Author Topic: The Root of Lover of Truth's Illness  (Read 3100 times)

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Offline Lover of Truth

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Re: The Root of Lover of Truth's Illness
« Reply #45 on: September 18, 2017, 08:45:29 AM »
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  • The teaching on "Soul of the Church" is a heresy.

    The definition of "Soul of the Church" in the "New Catholic Dictionary" (1929) provides an explanation for the origins of this term:

    Soul of the Church: "From the 16th century, the Catholic theologians expressed more definitely the theological doctrine of the distinction between the Soul and Body of the Church. . . This distinction. . . is formally expressed by Bellarmine in his study on the members of the Church. According to him, men belong to the Body of the Church by virtue of external profession of the faith, and participation in the sacraments; and to the Soul of the Church through the internal gifts of the Holy Ghost, faith, hope, and charity. He draws three general conclusions relative to the members of the Church. There are those: (a) Who belong always to both the Body and Soul of the Church; (b) Who belong to the Soul without belonging to the Body; (c) Who belong to the Body but not to the Soul. This teaching has generally been followed by Catholic theologians."


    In our list of quotes above, we present a quote from St. Robert Bellarmine on the Soul of the Church. As we all know, St. Bellarmine was later beatified, canonized, and given Doctor of the Church honors by Pope Pius XI (processes which never would have occurred had his teaching on the subject been considered heresy). The same teaching on "Soul of the Church" was also taught by St. Pope Pius X, Baltimore Catechism, Canon Law, Catholic Encyclopedia, A Catholic Dictionary, and the Holy Office in 1949 (see above for quotes on each).

    So to say the teaching on "Soul of the Church" is a heresy, we would also logically have to declare as heretical St. Robert Bellarmine for teaching it, Pope Leo XIII for approving of it in the Baltimore Catechism, St. Pope Pius X for including it in his catechism, Pope Pius XII for approving the letter from the Holy Office in 1949, and to condemn the other Catholic references mentioned as well. Yet there has not been a single condemnation of any of these sources. And let's not forget, there has been over 25 popes since St. Robert Bellarmine was alive, all of which could have condemned him if he had taught heresy, but they did not.
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church

    Offline JPaul

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    Re: The Root of Lover of Truth's Illness
    « Reply #46 on: September 18, 2017, 09:32:31 AM »
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  • Logic continues to elude your heresy-riddled mind.  As I mentioned, the only affirmation that Pius XII approved this comes from none other than Cushing.  It's circular evidence.  We know this letter is authentic because it says it is.
    And because the questionable Bishop who requested its creation verifies it


    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Re: The Root of Lover of Truth's Illness
    « Reply #47 on: September 18, 2017, 01:05:02 PM »
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  •  Baptism of desire was condemned by the Church.

    Incorrect. If we look back through the history of the General Councils where heresies were condemned, we can clearly see that with each condemnation, the Church has always been very specific in naming the heresy, explaining what it was about, and at the same time condemning those who taught the heresy. For example:

    Council of Nicaea in 325 AD: "First of all the affair of the impiety and lawlessness of Arius and his followers was discussed in the presence of the most pious emperor Constantine. It was unanimously agreed that anathemas should be pronounced against his impious opinion and his blasphemous terms and expressions which he has blasphemously applied to the Son of God"

    Council of Ephesus 431 AD: "The holy synod said: As, in addition to all else, the excellent Nestorius has declined to obey our summons and has not received the holy and God-fearing bishops we sent to him, we have of necessity started upon an investigation of his impieties. We have found him out thinking and speaking in an impious fashion, from his letters, from his writings that have been read out, and from the things that he has recently said in this metropolis which have been witnessed to by others; and as a result we have been compelled of necessity both by the canons and by the letter of our most holy father and fellow servant Celestine, bishop of the church of the Romans, to issue this sad condemnation against him..."

    Council of Constantinople III in 680 AD: "To make an end of the Monothelite controversy, Emperor Constantine IV asked Pope Donus in 678 to send twelve bishops and four western Greek monastic superiors to represent the pope at an assembly of eastern and western theologians. Pope Agatho, who meanwhile had succeeded Donus, ordered consultation in the west on this important matter. Around Easter 680 a synod in Rome of 125 Italian bishops, with Pope Agatho presiding, assessed the replies of the regional synods of the west and composed a profession of faith in which Monothelitism was condemned."

    Similar references can be found in the other General Councils where heresies were condemned, such that there was no confusion as to what was being condemned, and who was involved in spreading the erroneous teachings. Yet on our webpage above, we provide quotes teaching baptism of desire and/or blood from St. Pope Siricius, Pope Innocent II, Pope Innocent III, Pope Pius IX, St. Pope Pius X, Pope Pius XII, St. Cyprian, Tertullian, St. Hippolytus, John Chrystostome, St. Basil, Eusebius of Caesarea, St. Victor of Braga, St. Genesius of Arles, Rufinus, St. Gregory Nazianzen, St. Ambrose, St. Cyril of Jerusalem, St. Augustine, St. Prosper, St. Fulgentius, St. John of Damascus, St. Bede, St. Bonaventure, St. Bernard of Clairvaux, St. Thomas Aquinas, St. Catherine of Sienna, St. Robert Bellarmine, and St. Alphonsus Liguori. Nowhere in any General Councils or other documents throughout the history of the Church do we see a single condemnation of any of these Popes, Church Fathers, Doctors of the Church, and Saints, nor do we see a condemnation of baptism of desire or blood. If there were a condemnation, it would be very specific, naming "baptism of desire" and/or "baptism of blood", and naming at least some of those who taught it. There are no such condemnations that exist 
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church

