Catholic Info
Traditional Catholic Faith => Catholic Living in the Modern World => Topic started by: John Steven on January 12, 2007, 02:31:02 PM
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A friend of mine attends a chapel where the priest has been known to say the following from the pulpit:
"Are we Traditional Catholics, or are we just anti-Novus Ordo?!"
Sadly, I think many people who attend the Traditional Latin Mass would fall under the latter from what I have seen and read lately. You can make no assumption about what the person sitting in the pew next to you thinks about any given issue other than the fact that they attend the Traditional Mass. It seems that is the only given you start with when getting to know a person. Everything else is fair game for debate.
So, what does it mean to be a Traditional Catholic? Who determines what is traditional and what is not, especially when it comes to issues that are not directly related to Faith or dogma? Share your thoughts, please. I will myself when I have more time.
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So, what does it mean to be a Traditional Catholic? Who determines what is traditional and what is not, especially when it comes to issues that are not directly related to Faith or dogma? Share your thoughts, please. I will myself when I have more time.
To me, being a traditional Catholic, is simply discovering communion with the saints and ordinary Catholics of before Vatican II.
Living in today's society, but as if Vatican II and the New Rite had never happened! As I imagine the ordinary Catholics of today would have done, without Vatican II.
Clare.
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There are more than a couple of very holy priests who are quite willing to discuss and preach about how we should be living our daily lives. Bishop Williamson is perhaps the most popular example. When I hear holy men like this speak of things which I have not previously considered to be a Catholic issue, I listen and take note.
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There are more than a couple of very holy priests who are quite willing to discuss and preach about how we should be living our daily lives. Bishop Williamson is perhaps the most popular example. When I hear holy men like this speak of things which I have not previously considered to be a Catholic issue, I listen and take note.
I agree, although the typical response you will receive is that we are not obliged to have obedience to our priests because, due to the "irregular situation" we find ourselves in, the priests have no real jurisdiction and therefore no real authority as a parish priest does. I'm not making this stuff up. I've have heard this argument more than a few times to justify the refusal to listen to what priests tell us outside of matters directly related to the Faith.
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My priest just spoke on this last Sunday. He listed some of the prayers, devotions, and fasts that we should be keeping so that we are really Catholic and not just anti-Novus Ordo
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Like what, Dawn.
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My priest just spoke on this last Sunday. He listed some of the prayers, devotions, and fasts that we should be keeping so that we are really Catholic and not just anti-Novus Ordo
This is what I mean by "imposing". "Should".
It's one thing to encourage, it's another to call into question one's Catholicism if they don't go the whole hog, and wear hair shirts, or whatever!
Is someone who takes the discipline to blood "more Catholic"? Shouldn't we therefore all strive to do that, if we want to be proper Catholics? Why are we content not to?
Because people are different. They have different temperaments.
Clare.
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The word "should" places the threshold of imposition extrememly low. I could tell you that you can baste the hem of your skirt, but you should hem it. Is that an imposition? Or just good advice?
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I think there are some problems with the term Traditional Catholic. It seems to indicate that we are a different religion than Catholic. As if a new denomination has developed.
As far as living the right kind of life, simplifying things, reducing TV, being aware of how the world is messed up etc. I've always had that, before I even knew I would find Catholicsm. So I don't really equate those kind of things with Traditional Catholicism.
It seems to me that following all the rules and morals of the church makes one "traditional" catholic. I get it all the time from my, for lack of a better term, "regular" Catholic friends. They accuse me of being sooo goood, just because I don't miss mass, and because I go to confession at least once a month. But in reality, that should be what it takes just to be a Catholic, if you have an intact sense of integrity.
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Yes, "traditional Catholic" should mean today what "Catholic" used to mean. We have to use the term "traditional" as if to say, "I'm a Catholic and I'm serious about my Faith".
Beyond that, it also implies that we are set on keeping our Faith (doctrines, morals, practices, etc.) as it was from the beginning -- with no large ruptures.
It's true that much of the "culture" that surrounds our Faith could be found elsewhere (for instance, frugality is also found among Green environmentalists, a more family-centered life is also found with the Mormons, etc.) but I think that since (traditional) Catholics have everything in order Supernaturally, then why not have the Natural in order as well?
Just for good example, if nothing else. You have muslims (and protestants) who don't obsess about alcohol (or avoid it), you have Mormons who have "family day" once a week -- the TV goes off, the schedules are cleared, and time is spent together. The Amish manage to avoid high psychiatry bills by staying closer to a natural life. And so on.
The problem is, ALL THESE FALSE RELIGIONS get it wrong. They go too far, because their religion isn't true, and so it can't guide them properly. Catholics have the prudence and guidance of the Church, and the example of thousands of saints. We should be able to figure out what to do :)
This is a BIG topic though -- it will take more than one post to exhaust it. I just wanted to get started.
Matthew
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Yes, Miss Fluffy (Hi, by the way! :cheers: ) you are right that "Traditional Catholic" is sort of redundant. As Matthew said though, it is by necessity given the state of the current crisis to have to distinguish ourselves by a modifier. Would that a day will come soon when such an adjective does not need to precede the word "Catholic"!
