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Offline Matthew

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Cost to Raise 1 Child - Quarter Million Dollars
« on: August 18, 2014, 11:19:30 AM »
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  • From CNNMoney:

    New parents be warned: It could cost nearly a quarter of a million dollars to raise your child -- and that's not even including the cost of college.

    To raise a child born in 2013 to the age of 18, it will cost a middle-income couple just over $245,000, according to newly released estimates from the U.S. Department of Agriculture. That's up $4,260, or almost 2%, from the year before.
    Estimates can vary widely depending on where you live and how much you earn.
    High-income families who live in the urban Northeast, for example, are projected to spend nearly $455,000 to raise their child to the age of 18, while low-income rural families will spend much less, an estimated $145,500, according to the report.

    The figures are based on the cost of housing, food, transportation, clothing, health care, education, child care and miscellaneous expenses, like haircuts and cell phones. But the estimates don't include the cost of college -- a big-ticket expense that keeps rising.

    The good news: overall costs have grown more slowly in recent years thanks to low inflation, said economist Mark Lino, who has written the annual report for the USDA since 1987.

    But many families are still having to do more with less. The country's median income remains more than 8% below where it was before the recession, while child care and health care costs continue to grow faster than inflation.

    Related: 'The most surprising cost of raising my kid'

    Child care, in particular, is a huge burden -- often costing as much as the family home.
    In 2012, center-based care for one infant was greater than median rent payments in nearly half of the states, according to Child Care Aware of America's most recent report.

    In Seattle, Britta Gidican and her boyfriend spend $1,380 each month on daycare for their 17-month-old son, just $20 less than they spend on their mortgage each month.

    "When I was pregnant I knew daycare would be expensive," said Gidican, a public relations manager. "But I didn't expect to pay two mortgages."
    Rising transportation and food costs are also eating up a big chunk of family budgets. Gas prices have nearly doubled since 2004, according to the AAA. Meanwhile, food prices have increased more than 13% since 2008, according to the USDA, and make up the third biggest child-rearing expense in the agency's estimate.

    Kim Blackham, a mother of four and part-time marriage and family therapist, says she has seen her grocery bill climb dramatically in the past decade. Today, she and her husband spend around $1,000 each month, in part because of her son's food allergies and her efforts to cook healthier meals for her family.

    "I used to coupon shop, but the problem with coupons is that they are all for processed items," she said. "You seldom see a coupon for fresh fruit or meat."

    For families trying to get by, here are some ways to ease the sting:
    Use your community: From fancy strollers to bike seats, Boulder, Colo. mother-of-two Kate Lacroix said she has found a large community of people willing to share their hand-me-downs.

    "There is a real economy of scale when you use the village," she said.
    Try looking on local parenting blogs or websites to find everything from free baby clothes to a family looking to share a nanny.
    Calculator: Cost of living: How far will my salary go?
    Take advantage of tax credits: Many employers offer tax-advantaged accounts that let parents pay for health and child care expenses with before-tax dollars.
    Taking advantage of these accounts, and other child-related tax credits, can help you save thousands of dollars come tax time, said Bob Gavlak, a wealth advisor with Strategic Wealth Partners in Independence, Ohio.
    Plan (and save) ahead: When possible, expectant parents should prepare for the added costs ahead of time, said Matt Becker, a financial planner who specializes in working with new parents.
    First, estimate your child-related expenses and then try to save that amount each month. By the time your child is born, you'll be used to living without that money and also have a sizable savings built up.
    "Having a baby is a huge life change. You are going to have unexpected things come up," said Becker, founder of planning firm Mom and Dad Money. "Having that extra savings can help a lot."
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    Offline Matthew

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    Cost to Raise 1 Child - Quarter Million Dollars
    « Reply #1 on: August 18, 2014, 11:31:09 AM »
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  • You can see that economics have played a huge part in the recent move to 1- and 2-child families.

    So we shouldn't totally ignore articles like this. We need to have an answer to each of these points.

    Obviously the modern world's "culture" or "system" isn't working, because it doesn't result in enough children to propagate itself.

    And the Trad Catholic system works, because everything hangs together.

