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Author Topic: Abortion and Ireland  (Read 3792 times)

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Offline John Grace

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Abortion and Ireland
« on: July 11, 2013, 05:29:09 AM »
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  • http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/fg-brand-grabbing-of-aine-collins-by-tom-barry-in-dail-last-night-horseplay-600153.html
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    11/07/2013 - 10:23:31
    Fine Gael has dismissed as ‘horseplay’ an incident during which Áine Collins was pulled onto the lap of party colleague Tom Barry during the abortion debate in the early hours of the morning.

    The party said the Cork North West TD was not offended after she was grabbed by Mr Barry, the Cork East TD during an often tense debate on the controversial legislation.

    It is understood Ms Collins commented she was cold and Mr Barry joked he would warm her up.
    Sources said the two are close friends and there was no malice involved.

    They remarked that the TDs had been working for more 20 hours non-stop and were tired, but accepted the context of the incident would have been better suited to the pub than the Dáil.

    Meanwhile two Fine Gael Ministers have branded last night's hijinks as an inappropriate action.
    Richard Bruton and Frances Fitzgerald said the incident should not sidetrack the importance of the legislation.
    "We acknowledge that was inappropriate but we want to continue important work on an issue that the government is absolutely committed to deliver," said Mr Bruton.
    "Last night was a very important debate on critical issues let's not be distracted from that important debate," Ms Fitzgerald added.


    Offline John Grace

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    Abortion and Ireland
    « Reply #1 on: July 11, 2013, 05:32:12 AM »
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  • I believe more and more people in Ireland now see these politicians for what they are. Many, who were regarded as 'pro-life' are no more pro-life than the man on the moon. I have always believed them all to be self serving and liars.

    It has been said the deal on abortion was done long ago and we see even on the grave matter of abortion, the politicians have 'fun' as the article I posted shows.


    It has been said booze was drank in good measure last evening at the parliament.



    Offline John Grace

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    Abortion and Ireland
    « Reply #2 on: July 11, 2013, 08:29:10 AM »
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  • http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/barry-apologises-for-grabbing-incident-while-rabbitte-insists-nobody-was-drunk-600153.html
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    Fine Gael has dismissed as ‘horseplay’ an incident during which Áine Collins was pulled onto the lap of party colleague Tom Barry during the abortion debate in the early hours of the morning.


    Quote
    Meanwhile, the Communications Minister Pat Rabbitte said nobody was drunk in the Dáil chamber last night.
    Minister Rabbitte said he did not see anyone who showed any sign of drinking to excess.
    "There wasn't anybody in my sight in the last vote which I think was about 4.50am this morning who had any sign of having taken alcohol to excess," he said.
    "Nobody that I could see."

    Offline John Grace

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    Abortion and Ireland
    « Reply #3 on: July 11, 2013, 06:51:49 PM »
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  • The vote has taken place and the bill has been passed. The plan is sign it in to law. Personally, I regarded all the debates and hearings as a farce and window dressing.

    For the first time, they have legislated to allow direct and intentional killing of the unborn child.

    Offline John Grace

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    « Reply #4 on: July 11, 2013, 07:14:11 PM »
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  • The bill hasn't gone to the Seanad nor is it law. Naturally, it will never be the law of God.


    Offline John Grace

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    « Reply #5 on: July 13, 2013, 03:16:06 PM »
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  • An interesting set of comments from 'Ard Rígh Mac Cormaic' on Facebook

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    Fine Gael and Labour have brought in Abortion in Ireland on the 12th of July. What the English couldn't do at the Battle of the Boyne in ethnically cleansing the Irish, the West Brit politicians have stepped to try to finish the job.



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    Its great to see that the Dáil bar was open till five in the morning last night and that half the TD's were langers drunk as they discussed the culling of the Irish population. We need to Abort the Dáil.