On a practical day-to-day level, I want to throw out my thoughts on what it means to be living the Catholic Faith. It is not an exhaustive list by any means so please feel free to add to it.
1) Daily morning and evening prayer
2) Reciting the Angelus morning, noon, and night and prayers before and after all meals
3) Daily Rosary
4) Daily Meditation on some truth of the Faith (Four Last Things, The Blessed Mother, etc.) or a chapter of Spiritual Reading (Imitation of Christ, Preparation for Death, etc)
5) Reading of at least a half hour on some edifying subject such as the Classics, History, Crisis in the Church, etc.
6) Giving a full days work for a full days pay, performing our daily duty faithfully.
7) Avoiding all profanity in speech and off color or suggestive conversations. Keeping custody of the eyes, heart, and mind.
8) Dressing with dignity, both men and women, according to our state in life.
9) Total Consecration to the Blessed Mother according to the method of St Louis DeMontfort
10) Weekly Communion, attending Mass on all Sundays and Holy Days of Obligation, as well as First Friday and Saturdays. If we have daily access to Mass we should make all efforts to go.
11) A yearly or semi-yearly retreat
12) Whenever we find our mind free from our tasks for a moment, let our thoughts return always to Our Lord, His Blessed Mother, the saints, etc. by some small aspiration or mental prayer such as "Lord Jesus Christ have mercy on me a sinner", "O Mary conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee", etc
Ok, that's enough for now. I don't want to overwhelm anyone. :shocked: The above is only a suggestion of what a persons day might look like and at first glance may see legalistic, but we have to have practical, tangible methods if we want to continue to or begin to grow in sanctity. :soapbox:
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I'm there with 6,7,8,10, and 12. I manage to pray once a day, and often forget to pray at meals. I work on reading stuff on the weekends, but certainly not daily.
I have a long ways to go :)
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I'm there with 6,7,8,10, and 12. I manage to pray once a day, and often forget to pray at meals. I work on reading stuff on the weekends, but certainly not daily.
I have a long ways to go :)
Don't worry, it is a daily struggle for me as well. ;)
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On a practical day-to-day level, I want to throw out my thoughts on what it means to be living the Catholic Faith. It is not an exhaustive list by any means so please feel free to add to it.
1) Daily morning and evening prayer
2) Reciting the Angelus morning, noon, and night and prayers before and after all meals
3) Daily Rosary
4) Daily Meditation on some truth of the Faith (Four Last Things, The Blessed Mother, etc.) or a chapter of Spiritual Reading (Imitation of Christ, Preparation for Death, etc)
5) Reading of at least a half hour on some edifying subject such as the Classics, History, Crisis in the Church, etc.
6) Giving a full days work for a full days pay, performing our daily duty faithfully.
7) Avoiding all profanity in speech and off color or suggestive conversations. Keeping custody of the eyes, heart, and mind.
8) Dressing with dignity, both men and women, according to our state in life.
9) Total Consecration to the Blessed Mother according to the method of St Louis DeMontfort
10) Weekly Communion, attending Mass on all Sundays and Holy Days of Obligation, as well as First Friday and Saturdays. If we have daily access to Mass we should make all efforts to go.
11) A yearly or semi-yearly retreat
12) Whenever we find our mind free from our tasks for a moment, let our thoughts return always to Our Lord, His Blessed Mother, the saints, etc. by some small aspiration or mental prayer such as "Lord Jesus Christ have mercy on me a sinner",
These are all good suggestions.
And I must say, that MOST of them are do-able even for a layman. Sometimes on a busy day the spiritual reading for 1/2 hour might be difficult, and daily Mass is a dream for most of us (both availability, and having the time) but many of your suggestions are suprisingly layman-friendly.
For instance, the Imitation of Christ has very short chapters. But the material is DEEP and very helpful for the spiritual life. Just 5 minutes is all it would take. And the book is pocket-size and cheap!
Daily morning/evening prayer anyone can (and should) do -- quantity is not important, only consistency. Just be faithful to a few vocal prayers to start/end your day. Again, we're talking a few minutes.
The Rosary is VERY important, in this age we're in. Our Lady will preserve those who are devoted to her. We all NEED HER HELP, and desperately! We're fighting against Satan and his big guns. The Rosary CAN be said in the car if need be, though it's probably better to say it at home IF you have a choice -- but don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good! Rosary on the way to/from work is better than no Rosary. You can even break it up 2 decades on the way to work/ 3 decades on the way home.
For the Total Consecration (see above paragraph on the Rosary), you just have to read a bit and prepare, and make the consecration once. Then you just say a SHORT invocation every morning, and say the longer form on big Marian feasts and/or the anniversary day of your consecration.
Doing an honest day's work doesn't take any extra time :) Same with trying to guide our kids (if any) to sanctity. Basically, do our duty of state as best we can. That is how we'll become saints -- in the vocation God put us in.