    Child care? Easy -- the wife stays home. Having to invite 30 classmates to each birthday party? (this was mentioned in another article on CNNMoney today) Not a problem when you're homeschooled. Haircuts? A scissors is pretty cheap. Cell phones? Do without. High cost of treating Autism and food allergies? Don't vaccinate your kids.

    On that last point -- TWO articles in the same day cited high food costs for serious food allergies.

    Ladies and gentlemen, today's level of widespread/serious food allergies were unheard of IN MY LIFETIME and I'm not that old. Something is different now. Maybe the 36 vaccinations kids receive before age 2 might have something to do with it? Seriously, have you looked at how the number of recommended vaccinations has gone up for a child born in 2014 vs. a child born in 1974?

    And now we have widespread autism and an epidemic of food allergies. My kids' own cousin is one of these -- she can't eat a drop of cheese without vomiting/diarrhea for hours. And she's been vaccinated. I have 5 children and they're all fine. Maybe because they weren't vaccinated?
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    Offline Matthew

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    Cost to Raise 1 Child - Quarter Million Dollars
    « Reply #2 on: August 18, 2014, 11:39:33 AM »
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  • This is what I mean:

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    Offline Matthew

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    Cost to Raise 1 Child - Quarter Million Dollars
    « Reply #3 on: August 18, 2014, 11:43:01 AM »
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  • Again, I don't remember any of my classmates having food allergies.

    One time we all got donuts, another time a classmate from India had her mom come in and make these delicious thin pancakes rolled up with sugar.
    Another time we all brought sack lunches and traded them around in an "auction".

    I remember a high participation rate in these activities -- close to 100%.

    Today, you'd have 1/3 of the kids sitting out because they're dairy or gluten intolerant.
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    Offline Matthew

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    Cost to Raise 1 Child - Quarter Million Dollars
    « Reply #4 on: August 18, 2014, 12:18:17 PM »
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  • What's wrong with a culture when having kids is too expensive?

    The culture is doomed. Having kids is natural and has been part of life since the very beginning. If you can't pass on your culture and values, your value system obviously doesn't work! Having kids=survival for a culture. Cultures each do things differently, but some things are universal: if they don't have more than 2.1 children per couple, they die out. That is science.
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    Offline stbrighidswell

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    Cost to Raise 1 Child - Quarter Million Dollars
    « Reply #5 on: August 18, 2014, 01:13:42 PM »
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  • It is a myth that kids are too expensive to have.  It depends on what the parents want for their kids and what they are willing to spend to get it.

    Ambitious driven parents will go to a lot of expense , they will spend a lot of money on extra curricular activities and all that entails....travel costs, club fees, uniforms or gear, competition fees, camps and so on.  Then the kids have to have the best brands for clothes and gear to compete with other kids at these clubs.  
    Then there is ipad, ipod, tablets , mobiles or cell phones plus the cost of running these ...why because everyone else has them.

    They buy a house in the nice neighbourhoods with the nice schools to give the kids a lift onto the ladder so that leads to a higher mortgage and mom has to work to help pay the bills.  Then you cannot drive a crappy car when you live here and you will need two.  Then because both parents are working , mom has to buy the processed quick cooked food as she is frazzled with running from school to music or dance.

    So in my house, kids are allowed a max of two extra curricular activities and they must be local.  Unless they show a good ability at whatever , there are no competitions to attend.  Food is cooked from scratch as I have time and it is so much less expensive. I am not in the least embarrassed to take hand me downs from friends as far as clothes are concerned.  I buy a Christmas outfit for each and maybe one or two outfits for summer and winter. That's it, no expensive brands.  We never built a huge house so mortgage is reasonable and my crappy car looks alright parked outside.  I live in a rural area and most of my neighbours are normal like myself and have no need to keep up with the jones. We camp for holidays in a battered old campervan and we love it.

    That myth is put out to scare people into not having children.  Its not that they are expensive its the pressure parents put themselves under to get little johnny or mary as doctors and lawyers.

