Author Topic: What BODers do NOT Believe  (Read 1979 times)

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Offline DZ PLEASE

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Re: What BODers do NOT Believe
« Reply #15 on: August 11, 2017, 11:56:51 AM »
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  • LoT, if you fancy yourself a teacher then I, the uninstructed, must tell you that you are wrong.  You are not easily understood.  You post endless quotes and do not plug them into any context.  You do not explain anything in plain english.  You don't weave your quotes into any sort of whole cloth of understanding.

    I think, rather, that you post these quotes to try desperately to convince yourself that you are right and that Pax Vobis, for instance, cannnot possibly be so.

    But I don't want to malign you.  I do think, though, that you should avoid trying to instruct the ignorant until you yourself are clear about what you believe, why, and can present it properly.
    Now THIS was clear, very measured, very even…

    … and out of all the much more viable targets THIS got a downvote, speaking of "confusing".

    (@@)
    "Lord, have mercy".

    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Re: What BODers do NOT Believe
    « Reply #16 on: August 11, 2017, 11:59:39 AM »
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  • <<Why would a teaching care if the uninstructed tells him he is wrong apart from being concerned for the uninstructed?  Mary sat at the feet of the Master.  You would stand up and tell him He was wrong.>>

    You misunderstand.  I said you are wrong about being a teacher.  I did not say your "teaching" is wrong.

    But since you equate yourself with Our Lord, I can tell you that yours is not the voice of Truth.
    I make it very clear I am not a teacher.  That is why I rely an authoritative sources that the Feeneyites despise.  After reading your first response I realize you were not being malicious.  Are you one of the charitable feeneyites?  I'm sorry for my sarcastic response.
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church


    Offline JPaul

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    Re: What BODers do NOT Believe
    « Reply #17 on: August 11, 2017, 03:26:20 PM »
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  • The letter from the Holy Office in 1949 to the Archbishop of Boston (here) clearly states,


    The circumstances surrounding the excommunication were printed in an article in "The Catholic Advance" on February 27, 1953, which can be seen here. Pope Pius XII made three separate requests for Father Feeney to come to Rome. Clearly this meeting was to be about Father Feeney's denial of a Catholic doctrine, but when he did not show for the hearing, this was the final straw.
    The "letter" so called was a political favor called for by Cushing because Feeney and others were exposing the heretical activities and teaching at Boston College and because Father Feeney was making converts at Harvard that were controversial.
    Although the "straw that broke the camel's back" his public preaching against the Jews who Cushing went to great lengths to please and cater to.
    He was embarrassed by these events and put the call in to his friends in Rome to have Father Feeney censured. He had influence among the Modernists and it was done.

    Offline Stubborn

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    Re: What BODers do NOT Believe
    « Reply #18 on: August 11, 2017, 03:51:09 PM »
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  • All your double negatives make you post more confusing that it normally is.
    As regards the negative tenor of the dogma EENS....

    "The negative tenor of these definitions is to warn that any word, or artifice, or attenuation, which relieves every individual of the human race from the obligation of joining the Roman Catholic Church is condemned as contrary to divine prescription." - Fr. Wathen from Who Shall Ascend?
    The Highest Principle in the Church: "We are first of all under obedience to God, and only then under obedience to man." - Fr. Hesse

    Offline Motorede

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    Re: What BODers do NOT Believe
    « Reply #19 on: August 11, 2017, 05:56:11 PM »
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  • No he was not. Get you facts straight or develop enough good will to be honest.
    J.Paul: It is impossible for LoT to be honest when it comes to Father Leonard Feeney; he has a blind hatred for this priest and cannot even bring himself to judge that that this priest might have been in good faith when he opined about BOD. 


    Offline Motorede

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    Re: What BODers do NOT Believe
    « Reply #20 on: August 11, 2017, 06:35:34 PM »
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  • J.Paul: It is impossible for LoT to be honest when it comes to Father Leonard Feeney; he has a blind hatred for this priest and cannot even bring himself to judge that that this priest might have been in good faith when he opined about BOD.
    It is LoT's "Cartago delenda est"; "destroy the memory of this priest", discredit him in every way and let no one have any happy memories of him at all. What a way to make a living, LoT. 