Prayers before/after meals helps to bring the Faith into daily life. It doesn't take long -- you just need to form the habit. We're not protestants, so we don't have to come up with our own custom blessing for each meal :) It's not heretical or anything, but overly difficult. Just use the stock Catholic prayer, "Bless us, O Lord, and these Thy gifts which we are about to receive, from Thy bounty, through Christ our Lord. Amen." and perhaps add, "May the souls of the faithful departed, through the mercy of God, rest in peace. Amen."
The last point -- try to raise our minds/hearts to God during the day -- will be helped if you set an alarm to help you recite the Angelus, etc. but also it helps to cut out as many worldly distractions as possible. Don't have a radio or TV running all the time -- embrace silence when you can. God will not compete with CNN to speak in your soul.
I'm as distracted as anyone, so I can't imagine how much more distracted I'd be if I allowed all the modern "media" in the house! I figure the house is one place where we don't have to look at advertising. It's the one refuge from the world!
Have you ever heard how all temptations come from "The world, the flesh, and the devil"? Interesting what order they're in... I think they're in order -- most come from the world, 2nd most come from the flesh and the fewest number come from the devil. (Actually, "I think" isn't entirely accurate -- many saints and mystics have said the same thing)
Matthew
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11) A yearly or semi-yearly retreat
I think this is important, but unfortunately the accessability of good retreats makes it very difficult for many people. While I attended the NO church and was single, I was keeping up with this, but many of those retreats were only decent because I didn't know any better. I've never regretted any time or money spent on retreats, though. God seemed to make the best of even the mediocre ones to strengthen my faith and draw me closer to what He desires.
Unfortunately, I haven't seen any ads for a "Mommy and Me" Ignatian retreat. :smirk:
:baby:
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Years ago I set a strict requirement that I could not eat until I said my prayers, and that has remained with me. I say the Angelus before each meal rather than at the prescribed times because it was the only way to make sure I said it thrice daily. The only prayer I say at a prescribed time is the Chaplet of Divine Mercy. The rosary is our bedtime prayer.
I only mention this because habits are built one at a time, through persistence for a time. Other good prayers are the one the angel taught the children at Fatima, guardian angel, morning offering, St Gertrude's prayer.
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Yes, you reminded me of an important point --
All of these wonderful Catholic practices should be added to your daily routine ONE AT A TIME -- to give yourself time to adjust, and for the habit to form.
A habit takes 7-10 days to form (or be broken). You don't want to overwhelm yourself all at once, and then end up doing nothing new.
Just slowly, gradually, add new pious practices to your life.
In Christ,
Matthew
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Yes, "traditional Catholic" should mean today what "Catholic" used to mean. We have to use the term "traditional" as if to say, "I'm a Catholic and I'm serious about my Faith".
I agree!
As far as I am concerned "Catholic" and "Traditional Catholic" are synonymous!
Clare.
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'"Are we Traditional Catholics, or are we just anti-Novus Ordo?!"'
This is a loaded question meant to put a traditional Catholic on the defensive.
To be a traditional Catholic is to be anti-Novus Ordo! Novus Ordo Catholicism is, for all intents and purposes, almost a completely different religion. Novus Ordo Catholicism is, at least as it is being implemented currently, irreconcilable with Catholic Tradition.
So there is no being 'just anti-Novus Ordo'... THAT is the whole point: traditional Catholics dont want anything to do with the Novus Ordo!
Of course, you could simply put the matter in more positive terminology. It is not that we are 'anti-Novus Ordo': we are pro-Catholic Tradition. If the Novus Ordonistas want to look at us in that fashion, then point out to them that:
We are what you once were.
We believe what you once believed.
We worship as you once worshipped.
If you were right then, we are right now.
If we are wrong now, you were wrong then.
'So, what does it mean to be a Traditional Catholic? Who determines what is traditional and what is not, especially when it comes to issues that are not directly related to Faith or dogma? Share your thoughts, please. I will myself when I have more time.'
To be a traditional Catholic means that you simply adhere to the same Faith, Sacraments, etc. that have been taught since the founding of the Church by Our Lord.
Who determines what is traditional? The Church, under the leadership of the Pope, concerning matters of Faith and morality. Particular cultural and/or ethnic groups determine what is traditional in many other areas.
Clare's definition -- 'To me, being a traditional Catholic, is simply discovering communion with the saints and ordinary Catholics of before Vatican II' -- is a good working definition. Most traditional Catholics attempt to practice the Catholic Faith as if Vatican II simply never happened.
'There are more than a couple of very holy priests who are quite willing to discuss and preach about how we should be living our daily lives. Bishop Williamson is perhaps the most popular example.'
I would pay very close attention to H. E. Bp. Williamson. Most of the Modernists (and many so-called 'Traditionalists') who attack Catholic Tradition focus their ire on Bp. Williamson. Bp. Williamson appears to have the clearest (publically speaking) grasp of the gravity of the situation facing our Catholic culture and civilisation. And, because the evil, destructive forces loosed upon our civilization this past millenium have always had, at their core, an abiding hatred for the Church -- by definition, whatever Evil hates is good.
'It's one thing to encourage, it's another to call into question one's Catholicism if they don't go the whole hog, and wear hair shirts, or whatever! Is someone who takes the discipline to blood "more Catholic"? Shouldn't we therefore all strive to do that, if we want to be proper Catholics? Why are we content not to?'