    Offline JohnAnthonyMarie

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    Cost to Raise 1 Child - Quarter Million Dollars
    « Reply #6 on: August 18, 2014, 02:07:22 PM »
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  • Check my math; So according to the article, that is about $37.30 per day.  That seems a bit high by my experience.  As I have ten children, that would equate to $373 per day, or about $11,190 per month;  The state calculates about half that amount for child support.
    Omnes pro Christo

    Offline Ambrose

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    Cost to Raise 1 Child - Quarter Million Dollars
    « Reply #7 on: August 18, 2014, 03:30:18 PM »
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  • I think the high costs are mostly connected to the very high cost of government education and college.  Once that factor is removed, the costs go down dramatically.  

    If children are home-educated they also do not need to wear the latest expensive clothes and shoes to keep up with their peers.  
    The Council of Trent, The Catechism of the Council of Trent, Papal Teaching, The Teaching of the Holy Office, The Teaching of the Church Fathers, The Code of Canon Law, Countless approved catechisms, The Doctors of the Church, The teaching of the Dogmatic


    Offline Ursus

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    Cost to Raise 1 Child - Quarter Million Dollars
    « Reply #8 on: August 19, 2014, 12:59:39 AM »
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  • I saw this news today, it's being pushed across media. Another, you're not responsible if you don't plan sort of message to it. Being a practicing Catholic, I could sense the "plan" agenda message it's trying to convey.

    There's supposedly a shock value to the $250k headline number. If you amortize that amount over 18 years its really not that much at all, even less as others mentioned.

    So I guess all young, educated adults should, stop, plan, put off, etc. having children because they cost too much. You got student loans, rent, and car payments! Who could afford anything else? Of course poor uneducated, non religious, no family structure people will have kids to flood society.

    What crossed my mind was the cost of getting old. NEVER MENTIONED with reason on the media because you can't offend the Baby Boomers. The false dream sold to everyone is save, invest and when you're 60 you're set for a vacation. Few have done that successfully.

     The young are expected to pick up the tab for expensive medicine to increase lifespan.

    Assisted living, visiting nurses, nursing homes cost BIG money (that's without dire medicial problems), $100-200k per year.

    Now other poor societies survive by keeping filial piety, but Americans threw that away. People are a burden. You need money.

    Offline ggreg

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    Cost to Raise 1 Child - Quarter Million Dollars
    « Reply #9 on: August 19, 2014, 02:16:47 AM »
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  • My kids are the best dressed at the local athletics club.  They have exotic branded clothes monogrammed with their own initials.  Other kids from posh private schools ask them where they got the exotic gear because it is clearly customised to them.

    Their Dad gets it from eBay (xs and xxs adult sizes) then makes adjustments with a sewing machine.  Then irons on custom hand cut stencils using heat transfer t-shirt vinyl.  Finished result is slick.  Much nicer than anything you can buy in the sports shop.

    You can buy second hand clothes (some idiot has bought on a whim and hardly worn) for a song.

    The only thing they have new are socks.

    The smarter you are the cheaper life gets.

    Offline Marlelar

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    Cost to Raise 1 Child - Quarter Million Dollars
    « Reply #10 on: August 19, 2014, 01:12:10 PM »
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  • The fundamental mindset of looking at children as "costs" is the problem.  Children are an asset!

    What a difference having mom at home would make.  She wouldn't need to spend as much on clothing, shoes, transportation and would be able to cook from scratch which would lessen the grocery bill.  Homeschool the kids which saves on child care, clothes, food, transportation, and the kids won't be getting sick so often so healthcare goes down too!  Mom cuts the hair (I did) and since the kids are home they don't need a cell phone.

    Mom at home = problem solved.

    Marsha


    Offline Capt McQuigg

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    Cost to Raise 1 Child - Quarter Million Dollars
    « Reply #11 on: August 20, 2014, 12:30:23 AM »
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  • What would we really expect to hear from the world regarding children?

    Of course they view children as a cost to be avoided.

    Our Lord said we are to be pulled out of the world so if we keep hoping the world will someday see things our way then we suffer from a spiritual illness.  