    Offline Merry

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    Re: What BODers do NOT Believe
    « Reply #21 on: August 12, 2017, 03:18:51 PM »
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  • LoT ... the Monsignor ... 
    If any one saith that true and natural water is not of necessity for baptism, and on that account wrests to some sort of metaphor those words of Our Lord Jesus Christ, "Unless a man be born again of water and the Holy Ghost...,"  Let Him Be Anathama.  -COUNCIL OF TRENT Sess VII Canon II “On Baptism"

    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Re: What BODers do NOT Believe
    « Reply #22 on: August 14, 2017, 09:08:49 AM »
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  • Correct me if I wrong, and I'm sure I'm not, but you believe that Suprema Haec Sacra is an infallible act of the Magisterium(it's not).

    In Suprema Haec it says: "Therefore, no one will be saved who, knowing the Church to have been divinely established by Christ, nevertheless refuses to submit to the Church or withholds obedience from the Roman Pontiff, the Vicar of Christ on earth."

    This implies the definition of "outside" in the Dogma EENS as only those who know Christ established the Church and reject it. This is leaps and bounds more liberal than, as you put it, ALL. In fact, who would this really exclude anyway? Who truly knows that Christ established a Church that you must submit to in order to be saved and then decides to say "nah, I'm good". People who believe in their heart but do not outwardly show it, maybe could be included? The only others I can think of are former Catholics. Even most of them wouldn't count because they probably no longer believe the Church was established by Christ, therefore able to be saved by this false interpretation.

    Your claim that BODers believe EENS applies to "all" outside the Church is plainly untrue if you are including yourself in that group.
    I do not believe it is infallible, it is authoritative which means it is safe.  It also contains infallible teachings.  The good Catholic, including theologians give their ascent to it.  Are you aware of an authoritative document with the approval of a valid pope that contained heresy?
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church


    Offline JPaul

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    Re: What BODers do NOT Believe
    « Reply #23 on: August 14, 2017, 09:42:07 AM »
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  • I do not believe it is infallible, it is authoritative which means it is safe.  It also contains infallible teachings.  The good Catholic, including theologians give their ascent to it.  Are you aware of an authoritative document with the approval of a valid pope that contained heresy?
    According to you, It contains the kernel ideas of Vatican II, it therefore cannot be safe. Many theologians have given their ascent to Vatican II, so why do you persist in being a sedevacantist?

    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Re: What BODers do NOT Believe
    « Reply #24 on: August 14, 2017, 09:44:40 AM »
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  • It’s the height of irony that Feeneyites have no trust at all in the very Church outside of which they insist there is no salvation! Listening to them, you’d think there is no salvation INSIDE the Church!
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church

    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Re: What BODers do NOT Believe
    « Reply #25 on: August 14, 2017, 09:45:06 AM »
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  • According to you, It contains the kernel ideas of Vatican II, it therefore cannot be safe. Many theologians have given their ascent to Vatican II, so why do you persist in being a sedevacantist?
    "according to me" what?
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church


    Offline DZ PLEASE

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    Re: What BODers do NOT Believe
    « Reply #26 on: August 14, 2017, 10:37:31 AM »
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  • It’s the height of irony that Feeneyites have no trust at all in the very Church outside of which they insist there is no salvation! Listening to them, you’d think there is no salvation INSIDE the Church!
    "… every idle word…"
    You'll put you soul out with that thing.
    "Lord, have mercy".

    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Re: What BODers do NOT Believe
    « Reply #27 on: August 14, 2017, 11:08:05 AM »
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  • I think Feneyites ultimately have no Faith at all, many of them. They just adhere to a bunch of propositions behind which there is no reality. It’s just words and they adhere to the words.
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church

    Offline DZ PLEASE

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    Re: What BODers do NOT Believe
    « Reply #28 on: August 14, 2017, 11:25:47 AM »
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  • I think Feneyites ultimately have no Faith at all, many of them. They just adhere to a bunch of propositions behind which there is no reality. It’s just words and they adhere to the words.
    "… it's just words…"

    And there it is, from the maestro squared away, c/p the library of congress = "AHA! AH WEEN!" lover of tripe himself.


    *golfclap
    "Lord, have mercy".

    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Re: What BODers do NOT Believe
    « Reply #29 on: August 14, 2017, 11:37:33 AM »
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  • "… it's just words…"

    And there it is, from the maestro squared away, c/p the library of congress = "AHA! AH WEEN!" lover of tripe himself.


    *golfclap
    They adhere to words which they do not understand or take in context within the whole of Catholic teaching.  Feeneyites are to Catholic Dogma what Protestants are to the Bible.
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church


     

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