A 'minimalist' is someone who does the bare minimum requirements required for any given standard. No, that doesnt make such people any less Catholic than someone who goes the extra mile to set a better example.
Which example would you prefer? The person who does the bare minimum just to put his 'check in the box', so to speak? Or someone who puts a little more effort into his adherence to the Faith?
The best example, and most apparently controversial, of this minimalist approach has to do with traditional Catholic women and how they dress and behave, esp. with regard to the whole skirt/no skirt issue.
'I think there are some problems with the term Traditional Catholic. It seems to indicate that we are a different religion than Catholic. As if a new denomination has developed.'
I avoid the use of capital 'T' because to do so makes it appear as if traditional Catholicism is in fact a different 'denomination'. I recommend that others do the same. We are traditional Catholics (if you need to use a qualifier), not Traditional Catholics, if you will.
On the other hand, we adhere to Catholic Tradition, which is a distinct term, as in the two pillars of the Catholic Faith: Scripture and Tradition.
'1) Daily morning and evening prayer
2) Reciting the Angelus morning, noon, and night and prayers before and after all meals
3) Daily Rosary
4) Daily Meditation on some truth of the Faith (Four Last Things, The Blessed Mother, etc.) or a chapter of Spiritual Reading (Imitation of Christ, Preparation for Death, etc)
5) Reading of at least a half hour on some edifying subject such as the Classics, History, Crisis in the Church, etc.
6) Giving a full days work for a full days pay, performing our daily duty faithfully.
7) Avoiding all profanity in speech and off color or suggestive conversations. Keeping custody of the eyes, heart, and mind.
8) Dressing with dignity, both men and women, according to our state in life.
9) Total Consecration to the Blessed Mother according to the method of St Louis DeMontfort
10) Weekly Communion, attending Mass on all Sundays and Holy Days of Obligation, as well as First Friday and Saturdays. If we have daily access to Mass we should make all efforts to go.
11) A yearly or semi-yearly retreat
12) Whenever we find our mind free from our tasks for a moment, let our thoughts return always to Our Lord, His Blessed Mother, the saints, etc. by some small aspiration or mental prayer such as "Lord Jesus Christ have mercy on me a sinner", "O Mary conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee", etc'
I try to use the SSPX's rules for Third Order Members as my basic guideline for Catholic 'reponsibilities' (apart from the Church's Commandments):
- Habitual abstinence from television
- Morning and evening prayer
- Daily rosary
- Confession once a month
- Fifteen minutes of mental prayer every day (or daily Mass where it is possible)
- Retreat every two years
Some comments on a personal level:
At our home, the TV is a work-in-progress. Suffice it to say that I dont turn it on except to watch a few movies I have on DVD. I'd like to get rid of it altogether, but I havent dont that yet.
I pray every evening before going to bed, but havent gotten down a good morning routine other than to say a prayer to my guardian angel before getting on the road and going to work.
I do have a Monastic Diurnal which has all the day-time hours of the Divine Office and intend to start using it. I recommend that other traditional Catholic obtain one as well, if for no other reason than as a reference.
Or, if you want something more complete, you might get a copy of the Divine Office from Angelus Press, which has Prime, Sext, and Compline for every day, plus all the hours (so I'm told) for Sunday. A Divine Office is on my list of things to purchase.
Our family prays (privately, i.e. at home) the Rosary daily. I supplement our Rosary with prayers from the St. Andrews Daily Missal and the Raccolta, such as:
- a Prayer to the BVM
- the Memorare
- the Litany of the BVM
- a Prayer to St. Joseph
- a Prayer to St. Michael
- a Prayer for the Sovereign Pontiff
- a Prayer for the Faithful Departed
- a Prayer for the Christian Family
I recommend both a Raccolta and the St. Andrews Daily Missal very strongly. I think Angelus has them and they're probably available from TAN and other traditional Catholic sources.
Online, I found a blog by someone called 'Br. Alexis Bugnolo'. His blog is called That Christ May Reign! (http://utregnetchristusiesus.blogspot.com/). He wrote a short series of articles on being (traditional) Catholic called 'To Establish the Kingdom'.
I havent read everything he's written, so I cant endorse everything he's written, but the articles titled The Catholic Family (http://utregnetchristusiesus.blogspot.com/2006/07/catholic-family-some-basic-must-dos.html), The Family Table (http://utregnetchristusiesus.blogspot.com/2006/07/family-table.html), The Family Altar (http://utregnetchristusiesus.blogspot.com/2006/07/family-altar.html), and The Family Library (http://utregnetchristusiesus.blogspot.com/2006/07/importance-of-library-at-home.html) are, in my opinion, very good and worth reading. They arent only applicable to Catholic families: Catholic individuals could benefit from reading these articles and putting their principles into practice.
'Prayers before/after meals helps to bring the Faith into daily life. It doesn't take long -- you just need to form the habit. We're not protestants, so we don't have to come up with our own custom blessing for each meal.'
