It seems to me that men and women are pretty much equally prone to group pressure. Obviously, there are men and women out there who are able to resist it, and there are those who can't resist it. But I would say it's probably equal. That's just my opinion though.

I've picked up on this belief that girls are somehow less able to resist group pressure to conform, than men are.  I wonder if folks who believe that think it applies to vice only or to virtue also?  Is this some sort of excuse for bad behavior or is it just the way God made us?  Is this, at least in part, where the idea that men have more responsibility, than women do comes from?  How do you think this actually works in practice?  
 

Women in general are much more attuned to the social consequences of their actions, and are usually more competitive socially.  The opinion and attitudes of other women affect their judgment and even their preferences.

I've picked up on this belief that girls are somehow less able to resist group pressure to conform, than men are.  I wonder if folks who believe that think it applies to vice only or to virtue also?  Is this some sort of excuse for bad behavior or is it just the way God made us?  Is this, at least in part, where the idea that men have more responsibility, than women do comes from?  How do you think this actually works in practice?  

 

One might think women are more prone to surrender to group pressure, considering the large scale use of contraception and abortion.  It seems impossible that so many deny the basic biology of being female.

I would agree with this for the most part based on my experiences and observations.  Being raised in an isolated family ("outsiders") as an only child...I had years of practice being alone and not dependent on a group for my sense of acceptance and identity.  So, for that reason, I've been able to "survive" being friendless for 13 years.  However,  I see the neediness of other women all around me...as they mimic each other in dress, speech patterns, interests and activities.  That's why they all work, all send their kids to public school, all wear the same type of clothes and have the same opinions on everything.  Just go to the hair salon sometime...all anyone can talk about is "American Idol" and their next trip to Vegas ...

S2Srea said:  

I think a good reason to think otherwise, is to see how many men on this forum have for wives, women who were not Traditional Catholics to begin with. I think men can more easily come to Traditional Catholicism, and break away from the 'norm', but a woman needs a man to lead her, many times, in that same direction. She usually wouldn't do it on her own, she'll stay with the flock until he shows her the way out (or in).

I have no intention to pick a fight with you, S2, but women don't need to be led into Catholicism by a man.  I know plenty of women who the Holy Ghost guided there themselves with zero help from men; quite the opposite of "help" in some cases.  

In the 19th century, at Lourdes I believe -- maybe La Salette -- Mary complained that "only old women come to Church these days."  While Mary wasn't happy about that, it would show that, as heresy and error spread, more women probably remained Catholic, overall, than men.  I think it's still true today, the trad Catholic churches have a female-predominant feeling.

I am undecided about whether women are more conformist.  They may not go otu and build cabins in the woods, lacking the physical strength for that kind of life, but they can be non-conformist even in social settings, reject or be against what they see around them, just like men.  Maybe the question is not "Which sex is more conformist" but about what each sex chooses to conform TO.  There are only so many roads to take in life; even the isolationist mountain men are living a certain way that they see others living.  They don't each individually invent mountain-man style, it is still monkey-see monkey-do.

Mrs. Z said:  

However, I see the neediness of other women all around me...as they mimic each other in dress, speech patterns, interests and activities.

You don't think men are the same?  They aren't downright tribal these days?  Try being a man, like me, with no interest in football, see how strange you will appear.  All humans imitate and try to fit in with the world they see around them; only Catholicism can break that cycle, for men or women.

Either women are too rebellious or too conformist, I guess it's open season on the ladies  You guys can't win.  

I'm sure Tele will think I'm kissing up to women, but this backlash against feminism has really gone too far.  It seems like people can just pour out bile on women and even trad Catholic women will go along with it.  That in itself may be causing some trad Catholic women to adopt a feminist stance, in their own defense, so it's counter-intuitive.

Christ gave us His mother as the model of womanhood to concentrate on, not a tattooed harlot.  There is no reason to concentrate on them or assume anything from them about women as a whole, let alone Catholic women.

You clearly are someone with the potential to be very controlling, and it is not among "white knights or femitrads" that one needs to look for proof.

What a shock, I make a point about the BSing these people do about male leadership having nothing to do with male authority, and you make it out to be a sign that I'm potentially "controlling" - a typical smear - "you're  potential rapist" - "you're a potential abuser" - it's right out of the feminist handbook.

When someone is in charge, what he says goes.  If you don't get your way, you can't really consider yourself the boss.  That's how authority works.  Either the authority is followed, or rejected.  Now if a man insists on his own authority, he's going to be called a potential abuser.

This is ALWAYS mentioned whenever the biblical injunctions about submission are brought up - women start talking about abusers.  It's a cultural marxist response.  It's saying "you have the Bible, but I have society on my side."

It is among the example of the saints; because if you think your attitude is even remotely like that of St. Joseph, model of leaders of families, you have another think coming.  What saint ever talked like you?

I don't think St. Joseph needed to worry about passive aggressive women or a feminist society.

 

All error is an exaggeration of truth; you exaggerate the man's responsibility to lead and you turn it into a power-trip and a way to control your universe without trusting in God.

Wrong.  Most women today who claim to believe in the teaching of submission to husbands have so many outs that they've reduced it to nothing.  They know they can always pull the trump card of politically correct accusations.