, 2023, 05:29:16 PM
    I’m happy I’m just a sedevacantist and not a flat Earth one! :laugh2:

    You beat me by 15 seconds.
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    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Attempted Episcopal Consecration in Spain
    « Reply #4 on: March 12, 2023, 05:34:10 PM »
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    • Quote from: SeanJohnson on March 12, 2023, 05:24:54 PM
    No idea about the lineage of the supposed "consecrating" Bishop Aonzo, but according to a Resistance priest, and the comments at the link provided, the one consecrated is married (but separated) with children:

    If you have no idea about the lineage of the consecrating bishop, then we don't know if there's any doubt about the validity.  Consecrand's "separated" state would not impact validity, even if it's highly imprudent.  Even in the Eastern Rites it isn't considered acceptable for a bishop to be married ... even though priests may be.
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    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Re: Attempted Episcopal Consecration in Spain
    « Reply #5 on: March 12, 2023, 05:41:50 PM »
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    • Quote from: Ladislaus on March 12, 2023, 05:34:10 PM
    If you have no idea about the lineage of the consecrating bishop, then we don't know if there's any doubt about the validity.  

    The description under the video says, "Attempted episcopal consecration by Julio Edmundo Aonzo on José V. Ramón González Cipitria."

    The suggestion is that the consecration was not successful, but the reason was not given.  Perhaps the comments will clarify in due time.
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    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Attempted Episcopal Consecration in Spain
    « Reply #6 on: March 12, 2023, 05:44:29 PM »
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    • Quote from: SeanJohnson on March 12, 2023, 05:41:50 PM
    The description under the video says, "Attempted episcopal consecration by Julio Edmundo Aonzo on José V. Ramón González Cipitria."

    The suggestion is that the consecration was not successful, but the reason was not given.  Perhaps the comments will clarify in due time.

    OK.  I haven't had a chance to watch whether he got the essential form right, but the consecrator's Latin seemed pretty solid overall in the minute or two of this that I could watch.  Is "Aonzo" a typo for Alonso or Alonzo?
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    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Re: Attempted Episcopal Consecration in Spain
    « Reply #7 on: March 12, 2023, 05:46:35 PM »
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    • Here's another short video of the same event, in which the description says, "The false Bishop Julio Edmundo Aonzo, does not even know how to give the Blessing, he does the Inverted Cross."


     
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    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Re: Attempted Episcopal Consecration in Spain
    « Reply #8 on: March 12, 2023, 05:52:07 PM »
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    Offline CatholicInAmerica

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    Re: Attempted Episcopal Consecration in Spain
    « Reply #9 on: March 12, 2023, 05:54:43 PM »
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    • Quote from: Ladislaus on March 12, 2023, 05:44:29 PM
    OK.  I haven't had a chance to watch whether he got the essential form right, but the consecrator's Latin seemed pretty solid overall in the minute or two of this that I could watch.  Is "Aonzo" a typo for Alonso or Alonzo?
    I skipped around in the video, this “consecrator” constantly was being corrected by his assistants and re did many parts from what I watched. 
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    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Attempted Episcopal Consecration in Spain
    « Reply #10 on: March 12, 2023, 06:36:48 PM »
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    • Quote from: SeanJohnson on March 12, 2023, 05:46:35 PM
    Here's another short video of the same event, in which the description says, "The false Bishop Julio Edmundo Aonzo, does not even know how to give the Blessing, he does the Inverted Cross."

    Meh.  That's just being a bit sloppy.  He raises his arm too high for the vertical and doesn't reach high enough for the horizontal.  I've seen a lot worse, where the bishop looks like he's just making circles with his hand.  This kind of stuff smells of having an agenda.
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    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Attempted Episcopal Consecration in Spain
    « Reply #11 on: March 12, 2023, 06:38:42 PM »
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    • Quote from: CatholicInAmerica on March 12, 2023, 05:54:43 PM
    I skipped around in the video, this “consecrator” constantly was being corrected by his assistants and re did many parts from what I watched.

    Also not uncommon; many bishops rely on their MCs to guide them through the ceremony.  None of that matters.  What matters is ...

    1) whether he's of valid episcopal lineage and

    2) whether he (mostly) correctly pronounced the words in the essential forum (minus some "sloppiness" on word endings)
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    Offline frankielogue

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    Re: Attempted Episcopal Consecration in Spain
    « Reply #12 on: March 15, 2023, 02:01:10 PM »
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    • Frei Tiago is a cucaracha for sure. Apparently the Resistance nuns (Monastère Janua Coeli) are now affiliated with him (again) and have split from the Resistance.

    Avoid avoid avoid.
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    Offline jmjth

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    Re: Attempted Episcopal Consecration in Spain
    « Reply #13 on: March 22, 2023, 05:34:07 PM »
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    • I do not understand French but the Uns recently posted this video.
    They have been been AFFILIATED with the  French Resistance Priest
    for more than a year. 
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    Offline SeanJohnson

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    Re: Attempted Episcopal Consecration in Spain
    « Reply #14 on: April 21, 2023, 08:33:54 AM »
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    • It is being reported that Fr. Thiago has now participated in a conclave to elect a new anti-pope:

    https://resistance.vraiforum.com/t1541-RP-Tiago-et-ses-carmelites.htm
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