There are 'standard' prayers that the Church teaches us to say before and after meals and my advice is to use those. You're right: we're not Protestants. Making up our own prayers can lead to an excess of pride, i.e. we'll start making them up to 'impress' our friends and family, and not to honour God.
'I think this is important, but unfortunately the accessability of good retreats makes it very difficult for many people.'
I wasnt raised Catholic, so I dont know much about retreats other than I want to go on one and start making it a yearly or bi-annual tradition. I know the SSPX has retreats scheduled regularly.
'The only prayer I say at a prescribed time is the Chaplet of Divine Mercy.'
I just learned about Chaplets a few months ago, at Michaelmas. So, I bought a St. Michael Chaplet and learned the prayers. Chaplets seem to be one of those things like Scapulars: not many people know about them or use them. I think using pre-Vatican II Chaplets is a good idea. (Are there any 'post-Vatican II' Chaplets?)
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'It's one thing to encourage, it's another to call into question one's Catholicism if they don't go the whole hog, and wear hair shirts, or whatever! Is someone who takes the discipline to blood "more Catholic"? Shouldn't we therefore all strive to do that, if we want to be proper Catholics? Why are we content not to?'
A 'minimalist' is someone who does the bare minimum requirements required for any given standard. No, that doesnt make such people any less Catholic than someone who goes the extra mile to set a better example.
Which example would you prefer? The person who does the bare minimum just to put his 'check in the box', so to speak? Or someone who puts a little more effort into his adherence to the Faith?
Going the extra mile is an individual choice. It is commendable.
It's just when some of those who go the extra mile look down on those who do the minimum, that I get irked!
Because for sure, since we all sin, even those who go the extra mile sin too. But those of them who are critical of the minimalists just for not making an extra effort, even if that laxity isn't sinful in itself ... well motes and beams! Gnats and camels! Casting stones!
It's sinners criticising other sinners over things which aren't sinful!
Clare.
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Going the extra mile is an individual choice. It is commendable.
It's just when some of those who go the extra mile look down on those who do the minimum, that I get irked!
Because for sure, since we all sin, even those who go the extra mile sin too. But those of them who are critical of the minimalists just for not making an extra effort, even if that laxity isn't sinful in itself ... well motes and beams! Gnats and camels! Casting stones!
It's sinners criticising other sinners over things which aren't sinful!
Clare.
Well, look at it this way. If we didn't have a few "hardliners" pushing us to do more than just the status quo, we no doubt would be content to mire in our own lukewarm-ness and mediocrity.
For example, if I never had never come in contact with people that would tell me to shun the N.O. completely and have those same people putting their money where there mouth is by living what they were exhorting me to do, there is little chance I would be attending the Traditional Mass exclusively today. Sometimes, it is necessary to let others know the little things we are doing so they have encouragement to know that real people are doing and can attain those "ideals" that seem so lofty and which are high above the "is it a sin" mentality.
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'It's just when some of those who go the extra mile look down on those who do the minimum, that I get irked!'
So? Be irked!
'Because for sure, since we all sin, even those who go the extra mile sin too.'
'It's sinners criticising other sinners over things which aren't sinful!'
And your point is...? No one is claiming to be sinless.
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Clare, do you read the saints? Their works and bios?
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At our home, the TV is a work-in-progress. Suffice it to say that I dont turn it on except to watch a few movies I have on DVD. I'd like to get rid of it altogether, but I havent dont that yet.
I'm not sure what your reasons are for not removing the TV yet, but I wanted to share a few thoughts.
I used to have the TV in the corner that collected dust except for a few videos. And that was just videos as anything on DVD worth watching plays on my PC just as well. I got my news at the time from the radio on my way to work. When I moved, the TV didn't come with me and was never given a place in our house. It's funny how one little box can dominate an entire room, but it seems as though we have more space in our house since we don't have a room dedicated to a television. A relative of ours had the problem of his family not being quite as ready to get rid of the TV as he was. In their house, the TV was moved into the basement so that the family room could be for just that, the family.
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Bishop Williamson's Letters
January 1,1999
Dear Friends and Benefactors,
January being the month of the Holy Family, and the family today being in great distress, here are some reflections of a Society of St. Pius X priest, Fr. James Doran, drawing on several years of pastoral experience of family problems in "Traditional" United States parishes today:
Q: What is the essential problem of the family in modern society?
Fr. D: Fathers lack vision, vision of the Fatherhood of God and hence vision of their own fatherhood. They do not see the nobility and obligations of their vocation to manifest the Fatherhood of God in their own households, so their fatherhood disintegrates into a series of disconnected details. They are reduced to "bread-winner", "husband", "dad", etc. They need a re-integrated vision of their vocation and consecration in the sacrament of marriage.
Q: Why is the modern world making things so difficult for the family?
Fr. D: The modern world is against Christ, against nature and for a nєω ωσrℓ∂ σr∂єr. Firstly, in its materialism, rejecting Christ, it rejects supernature and with the whole order of grace, it rejects the saving superstructure of the sacrament of marriage. Secondly, rejecting nature as it was always understood in the past, because technological man supposedly knows better, in the name of being modern it dismantles the natural structure of marriage, bending man and woman out of true to make their natural complementarity into an unnatural tension. Thirdly, in order to build a nєω ωσrℓ∂ σr∂єr it is striving to give the family a new structure which in theory respects all different needs, but in practice divides everyone from everybody else in a planned fragmentation and chaos.