    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Re: The Root of Lover of Truth's Illness
    « Reply #48 on: September 19, 2017, 08:53:09 AM »
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  •  St. Hippolytus of Rome (3rd century)Canons of Hypolytus, Can. XIX: Concerning Catechumens: "Catechumens, who by the unbelievers are arrested and killed by martyrdom, before they received baptism, are to be buried with the other martyrs, for they are baptized in their own blood." 
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church

    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: The Root of Lover of Truth's Illness
    « Reply #49 on: September 19, 2017, 12:58:37 PM »
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  • St. Hippolytus of Rome (3rd century): Canons of Hypolytus, Can. XIX: Concerning Catechumens: "Catechumens, who by the unbelievers are arrested and killed by martyrdom, before they received baptism, are to be buried with the other martyrs, for they are baptized in their own blood."

    It's appropriate that you would spam bump a thread dedicated to your mental/spiritual illness.


    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Re: The Root of Lover of Truth's Illness
    « Reply #50 on: September 19, 2017, 01:11:12 PM »
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  • These errors, in their turn, had stemmed from a false attitude toward the documents of ecclesiastical magisterium. They were, together, "deadly fruits" of a tendency to ignore the clear teachings of the Sovereign Pontiffs, teaching in the course of their ordinary doctrinal activity. Fenton
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church

    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: The Root of Lover of Truth's Illness
    « Reply #51 on: September 19, 2017, 01:46:38 PM »
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  •  ;)

    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Re: The Root of Lover of Truth's Illness
    « Reply #52 on: September 19, 2017, 01:50:19 PM »
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  • The Catholic assertion of the truth that there is no salvation outside the true Church is and has always been a point on which the attacks of the Church's enemies have been centered with particular intensity. A claim that the Catholic Church is a highly acceptable religious society, or even that it is by far the best religious organization, would never have aroused any special animosity against the Church. As a matter of fact, claims of this sort have always been made and are still being made by religious societies distinct from the Catholic Church. What the enemies of the Church have always found and still find infuriating is the Catholic insistence on the truth that the Catholic Church is actually the Mystical Body of Jesus Christ, the one and only true supernatural kingdom of God on earth, the only social body within which men are to find salvific contact with God through Our Lord. Fenton 
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church


    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: The Root of Lover of Truth's Illness
    « Reply #53 on: September 19, 2017, 02:11:43 PM »
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  •  :cheers:

    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Re: The Root of Lover of Truth's Illness
    « Reply #54 on: September 19, 2017, 02:38:23 PM »
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  •  There have been various ways in which Catholic writers have tended to reduce the teaching on the necessity of the Church for salvation to a meaningless formula. Among them, the following may be regarded as among the most important: 

    (1) A few writers, obviously unschooled in sacred theology, have simply rejected the formula itself, and thus completely denied the teaching. The unfortunate Arnold Harris Mathew, writing during his days as a Catholic, produced teaching of this sort. He makes this statement in the chapter "Extra Ecclesiam Salus Nulla," in the symposium Ecclesia: The Church of Christ, a work which Matthew himself edited:

    Now the further question arises as to how far Catholics are bound to hold that for those outside the Roman Church there is no salvation. Catholics are not bound to hold anything of the kind. [Mathew, in his chapter, "Extra Ecclesiam Salus Nulla," in the symposium, Ecclesia: The Church of Christ, edited by Arnold Harris Mathew (London: Burns and Oates, 1906), p. 148.] Fenton
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church

    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: The Root of Lover of Truth's Illness
    « Reply #55 on: September 19, 2017, 03:04:32 PM »
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  •  :baby:


    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Re: The Root of Lover of Truth's Illness
    « Reply #56 on: September 20, 2017, 07:32:32 AM »
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  • (2) The teaching that the dogma of the necessity of the Church for salvation admits of exceptions is, in the last analysis, a denial of the dogma as it has been stated in the authoritative declarations of the ecclesiastical magisterium and even as it is expressed in the axiom or formula "Extra ecclesiasm nulla salus." It is important to note that such teaching is found in Cardinal Newman's last published study on this subject, a study incorporated into his Letter to the Duke of Norfolk, perhaps the least valuable of all his published works. Because of Newman's great influence in the field of contemporary theological studies, it will be helpful to see how he treated this subject in the Letter. Fenton
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church

    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: The Root of Lover of Truth's Illness
    « Reply #57 on: September 20, 2017, 10:19:04 AM »
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  •  ::)

    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Re: The Root of Lover of Truth's Illness
    « Reply #58 on: September 20, 2017, 01:05:30 PM »
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  • (3) Some Catholic authors attempted to explain the dogma of the Church's necessity for the attainment of eternal salvation by saying that the Church is only the ordinary means, and that it is still possible, in extraordinary cases, for a man to attain the Beatific Vision outside the Church. At the same time they resolutely claimed, as Newman had done, that it is a Catholic dogma that there is no salvation outside the Church. Manifestly, according to this explanation, the dogma would be nothing more than a vain formula, something which the very people who accept it as a dogma would be expected to treat, for all practical purposes, as untrue. Ultimately, of course, this explanation coincides with the one offered by Newman in his Letter to the Duke of Norfolk. Fenton
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church

    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: The Root of Lover of Truth's Illness
    « Reply #59 on: September 20, 2017, 02:08:38 PM »
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  •  :confused:

     

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