    Offline John Grace

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    « Reply #6 on: July 13, 2013, 04:51:24 PM »
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  • http://www.youthdefence.ie/latest-news/government-turns-a-blind-eye-to-medical-evidence-and-legalizes-death-penalty-for-unborn-children-say-pro-life-groups/
    Quote
    “GOVERNMENT TURNS A BLIND EYE TO MEDICAL EVIDENCE AND LEGALIZES DEATH PENALTY FOR UNBORN CHILDREN” SAY PRO-LIFE GROUPSJUL. 12, 2013
    Pro-life groups have strongly condemned the Government’s decision to ram through its flawed abortion legislation, labelling it as a “betrayal of unborn children, a betrayal of a party promise and a betrayal of the Irish people”. They have called for the Bill to be put to the people in a referendum under Article 27. Admiration was expressed for the deputies who had put principle before politics to vote No to the bill, while other politicians have been described as 'spineless and amoral' for breaking their pro-life promise.

    Speaking outside the Dáil today where the legislation was being discussed, Clare Molloy of Youth Defence described it as a “dark day for Ireland when the legislature close their ears to the medical evidence, turn their backs on the electorate to which they promised no abortion legislation, and have now legalised the death penalty for innocent unborn children."

    “This bill is barbaric,” said Ms. Molloy. "As Labour TD Roisin Shortall has pointed out, it has no term limits. It allows for the direct killing of a physically healthy baby being carried by a physically healthy mother and allows it through all nine months of pregnancy”. She continued “what kind of politician or doctors approves the killing of a fully formed human being at 22 weeks by lethal injection to the heart. Our leading doctors are opposing this legislation; because, as one if them told the Oireachtas Committee, the Bill legalises the mindless assassination of innocent human beings”.

    “We know that abortion is not a treatment for ѕυιcιdє, the psychiatrists are blue in the face from telling Enda Kenny that, but yet he chooses to ignore this evidence and says his hands are tied by the Supreme Court decision in the X Case. It  is now clear that that decision was fundamentally flawed because we didn’t have the evidence that we now know. Clean out your ears Taoiseach, if a decision is wrong then we shouldn’t follow it. The people are the final courts of appeal in this democracy and 86% of us want a referendum” Ms. Molloy concluded.

    Niamh Ui Bhriain of the Life Institute said Mr Kenny was acting in an “autocratic and bullying manner and had trampled all over conscience rights by denying a free vote within his party on an issue that was deeply conscientious and on which strong views were held”. She went on to say that the electorate would not forget the vindictive action taken by Mr Kenny in inflicting such harsh sanctions and penalties on those party colleagues who dared to defy his authoritarian whip.

    “It disgusts me that the Taoiseach would demand that his party colleagues should vote in favour of this horrific and fundamentally flawed piece of legislation and threaten them with being thrown out of the party if they fail to do so. What kind of a leader is he? What kind of a leader throws a colleague out of the party for doing exactly what they told their electorate they were going to do before election?” she said.

    Both the Life Institute and Youth Defence called for a vote on this legislation under Article 27 of the Irish Constitution. They said the huge Rally for Life which attracted 60,000 people last weekend, showed the pro life movement was committed and mobilised and would be now open to the new political alternative created by Kenny's abortion bill.

    Offline John Grace

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    « Reply #7 on: July 14, 2013, 02:18:48 PM »
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  • The only way forward now is prayer and action. Waiting to put an 'X' on a ballot paper in 2016 is not an option. It's too late to wait until then and even then how many of these are 'pro-life'. Those who were mislead in the 2011 election will never be fooled again.

    Even if a politician loses his/her seat, they can have a career or become a CEO of a big company. Nothing changes.

    I recall this from 2011

    http://thoughtactioneire.blogspot.ie/2011/10/needs-salazar.html
    [/quote]

    Saturday, 1 October 2011

    "Ireland needs a Salazar"
    Very few were inspired by any of the seven Presidential candidates during the ‘debate’ last evening on the Late Late show. Dana, to her credit spoke of our sovereignty and core values.


    Codreanu wrote of the “upright man”.

    “Up until now we have created the man of faith, the man of bravery, the man of sacrifice. Now we need the upright man.”