Q: Is all of this primarily a problem of nature or of grace?
Fr. D: It is a problem of both, because fallen nature is irredeemable without grace, but without nature grace has nothing to heal, transform and elevate. Man is one. Grace and nature must integrate. Grace is in itself infinitely higher than nature, but there is no state of grace without some poor nature to receive it. Again, the vision must be integral.
Q: How many percent - speaking generally - do you blame the man, how many percent the woman for today's problems of the family?
Fr. D: 90% the man, 10% the woman. Man was created by God the head of Creation, its leader; woman was created man's help-mate and companion. When Eve fell, and led, Adam was doomed; but only when Adam fell was mankind doomed. His refusing to lead, his being led by her, wounded all creation. Nothing is rectified until man leads, hence Christ, the New Adam, who goes before us, leading us, in carrying the Cross, which is the remedy of the failure to lead. When men refuse to lead, then women become unhinged. Then the part they play in the disaster increases.
Q: How did the destruction of the family take place? Who were the destroyers?
Fr. D: Firstly, the Protestants who took away the Church and put the individual on his own in front of God. This undermined both family and society. God's Heaven is a "communion of saints", a Catholic parish is a community of faithful, but man set on his own loses that sense of the common good. The living community begins to die. Society and family become mere assemblies of individuals. This process was completed by industrialism in the last century. Corrupt governments no longer sought to make of society a living community in which all men work firstly for the common good. Instead, men became mere cogs for profit in an industrial machine which is dead and kills. Profits came first. Families came second. Work was no longer a service to one's fellow-men, but "a job". In fact families are now a liability for the employer, a commodity to be factored into the "breadwinner's" wage. Hence contracts, negotiations, insurance, benefits, strikes, maternity leave, etc. Industrialism was the death of the family.
Q: How can a husband and wife, with the best will in the world, create in the home Catholic order such as they have never seen around them?
Fr. D: Firstly, by a joint vision of the end or purpose, of what they want their Catholic family to be. Secondly, by a joint pursuit of the appropriate and dignified means, to achieve that noble vision. Thirdly, if at all possible, let them associate with at least two other families in pursuit of that end.
Q: Can such a couple, with the best will in the world, stand up to the anti-society as it is today, all around them?
Fr. D: It is a question of grace, constancy and perseverance. The grace must come from their Faith, the sacraments, a priest. The constancy is of great importance, especially on the part of the father. Constancy builds parameters, defines limits, and lets everyone know what they are expected to do. A man cannot lay down the law in his family just by laying it down, still less by ranting and raving, but by his constancy he forms habits and customs which are the greatest support to law. A man who is constant need do little. He takes time with his family. They know what he expects and they act accordingly because he always expects the same thing. Moods do not govern his household, so its members are tranquil, which inspires confidence in him. Because he is constant, he is center and source of unity, author of oneness, authority in the harmony. Taking time with his family now makes his life easier later. Thus he himself benefits from his own constancy. He leads, and, in the Faith, nature is created anew in his family by grace.
Q: Do you know of some good books on rebuilding the family?
Fr. D: Here are three. "Fatherless America" by David Blankenhorn (Harper Perennial, 10, E. 53rd St., New York, NY 10022: $14.00) portrays the gravity of the situation and emphasizes the need to get rid of a "divorce mentality". "Raising your children", Integrity vol. II (Angelus Press, 2918 Tracy Ave., Kansas City, MO 64109: $ 18.50) presents a rich variety of topics on the question. Lastly, "Christian Fatherhood" by Stephen Wood (Family Life Center Publications, P.O. Box 6060, Port Charlotte, FL 33949: $12.95) despite its Protestant tone has a strong Catholic foundation, basing the family on the Sacred Heart and on the father's imitating St. Joseph.
Q: How much can these books do?
Fr. D: Without a live teacher, little, unless the family father is himself a man of discipline and vision.
Q: When a married couple comes to you in difficulties, no doubt each case is different, but at the same time probably your diagnosis will run along certain lines, or expectations. What lines? What expectations?
Fr. D: What is the father doing? What did he learn to do, and where? Then I ask the mother, who will inundate me with detailed stories! As for expectations, they vary, depending on how far the disintegration has gone. The minimum to be obtained is constancy, even if the details are small.
Q: And what if one spouse comes to you without the other?
Fr. D: That will usually be the wife who comes without the husband, because the neglect is usually on the side of the husband who therefore does not bother, or refuses, to come. So I listen to the wife and then will try to get hold of the husband because - generally speaking - either he is the source of the problem or he is the one that needs to rectify it. If he comes, it is a good sign. One is liable to be up against masculine pride and ego!
Q: Is the parish priest best placed to help a family and home? If so, why?
