Quote from: bowler

Catholic Apologetics, by Fr. John Laux 1928. (pp. 125-6 TAN). [/u]

 3. But are not all non-Catholics and non-Christians condemned to Hell by this doctrine [outside the Church there is no salvation]?

 The Catholic dogma, "Outside the Church there is no salvation," must be rightly understood. It must not be regarded as an isolated doctrine, but as part of the whole system of Catholic doctrine; and it must be put in its proper place in this system.

 a) It was not originally directed against non-Catholics as individuals, but against heretical sects in so far as they are sects. Its purpose is to safeguard the truth that there is only one Body of Christ and therefore only one Church which possesses and communicates the fullness of the blessings brought to men by Christ. No church set up by men against the original Church of Christ can be a means of salvation. In so far as these churches are non-Catholic and anti-Catholic, they cannot give a supernatural life. None of them can be called a mater ecclesia, a "Mother" Church that gives life to her children and nourishes them.

 b) But the non-Catholic churches are not purely un-Catholic and anti-Catholic. When they separated from the Church of Christ, they took with them and kept a considerable portion of the Catholic treasure of faith and some means of grace, above all the Sacrament of Baptism. The Church has always upheld the validity of Baptism administered by heretics in the name of the Blessed Trinity. She also admits the validity of Holy Orders in the Schismatic churches of the East and in the Jansenist and Old Catholic churches of Europe. In these churches the true Body and true Blood of Christ is received, not because they are the true Church of Christ, but because in spite of their heresy and schism, they have kept a part of the primitive Catholic inheritance. It is the Catholic element in these churches that enables them to be a means of grace and salvation.

 c) When the Jansenists of the 17th century maintained that the Sacraments administered outside the Church were only objectively valid, but not subjectively effective; in other words, that "No grace was given outside the Church," their teaching was condemned by Pope Clement XI.

 Since the Sacraments administered outside the Church do confer grace, there is no reason why there should not be found outside the Church, for example in the Eastern churches, men and women of marked piety and even holiness of life.

 d) According to Catholic teaching the grace of Christ works not only in those who profess the Christian Religion, but also in non-Christians, in Pagans, Jews and Mohammedians. Every Catholic Catechism speaks of the Baptism of Desire as a substitute for Sacramental Baptism. Baptism of Desire is an act of perfect contrition combined with an ardent wish, either explicit or implicit, to receive Baptism and to become a member of the true Church. A person who does not know the necessity of Baptism, but wishes to do all that is required for salvation, is said to have an implicit desire of Baptism. "Every one that loveth is born of God" (1 John 4:7).

 Since Christ appeared on earth and founded His Kingdom, there is no longer any purely natural morality. "Wherever conscience is aroused, wherever man raises his eyes to God and proclaims his readiness to do the Divine Will, the grace of Christ is at work and puts the germ of supernatural life into the soul."

 e) Thus we see that God does not refuse grace to anyone in good faith, to anyone who is outside the Church through invincible ignorance; but it is essential that he must be in good faith. Whoever, without his fault, is not a Catholic, but sincerely seeks the truth and keeps the commandments to the best of his knowledge, does not indeed belong to the visible body of the Church, but in spirit, as it were, belongs to the soul of the Church, and therefore can be saved. He is not saved without the Church of Christ and against her, but through her. "For the grace of Christ never operates in an isolated manner in this or that person. It always works in and through the unity of His Body." There is no invisible Church beside the visible one; there is only one true Church of Christ in which both what is visible and what is invisible are organically united.

This right here could have been used to compose the docuмents of Vatican II.

Again, if I believed this nonsense, I would have to accept Vatican II.

Oh, wait, since this was 1928, it must be believed and accepted, whereas because Vatican II was in 1962 and done by that mean, mean, not nice Paul VI, it must be rejected as heretical.

I invite the BoDers to either

1) reject and repudiate these statements by Fr. John Laux.

OR

2) accept the teachings of Vatican II.

Fr. Laux's writings = Lumen Gentium.  There are no ifs, ands or buts about it.

I am still waiting for an honest BoDers (a term that's becoming an oxymoron) to repudiate the teaching of Fr. Laux.

Quote from: Ladislaus

Quote from: bowler

Catholic Apologetics, by Fr. John Laux 1928. (pp. 125-6 TAN). [/u]

 3. But are not all non-Catholics and non-Christians condemned to Hell by this doctrine [outside the Church there is no salvation]?