    “There exists in the world the cunning man, the middleman, the phoney man, the sly man, the crook. Burn, in the hottest of flames, the memory of these men. A legionary cannot be like them. He must carry the mark of the upright man.”

    “We cannot pretend to govern, to criticize and condemn rotten politicians, if we ourselves are not upright”.


    Our Sovereignty and core and absolute values are of great importance. These must be defended.
    Quote



    Offline John Grace

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    « Reply #8 on: July 14, 2013, 02:35:52 PM »
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  • It's vital that people do not become demoralised or discouraged and should never adopt the language of the pro-abortion people. I never use the term 'pro-choice' nor is an abortionist to be called a doctor never mind  being called a "health professional".

    Offline Meg

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    « Reply #9 on: July 15, 2013, 12:34:05 PM »
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  • Would you say that the majority of the Irish people are against abortion being legalized? If so, did the pro-aborts take this into consideration at all? Did Church leaders in Ireland speak out at all? I haven't been following this issue in Ireland, so I'm not familiar with the details. It's very sad, though, that the taking of innocent life in the womb is now legal. I hope that it can somehow be overturned.
    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29

    Offline John Grace

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    « Reply #10 on: July 15, 2013, 01:26:32 PM »
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  • Quote from: Meg
    Would you say that the majority of the Irish people are against abortion being legalized? If so, did the pro-aborts take this into consideration at all? Did Church leaders in Ireland speak out at all? I haven't been following this issue in Ireland, so I'm not familiar with the details. It's very sad, though, that the taking of innocent life in the womb is now legal. I hope that it can somehow be overturned.


    It's not law and today the upper house of the Irish parliament is discussing and debating the abortion bill. The upper house is the Senate, which ironically, a campaign has begun to abolish the upper house.

    It has been said that next Monday is when they will conclude their debate. If the bill is voted against, it must return to the lower house, which voted last week. If the bill is passed, the President can either sign bill into law or refer the bill to the Supreme Court. Is it constitutional? Many suggest it is not. I believe it violates the Irish constitution.

    I expect it to be challenged in the courts.


    Offline John Grace

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    « Reply #11 on: July 15, 2013, 01:28:36 PM »
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  • Some have spoken of calling for a referendum. Depending on the wording, I would see a referendum favouring the pro-abortion lobby and the danger is people would vote for abortion in cases of rape or "foetal abnormality".

    Offline John Grace

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    « Reply #12 on: July 15, 2013, 01:32:35 PM »
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    Did Church leaders in Ireland speak out at all?

    To give them credit, they did and had a letter read at every parish. Also, a prayer was circulated. The Bishops are waiting for the outcome of the debate on the bill and may mount a legal challenge.

    The Bishops in Ireland are weak. They have woken up but I don't believe, we can depend on them.

    Offline John Grace

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    « Reply #13 on: July 15, 2013, 01:35:09 PM »
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  • The Fine Gael political party itself pledged at the election in 2011 not to legislate for abortion and many of the "pro-life" politicians, voted for the bill.

    They are now using the label "pro-life" to suit themselves. "Everyone is pro-life" is becoming their new tactic.

    Offline Meg

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    « Reply #14 on: July 15, 2013, 01:38:32 PM »
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  • Quote from: John Grace
    Some have spoken of calling for a referendum. Depending on the wording, I would see a referendum favouring the pro-abortion lobby and the danger is people would vote for abortion in cases of rape or "foetal abnormality".


    Thanks for the info. Yes, I suppose that the pro-aborts will use any means possible to have abortion legalized, even if they have to start out with just the fetus having an abnormality (or rape) as justification (which is still a really bad thing to use as justification for murder). It will be a slippery slope after that, I would think, and maybe it will lead to fully legalized abortions for any reason at all.

    Please do keep us informed of what happens in the next few weeks.
    "It is licit to resist a Sovereign Pontiff who is trying to destroy the Church. I say it is licit to resist him in not following his orders and in preventing the execution of his will. It is not licit to Judge him, to punish him, or to depose him, for these are acts proper to a superior."

    ~St. Robert Bellarmine
    De Romano Pontifice, Lib.II, c.29