    Also, I must add, Ggreg really gave us a lot of good advice in his post.  You can really buy quality material and high end clothes for 10% of the original cost or even less on ebay.  I know this to be true because I have done it myself.  

    Offline ggreg

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    Cost to Raise 1 Child - Quarter Million Dollars
    « Reply #12 on: August 20, 2014, 12:45:03 AM »
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  • As for haircuts.  In our house of 8 people, (seven have hair).  Every few months a mobile hair dresser women comes by and cuts all the hair which has been washed the night before, for around $35 or $5 per head.  Takes her about 80 mins conveyor belt style.

    My hair was last cut with scissors in 1994.  Since then it has been dormant waiting for the new springtime to kick in.

    Offline Cantarella

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    « Reply #13 on: August 20, 2014, 12:48:28 AM »
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  • Quote from: Marlelar
    The fundamental mindset of looking at children as "costs" is the problem.  Children are an asset!

    What a difference having mom at home would make.  She wouldn't need to spend as much on clothing, shoes, transportation and would be able to cook from scratch which would lessen the grocery bill.  Homeschool the kids which saves on child care, clothes, food, transportation, and the kids won't be getting sick so often so healthcare goes down too!  Mom cuts the hair (I did) and since the kids are home they don't need a cell phone.

    Mom at home = problem solved.

    Marsha


    Agreed. Mothers should stay home with their children unless there is an emergency. This is not only to save money but most especially because that is the God-given role of women that become mothers; and therefore, an obligation towards Our Lord, who entrusts the precious children to these women. This Divine order of things a true woman would never resent but actually be blessed and thankful for.

    The majority of problems in society today are due to mothers working outside the home, leaving the children unattended or/and raised by strangers, and thus producing the breakdown of the home, the family, and the world. This is a real assault to the most worthy vocation of the mother. A working mother is a real disgrace since it is an impossibility for a woman to truly be the heart of the home if she is absent.

    In these latest generations brought up by the feminists (most of them as single working mothers), we see all around us the evident social and moral decadence and collective spiritual sickness that the phenomenon of the working mother has irreparably caused.  
    If anyone says that true and natural water is not necessary for baptism and thus twists into some metaphor the words of our Lord Jesus Christ" Unless a man be born again of water and the Holy Spirit" (Jn 3:5) let him be anathema.

    Offline ggreg

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    « Reply #14 on: August 20, 2014, 01:05:24 AM »
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  • Quote from: Capt McQuigg
    What would we really expect to hear from the world regarding children?

    Of course they view children as a cost to be avoided.

    Our Lord said we are to be pulled out of the world so if we keep hoping the world will someday see things our way then we suffer from a spiritual illness.  

    Also, I must add, Ggreg really gave us a lot of good advice in his post.  You can really buy quality material and high end clothes for 10% of the original cost or even less on ebay.  I know this to be true because I have done it myself.  


    One should bear in mind that there are a lot of materialistic idiots out there. People who spend 600 dollars on a shower bar or 400 dollars on a leather pooffe only to find it doesn't match their decor.  Poorer people then spend 100 dollars on a new Chinese made shower that will stop working properly after 2 years of family use or buy cheap furniture on the never-never because they can only "afford" a payment of 50 dollars per month.

    If you use ebay intelligently and are patient and ready to buy things you NEED as they become available you can find bargains in just about every aspect of life.  Last week I replaced a shower bar that came with the house but had developed a back-flow leak, with a super expensive German made one sold by a woman who was redecorating her Glasgow apartment.  It cost 30 pounds or 6 percent of the RRP.

    When you have a large family the most sensible thing to do is by very high quality second hand.  Don't spend 2000 dollars on a new sofa suite but spend 1500 dollars on a 7000 dollar full aniline leather or hide suite that you can wipe baby puke off repeatedly for the next 20 years.  Because there is going to be a lot of baby puke.

    Size 4 and Size 6 (US), 6/8 UK clothes are bought by slim women with great figures.  Those people see their figure as an asset so they don't look for second hand clothes on ebay.  Supply outstrips demand, thus low prices.  If you cut the arms off and rehem them, pretty easy with a sewing machine, they fit 7-12 year olds really well.