Author Topic: We Believe What the Church Teaches No Matter What it Is (Read 16779 times)

Lover of Truth · « **Reply #20 on:** September 15, 2009, 10:24:24 AM »

I'm not sure if Catholic Martyr has admitted that Father Feeney properly interpreted the Council of Trent as teaching that the mere desire for baptism can justify a man and therefore had to invent his teaching that a man who dies justified is not necessarily saved, definitely not saved if he was baptized by water. Can you respond again here?

Jehanne · « **Reply #21 on:** September 15, 2009, 10:36:28 AM »

Quote from: Raoul76

In the first of your examples, Adesto, the Church would say that the child goes to limbo and has a natural happiness, but cannot go to heaven. With no act of the will towards the Catholic Church on the part of the embryo or its mother, who didn't know it existed, how could it possibly be saved?

In the second, it is possible that the desire of the MOTHER to have the baby baptized will suffice. I'm sure that in the last moments of her life that is exactly what she would have been thinking about. St. Augustine talks about this, but I'll have to do a search to find the exact passage.

The Council of Constance would seem to teach that all infants who die without baptism will not go to Heaven:

Condemned Proposition: 6. Those who claim that the children of the faithful dying without sacramental baptism will not be saved, are stupid and presumptuous in saying this.

http://www.papalencyclicals.net/Councils/ecuм16.htm

CM · « **Reply #22 on:** September 15, 2009, 10:37:09 AM »

Quote from: Lover of Truth

I'm not sure if Catholic Martyr has admitted that Father Feeney properly interpreted the Council of Trent as teaching that the mere desire for baptism can justify a man and therefore had to invent his teaching that a man who dies justified is not necessarily saved, definitely not saved if he was baptized by water. Can you respond again here?

I'm not all too surprised that you post all this text, only to ignore the responses. I answered that question on the previous page of this thread.

Quote from: I

Feeney was wrong. Trent teaches that a person cannot be justified without the laver of regeneration. Trent teaches that a person cannot be justified without the desire for the laver of regeneration.

Either one missing, no justification. No justification, no heaven. No heaven=hellfire.

CM · « **Reply #23 on:** September 15, 2009, 10:38:39 AM »

Quote from: Jehanne

The Council of Constance would seem to teach that all infants who die without baptism will not go to Heaven.

Very good.

Belloc · « **Reply #24 on:** September 15, 2009, 10:41:44 AM »

Quote from: C.M.M.M

CM is unfortunately the only person who ever fully understood dogmas 'as they were once declared'

We are all very blessed that he was given this insight, which is in contradiction to the constant tradition of the church, to show us how we are truly to understand what the church has taught.

He is a Pope unto himself.....everyone else is:
-decieved
-heretic
-AMericanist
-going to Hell
-all sin is sin, none more or less.