 The Catholic dogma, "Outside the Church there is no salvation," must be rightly understood. It must not be regarded as an isolated doctrine, but as part of the whole system of Catholic doctrine; and it must be put in its proper place in this system.

 a) It was not originally directed against non-Catholics as individuals, but against heretical sects in so far as they are sects. Its purpose is to safeguard the truth that there is only one Body of Christ and therefore only one Church which possesses and communicates the fullness of the blessings brought to men by Christ. No church set up by men against the original Church of Christ can be a means of salvation. In so far as these churches are non-Catholic and anti-Catholic, they cannot give a supernatural life. None of them can be called a mater ecclesia, a "Mother" Church that gives life to her children and nourishes them.

 b) But the non-Catholic churches are not purely un-Catholic and anti-Catholic. When they separated from the Church of Christ, they took with them and kept a considerable portion of the Catholic treasure of faith and some means of grace, above all the Sacrament of Baptism. The Church has always upheld the validity of Baptism administered by heretics in the name of the Blessed Trinity. She also admits the validity of Holy Orders in the Schismatic churches of the East and in the Jansenist and Old Catholic churches of Europe. In these churches the true Body and true Blood of Christ is received, not because they are the true Church of Christ, but because in spite of their heresy and schism, they have kept a part of the primitive Catholic inheritance. It is the Catholic element in these churches that enables them to be a means of grace and salvation.

 c) When the Jansenists of the 17th century maintained that the Sacraments administered outside the Church were only objectively valid, but not subjectively effective; in other words, that "No grace was given outside the Church," their teaching was condemned by Pope Clement XI.

 Since the Sacraments administered outside the Church do confer grace, there is no reason why there should not be found outside the Church, for example in the Eastern churches, men and women of marked piety and even holiness of life.

 d) According to Catholic teaching the grace of Christ works not only in those who profess the Christian Religion, but also in non-Christians, in Pagans, Jews and Mohammedans. Every Catholic Catechism speaks of the Baptism of Desire as a substitute for Sacramental Baptism. Baptism of Desire is an act of perfect contrition combined with an ardent wish, either explicit or implicit, to receive Baptism and to become a member of the true Church. A person who does not know the necessity of Baptism, but wishes to do all that is required for salvation, is said to have an implicit desire of Baptism. "Every one that loveth is born of God" (1 John 4:7).

 Since Christ appeared on earth and founded His Kingdom, there is no longer any purely natural morality. "Wherever conscience is aroused, wherever man raises his eyes to God and proclaims his readiness to do the Divine Will, the grace of Christ is at work and puts the germ of supernatural life into the soul."

 e) Thus we see that God does not refuse grace to anyone in good faith, to anyone who is outside the Church through invincible ignorance; but it is essential that he must be in good faith. Whoever, without his fault, is not a Catholic, but sincerely seeks the truth and keeps the commandments to the best of his knowledge, does not indeed belong to the visible body of the Church, but in spirit, as it were, belongs to the soul of the Church, and therefore can be saved. He is not saved without the Church of Christ and against her, but through her. "For the grace of Christ never operates in an isolated manner in this or that person. It always works in and through the unity of His Body." There is no invisible Church beside the visible one; there is only one true Church of Christ in which both what is visible and what is invisible are organically united.

This right here could have been used to compose the docuмents of Vatican II.

Again, if I believed this nonsense, I would have to accept Vatican II.

Oh, wait, since this was 1928, it must be believed and accepted, whereas because Vatican II was in 1962 and done by that mean, mean, not nice Paul VI, it must be rejected as heretical.

Quote from: Ladislaus

I invite the BoDers to either

1) reject and repudiate these statements by Fr. John Laux.

OR

2) accept the teachings of Vatican II.

Did anybody take you up on this invitation?

Fr. Laux's writings = Lumen Gentium.  There are no ifs, ands or buts about it.

I am still waiting for an honest BoDers (a term that's becoming an oxymoron) to repudiate the teaching of Fr. Laux.

Quote from: Ladislaus

You see, the BoDers will never be honest enough to repudiate Father Laux.  Why?  Because then they would have to admit that the pre-Vatican II theologians who taught BoD were contaminated with error and would also have to admit the continuity between BoD and Vatican II.

Elementary  :detective: