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Author Topic: The Necessity of the Sacraments  (Read 69060 times)

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Offline JoeZ

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Re: The Necessity of the Sacraments
« Reply #10 on: February 18, 2024, 06:04:56 PM »
Is anyone aware of any Magisterial texts beyond those I posted which discuss the necessity of the sacraments?

Thanks.

Pope St. Siricius, Decree to Himerius, A.D. 385:

http://www.historyandapologetics.com/2015/02/letter-of-pope-siricius-to-bishop.html



Pope St. Siricius, Decree to Himerius, A.D. 385:
 LATIN: “Sicut sacram ergo paschalem reverentiam in nullo dicimus esse minuendam, ita infantibus qui necdum loqui poterunt per aetatem vel his, quibus in qualibet necessitate opus fuerit sacra unda baptismatis, omni volumus celeritate succurri, ne ad nostrarum perniciem tendat animarum, si negato desiderantibus fonte salutari exiens unusquisque de saeculo et regnum perdat et vitam.
 
 “Therefore just as we say that the holy paschal observance is in no way to be diminished, we also say that to infants who will not yet be able to speak on account of their age or to those who in any necessity will need the holy stream of baptism, we wish succor to be brought with all celerity, lest it should tend to the perdition of our souls if the saving font be denied to those desiring it and every single one of them exiting this world lose both the Kingdom and life.”
 
 Quicuмque etiam discrimen naufragii, hostilitatis incursum, obsidionis ambiguum vel cuiuslibet corporalis aegritudinis desperationem inciderint, et sibi unico credulitatis auxilio poposcerint subveniri, eodem quo poscunt momento temporis expetitae regenerationis praemia consequantur. Hactenus erratum in hac parte sufficiat; nunc praefatam regulam omnes teneant sacerdotes, qui nolunt ab apostolicae petrae, super quam Christus universalem construxit Ecclesiam, soliditate divelli.”
 
 Whoever should fall into the peril of shipwreck, the incursion of an enemy, the uncertainty of a siege or the desperation of any bodily sickness, and should beg to be relieved by the unique help of faith, let them obtain the rewards of the much sought-after regeneration in the same moment of time in which they beg for it. Let the previous error in this matter be enough; [but] now let all priests maintain the aforesaid rule, who do not want to be torn from the solidity of the apostolic rock upon which Christ constructed His universal Church.




Offline JoeZ

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Re: The Necessity of the Sacraments
« Reply #11 on: February 18, 2024, 06:08:30 PM »
Pope St. Zosimus, The Council of Carthage, Canon on Sin and Grace, 417 A.D.- “It has been decided likewise that if anyone says that for this reason the Lord said: ‘In my Father’s house there are many mansions’ [John 14:2]: that it might be understood that in the kingdom of heaven there will be some middle place or some place anywhere where the blessed infants live who departed from this life without baptism, without which they cannot enter into the kingdom of heaven, which is life eternal, let him be anathema.”


Offline JoeZ

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Re: The Necessity of the Sacraments
« Reply #12 on: February 18, 2024, 06:11:56 PM »
Pope Eugene IV, The Council of Florence, “Exultate Deo,” Nov. 22, 1439: “Holy baptism, which is the gateway to the spiritual life, holds the first place among all the sacraments; through it we are made members of Christ and of the body of the Church. And since death entered the universe through the first man, ‘unless we are born again of water and the Spirit, we cannot,’ as the Truth says, ‘enter into the kingdom of heaven’ [John 3:5]. The matter of this sacrament is real and natural water.”


Offline DecemRationis

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Re: The Necessity of the Sacraments
« Reply #13 on: February 21, 2024, 07:43:36 AM »

Pope St. Siricius, Decree to Himerius, A.D. 385:

http://www.historyandapologetics.com/2015/02/letter-of-pope-siricius-to-bishop.html



Pope St. Siricius, Decree to Himerius, A.D. 385:
 LATIN: “Sicut sacram ergo paschalem reverentiam in nullo dicimus esse minuendam, ita infantibus qui necdum loqui poterunt per aetatem vel his, quibus in qualibet necessitate opus fuerit sacra unda baptismatis, omni volumus celeritate succurri, ne ad nostrarum perniciem tendat animarum, si negato desiderantibus fonte salutari exiens unusquisque de saeculo et regnum perdat et vitam.
 
 “Therefore just as we say that the holy paschal observance is in no way to be diminished, we also say that to infants who will not yet be able to speak on account of their age or to those who in any necessity will need the holy stream of baptism, we wish succor to be brought with all celerity, lest it should tend to the perdition of our souls if the saving font be denied to those desiring it and every single one of them exiting this world lose both the Kingdom and life.”
 
 Quicuмque etiam discrimen naufragii, hostilitatis incursum, obsidionis ambiguum vel cuiuslibet corporalis aegritudinis desperationem inciderint, et sibi unico credulitatis auxilio poposcerint subveniri, eodem quo poscunt momento temporis expetitae regenerationis praemia consequantur. Hactenus erratum in hac parte sufficiat; nunc praefatam regulam omnes teneant sacerdotes, qui nolunt ab apostolicae petrae, super quam Christus universalem construxit Ecclesiam, soliditate divelli.”
 
 Whoever should fall into the peril of shipwreck, the incursion of an enemy, the uncertainty of a siege or the desperation of any bodily sickness, and should beg to be relieved by the unique help of faith, let them obtain the rewards of the much sought-after regeneration in the same moment of time in which they beg for it. Let the previous error in this matter be enough; [but] now let all priests maintain the aforesaid rule, who do not want to be torn from the solidity of the apostolic rock upon which Christ constructed His universal Church.




JoeZ,

Thank you for the quote. There is no doubt that among those who die during instruction before receiving baptism there would be - indeed, I would say the vast majority  - those who do not have the faith and heigh level of contrition (probably would need to be "perfect" contrition) to be justified by their vow or desire for the sacrament. To those indeed the sacrament would be necessary, as the sacrament of penance is necessary for those who have, say imperfect contrition for sins committed - the imperfect contrition is enough for the justification of the sacrament of penance, but not for the justification before receipt of the sacrament that comes by way of perfect contrition. Think about it: obviously someone who is justified in the sacrament of penance via an imperfect contrition didn't have perfect contrition before the sacrament.

I would say it is the same regarding baptism. There are those who come to the fount like those who come to the sacrament of penance with imperfect contrition: they would not justified without the sacrament. For them, the receipt of the sacrament is a necessity.

Pope Siricius speaks of infants, and the aforementioned are like infants in that the receipt of the sacrament is absolutely necessary for them, just as it is for infants. They are therefore spoken of collectively by the pope, and for both alike the sacraments are necessary. Remember the language in the Catechism of Trent:

Quote

Baptism Of Infants Should Not Be Delayed


The faithful are earnestly to be exhorted to take care that their children be brought to the church, as soon as it can be done with safety, to receive solemn Baptism. Since infant children have no other means of salvation except Baptism, we may easily understand how grievously those persons sin who permit them to remain without the grace of the Sacrament longer than necessity may require, particularly at an age so tender as to be exposed to numberless dangers of death.

Baptism Of Adults

With regard to those of adult age who enjoy the perfect use of reason, persons, namely, born of infidel parents, the practice of the primitive Church points out that a different manner of proceeding should be followed. To them the Christian faith is to be proposed; and they are earnestly to be exhorted, persuaded and invited to embrace it.

They Should Not Delay Their Baptism Unduly

If converted to the Lord God, they are then to be admonished not to defer the Sacrament of Baptism beyond the time prescribed by the Church. For since it is written, delay not to be converted to the Lord, and defer it not from day to day, they are to be taught that in their regard perfect conversion consists in regeneration by Baptism. Besides, the longer they defer Baptism, the longer are they deprived of the use and graces of the other Sacraments, by which the Christian religion is practised, since the other Sacraments are accessible through Baptism only.

They are also deprived of the abundant fruits of Baptism, the waters of which not only wash away all the stains and defilements of past sins, but also enrich us with divine grace which enables us to avoid sin for the future and preserve righteousness and innocence, which constitute the sum of a Christian life, as all can easily understand.

Ordinarily They Are Not Baptised At Once

On adults, however, the Church has not been accustomed to confer the Sacrament of Baptism at once, but has ordained that it be deferred for a certain time. The delay is not attended with the same danger as in the case of infants, which we have already mentioned; should any unforeseen accident make it impossible for adults to be washed in the salutary waters, their intention and determination to receive Baptism and their repentance for past sins, will avail them to grace and righteousness.

Nay, this delay seems to be attended with some advantages. And first, since the Church must take particular care that none approach this Sacrament through hypocrisy and dissimulation, the intentions of such as seek Baptism, are better examined and ascertained. Hence it is that we read in the decrees of ancient Councils that Jєωιѕн converts to the Catholic faith, before admission to Baptism, should spend some months in the ranks of the catechumens.

Furthermore, the candidate for Baptism is thus better instructed in the doctrine of the faith which he is to profess, and in the practices of the Christian life. Finally, when Baptism is administered to adults with solemn ceremonies on the appointed days of Easter and Pentecost only greater religious reverence is shown to the Sacrament.

In Case Of Necessity Adults May Be: Baptised At Once

Sometimes, however, when there exists a just and necessary cause, as in the case of imminent danger of death, Baptism is not to be deferred, particularly if the person to be baptised is well instructed in the mysteries of faith. This we find to have been done by Philip, and by the Prince of the Apostles, when without any delay, the one baptised the eunuch of Queen Candace; the other, Cornelius, as soon as they expressed a wish to embrace the faith.

This is consistent with what I am saying. If death is imminent for an adult, mercy says give the sacrament - they may be those who, as I have argued, lack the level of contrition or faith that would "avail them to grace and righteousness," and they would be in the same boat as the infant.

I see an argument against my position by saying that the Catechism implies that a BoD would apply to all catechumen in such circuмstances. But I don't think it can be read that way, and think my analogy to the sacrament of penance applies. As quoted in the op, the Council says that "This sacrament of penance, moreover, is necessary for the salvation of those who have fallen after baptism, as baptism itself is for those as yet not regenerated." The same necessity for justification: the actual receipt of the sacrament is necessary for those with imperfect contrition, and I would say the same for some catechumen who do have an imperfect contrition for their past sins. There are some catechumen, I would say, whose "intention and determination" is not perfect and requires the sacrament of baptism.

In sum, I do not think the quotes from Pope Siricius address general sacramental necessity, like Trent does, but a sacramental necessity for those in a certain situation, a dire circuмstance. You don't play "Russian Roulette" and hope those people have "perfect contrition," like you don't delay with infants.

A good quote and very helpful for thinking about this, but I don't see it as having the generality of Trent, or addressing generally the necessity of the sacraments. Pope Siricius is addressing a specific circuмstance in which baptism should not be delayed for adults, which is acknowledged and addressed also in the Catechism of Trent, which talks about BoD or justification by votum with contrition as well.

DR


Offline Ladislaus

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Re: The Necessity of the Sacraments
« Reply #14 on: February 21, 2024, 07:46:23 AM »
Many people who have rebutted the Dimonds have pointed out that they take John 3:5 literally but, apply some interpretation to John 6:53 ...

That's hogwash.  Catholic theologians have always held the Sacrament of Baptism to be necessary by necessity of means and the Holy Communion to be necessary by necessity of precept and by moral necessity.  You can find that treated succinctly in the Catholic Encyclopedia and anywhere else.  This isn't "the Dimonds".