Fr. D: The Catholic household being founded on the Gospel, the Holy Eucharist and Penance, then the priest as source of these is indispensable to the Catholic household's well-being. For the priest, this is a most grave obligation, but it is also his priestly fruitfulness. He has no physical children, but he brings forth the image of Christ in his spiritual children.
Q: How much can anyone do to help who is not a parish priest?
Fr. D: Not a great deal, because Catholic marriage is a supernatural mystery between man and wife. Friends can help by giving good example, by listening with compassion and, best of all, by praying.
Q: What is your advice to fellow-priests in today's extra-difficult ministry on these questions?
Fr. D: Learn well the doctrine of the Catholic Church on marriage and family, especially the encyclicals "Arcanum Divinae Sapientiae" of Leo XIII and "Casti Connubii" of Pius XI. Set noble standards for all members of the family. Preach in season and out of season. Do not become romantic or take a sentimental view of marriage problems. They are real. Married life is difficult. Proclaim loudly over the din of the modern world what is the purpose and true good of married life. People need to be given the Catholic vision.
Q: How much can the Spiritual Exercises of St. Ignatius help?
Fr. D: They are an excellent "jump-start" and source of conversion. However the world surrounding us today with its anti-culture is such that retreatants must swim against the current from the moment they leave the Retreat-house. That is why if the principles learned from the Exercises are not continued and supported at parish level, from week to week, they are liable to lose the greater part of their force. However, a half or even quarter loaf can be better than no bread.
Q: What advice can you give to a couple with family struggling far away from any parish or even access to the Spiritual Exercises?
Fr. D: Let husband and wife be united in the effort to pray and to learn the doctrine of the Church They may be far from any regular parish or priest, but their union is still consecrated in holy matrimony, so their home can still be a sanctuary where God is adored. The situation is never hopeless.
Q: How much importance do you give to throwing the TV set out of the home? What about video-tapes?
Fr. D: Television, as television, must be wiped out. As for video-tapes. . . oh dear! If the family father is strong, perhaps, once every six weeks... because if he is weak, even throwing out the TV set does no good, as he will be incapable of organizing the family in other entertainment, which is necessary. Thus without meaning to, he will antagonize his family and their last state is liable to be worse than their first. On the other hand if he is truly head of his family and leads it as it should be lead, then the live communication and interaction amongst the family members will by itself wean the family from its addiction to television. Again, it comes back to fathers!
Q: How much importance do you give to the womenfolk never wearing trousers?
Fr. D: When a woman's mind is informed by the gracious ideal of a lady, she will naturally turn away from such masculine clothing. Perhaps when working she may occasionally slip back into slacks, but if the noble image of woman is regularly presented from the pulpit, with also perhaps a little gentle nudging, she will persevere until feminine dress becomes a habit. "Never trousers" then becomes a reality. On the contrary a "never" on command and demanded immediately is often artificial and lacks foundation because it lacks conviction and rests only on obedience. Actually, most resistance of women to women's dress comes from ignorance of the true role of women.
Q: How much can ignorance be overcome with audio- or video-tapes?
Fr. D: They are useful conveyors of information up to a certain point, but they can never replace the live human teacher (especially not for children!). The Gospel is "incarnated" in and by live human beings. "Faith is by hearing", says St. Paul.
Q: It is known you are a great believer in the Enthronement of the Sacred Heart of Jesus in the home. What is the minimum necessary on the part of the family for this Enthronement to be efficacious?
Fr. D: Assuming the parents know what the Enthronement means, they must have at least the desire for God to be truly the center of their home. "Where there's a will, there's a way". With God, good will goes a long way.
Q: Have you any final advice for families, or for family fathers?
Fr. D: The men must move mountains to spend time with their family, especially the children whom they can all too easily ignore. Dear Friends and Benefactors, please find enclosed the summer program at Winona, including the time-table for Spiritual Exercises of St. Ignatius, and for Fr. Doran's second workshop on the Family, in early July. Also we are sending out again the overview of one of the encyclicals on marriage, because it is mentioned above.
Happy New Year! The situation is not good, but it is not one in which there is nothing we can do.
Sincerely yours in Christ,
+ Richard Williamson
http://www.sspx.ca/Docuмents/Bishop-Williamson/January1-1999.htm
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He answers my question as to whether the men dropped the ball or the women snatched it from them. That's important, you see, because if the men dropped the ball you have the problem of convincing them to pick it back up.
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Vatican II was a revolution, and the religion which was born at that time is completely antithetical to the Catholic religion. Traditional Catholic just means Catholic, minus all the man-made modernist insanity; just as organic farming simply means farming, minus all the man-made, modern insanity. We are only obliged to use the word 'traditional' because the thieves presently occupying Rome and the other chanceries around the world have thought it useful to retain the name of Catholic whilst rejecting the reality.
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Perhaps a better question might be, how do we discern what we should be doing? What do we do to keep ourselves growing in holiness (or to even begin in that direction if we've halted for a moment, or two, or three...).
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'I'm not sure what your reasons are for not removing the TV yet,...'
One 'good' reason is that I have an entire series of doctrinal conference tapes by Bishop Williamson that arent (as far as I know) available on DVD.
'That's important, you see, because if the men dropped the ball you have the problem of convincing them to pick it back up.'
