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Author Topic: The Root of Lover of Truth's Illness  (Read 13653 times)

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Offline Lover of Truth

Re: The Root of Lover of Truth's Illness
« Reply #35 on: September 15, 2017, 01:46:10 PM »
The Church Fathers taught Baptism of blood, but they did not teach Baptism of desire.

Incorrect. See the quotes from St. Augustine and St. Ambrose above, which clearly speak of Baptism of desire.
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Offline DZ PLEASE

Re: The Root of Lover of Truth's Illness
« Reply #36 on: September 15, 2017, 01:47:11 PM »
Quote from: Last Tradhican on September 15, 2017, 01:43:33 PM
The root cause of this poor man's monomaniacal obsession with the salvation of non-Catholics are his doubts about Divine Providence and God's Omniscience and Omnipotence. The difference between him and we who believe that dogmas are the final word on a subject that was previously in dispute, is that he believes that a person can be snatched away from God's Providence, we do not.
His being sick doesn't preclude his also being wicked, and he is the latter, make no mistake or excuse.
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Offline Lover of Truth

Re: The Root of Lover of Truth's Illness
« Reply #37 on: September 15, 2017, 01:48:44 PM »
Baptism of desire and/or blood only apply to catechumens.

Incorrect. Only a small percentage of the quotes from the Church that we present above refer to catechumens specifically, while the majority do not. The letter from the Holy Office in 1949, referenced above, clarifies this.
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Online Ladislaus

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Re: The Root of Lover of Truth's Illness
« Reply #38 on: September 15, 2017, 02:00:48 PM »
Quote from: Lover of Truth on September 15, 2017, 01:46:10 PM
The Church Fathers taught Baptism of blood, but they did not teach Baptism of desire.

Incorrect. See the quotes from St. Augustine and St. Ambrose above, which clearly speak of Baptism of desire.

Ignoring the fact that St. Augustine retracted his opinion, that St. Ambrose's speech was ambiguous at best, and that 7-8 Church Fathers rejected it outright.

But carry on, LoT, with your diabolical crusade to undermine EENS and the Sacraments.
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Offline Lover of Truth

Re: The Root of Lover of Truth's Illness
« Reply #39 on: September 15, 2017, 02:03:22 PM »
Pope Pius XII did not approve, or did not know about the letter from the Holy Office in 1949.

Incorrect. Looking at the letter from the Holy Office (here), the introductory letter from Archbishop Cushing clearly states, "The Supreme Pontiff, His Holiness, Pope Pius XII, has given full approval to this decision". Still, some have actually tried to argue that it is not certain Pope Pius XII approved of the original letter since it was only signed by two Cardinals who worked for Pope Pius XII. This argument is beyond absurdity; imagine two executives publishing a letter for all the world to see, stating that their CEO approved of the letter, when in actuality he did not. What would happen? The CEO would very quickly find out about the letter published in his name, the executives who sent the letter fraudulently would most likely be terminated (or at least seriously reprimanded), and the letter would be retracted. Of course nothing of the sort happened with the letter from the Holy office in 1949; the letter was published in 1952 in several well-known Catholic references with imprimatur, including Canon Law Digest, The Church Teaches, the Catholic Mind, and the American Ecclesiastical Review, and Pope Pius XII reigned for another 6 years without saying a word.
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