Not only that, but you have the problem of taking the ball away from the women who have picked it up in the meantime.
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What do we do to keep ourselves growing in holiness (or to even begin in that direction if we've halted for a moment, or two, or three...).
Remember that the holiness is God's, not your own. That having been recalled, ask Him more frequently and more ardently to fill your poor soul (and mine, too, while you are at it) with His own infinitely beautiful holiness. If you have cooled, or ceased to do so, it matters not. What has passed - good, bad, or ugly - has passed. Today is the day, now is the acceptable time. We must always be making fresh starts, even if we (seem to) have persevered in doing good for a long while. Each day is a new life; each night is a kind of death. Misereri mei, Deus.
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1) Daily morning and evening prayer
2) Reciting the Angelus morning, noon, and night and prayers before and after all meals
3) Daily Rosary
4) Daily Meditation on some truth of the Faith (Four Last Things, The Blessed Mother, etc.) or a chapter of Spiritual Reading (Imitation of Christ, Preparation for Death, etc)
5) Reading of at least a half hour on some edifying subject such as the Classics, History, Crisis in the Church, etc.
6) Giving a full days work for a full days pay, performing our daily duty faithfully.
7) Avoiding all profanity in speech and off color or suggestive conversations. Keeping custody of the eyes, heart, and mind.
8) Dressing with dignity, both men and women, according to our state in life.
9) Total Consecration to the Blessed Mother according to the method of St Louis DeMontfort
10) Weekly Communion, attending Mass on all Sundays and Holy Days of Obligation, as well as First Friday and Saturdays. If we have daily access to Mass we should make all efforts to go.
11) A yearly or semi-yearly retreat
12) Whenever we find our mind free from our tasks for a moment, let our thoughts return always to Our Lord, His Blessed Mother, the saints, etc. by some small aspiration or mental prayer such as "Lord Jesus Christ have mercy on me a sinner", "O Mary conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee", etc
Just to go back for a second to the list above, some people say that that's a bit legalistic or formalistic. but in a sense that is a good thing because it gives one a clear set if things to commit to. Also, some of these prayers may be formulaic. But it is better to utter a formula than to utter nothing and the Church is a better creator of prayers than we. What I mean is that too much private and spntaneous prayer, however sincere, may put us in danger of thinking we can put our own unguided thoughts above the church: better to have our thoughts guided into the tradtional and proper channels of the Church's prayer.
I accept the need to pray before and after meals. I wonder f there are others like me who, moving amongst non-believers and heretics, have to overcome real embarassment in crossing oneself and saying Grace at meals.
I have discussed this with friends and we had a couple of other tyhings that in my humble opinion every traditional catholic (read: "Catholic") should consider:-
(a) before bed and as part of evening prayers, make an examiniation of conscience for the day and if something needs to be corrected WRITE IT DOWN. that helps when preparing for confession and also may help you analyse where your repeated temptations are.
(b) be careful about the state of one's conscience. If you are a frequent receiver of Holy Communion, make sure that you are in a state of grace beforehand and make time before Communion to examine conscience and go to confession if necessary. And needless to say don't do as most NO heretics do, receive Communion without having gone to confession when necessary. Stay in the pew and make a spiritual Communion if need be.
Just some thoughts
Mark
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Those people who keep on repeating that the Pope and other lawful superiors have no authority over the Catholic flock.
Of course, they do. Catholics simply await a Pope. But when elected/elevated, Catholics owe him their obedience. And lawful bishops, etc.
But a bishop who teaches against The Church, who is precisely what Pope St. Pius X said a Catholic cannot be in his effort to stem the tide of Modernism, cannot be a Catholic. If a heretic or apostate, he can't either be a bishop or demand any obedience from Catholics. It would be as if Louis Farrakhan suddenly demanded a tithe from the CMRI. The CMRI don't answer to 'Calypso Louie'.
And above all, the dire need to pray to Almighty God and the Blessed Mother for the regaining of the whole Catholic Church its four distinctive marks: One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic!
And you believe Roman Protestantism meets even one of those four tests?
In what way?
One? They don't consider themselves one, but part of a separated group of 'brethren', a co-equal 'sister congregation', and so forth. Holy? In what way? Holiness hardly seems esteemed, even at that, in Roman Protestantism. Modernism does not allow for the supernatural, for grace, really for God. Again, read what Pope St. Pius X wrote on this. I suspect you haven't. Catholic? The Church contemns Modernism. There's no 'gray area', here. Apostolic? I give you an example. If a Protestant is 'grandfathered' in as a priest, even as a married vicar, without even conditional orders, how does he follow in the line? And what about the changes made to Holy Orders, I believe in 1968, the first of the Sacraments to be remade in the image Roman Protestantism? Without proper orders, whence Apostolic Succession?
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Thus we recognize and respect the Holy Father Pope Benedict XVI (and even pray for him oftentimes) as the Vicar of Christ and successor of St. Peter, but openly reject his destabilizing the Catholic Religion (see Galatians 2: 11-14).
Which practice (known as "Recognize and Resist") necessarily requires habitual disobedience.