Author Topic: The Catechism of the Council of Trent does not teach Baptism of Desire (Read 64403 times)

Ladislaus · « **Reply #325 on:** April 03, 2023, 07:50:45 PM »

Quote from: Angelus on April 03, 2023, 07:37:43 PM

Correct. Nice graphic. And logic. Maybe it will be contagious.

In that case, will you retract your accusation of heresy against me based due to your omission of "to every repentant sinner"?

AnthonyPadua · « **Reply #326 on:** April 03, 2023, 07:58:10 PM »

Quote from: Angelus on April 03, 2023, 06:53:55 PM

And the title of the thread and the post at the start of the thread are misleading. I prove what I say with the actual evidence from the Catechism, so that those "with eyes to see" will not be misled. Here is the quote again from the Catechism of Trent:

You clearly did not read the thread and you also ignored what I said about the Catechism being fallible.

BoD is not a defined doctrine. If you actually read the thread you would have seen your points have already been addressed.

Angelus · « **Reply #327 on:** April 03, 2023, 08:21:34 PM »

Quote from: AnthonyPadua on April 03, 2023, 07:58:10 PM

You clearly did not read the thread and you also ignored what I said about the Catechism being fallible.

BoD is not a defined doctrine. If you actually read the thread you would have seen your points have already been addressed.

The Roman Catechism teaching that I quoted on "BoD" agrees with (and derives from) the teaching on BoD from Trent, Session 6, chapter 4, which discusses "justification" arising from "the desire for [the bath of regeneration]." That is infallible Magisterial teaching from the Church.

If you mean by "not a defined doctrine" that is not part of the Extraordinary Magisterium, I agree. But the doctrine of BoD, referenced in Trent Session 6, chapter 4, is part of the Ordinary and Universal Magisterium. And this is why the practice of the Church recommends that adult catechumens wait many months before being baptized. The Church teaches that their "desire for baptism" justifies them, even if they die before receiving the Sacrament.

Angelus · « **Reply #328 on:** April 03, 2023, 08:36:51 PM »

Quote from: Ladislaus on April 03, 2023, 07:46:54 PM

Nor is it lost on anyone that you refuse the title "Saint" to this Doctor of the Church, thus attempting to deride him even more, because he doesn't agree with YOUR reading of Trent.

Oh, but, in the appendix to the larger work to which you refer, he does agree with me and with Trent. St. Peter Canisius (Doctor of the Church) states in his Appendix (AN APPENDIX OR ADIDITION OF THE FALL OF MAN AND Justification according to the sentence and doctrine of the Councell of Trent):

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8 A description of the Iustification of a wicked mā, & the manner thereof, in the state of grace. IN which wordes is insinuated the description of a wicked mans iustificati∣on: so that it is a translation from that state in the which man is borne the Sonne of the first ADAM, into the state of grace, & adoption of the Sonnes of God, by the second ADAM IESVS CHRIST our Sauiour. Which trans∣lation certes, after the Gospell once pub∣lished, cannot be made without the lauer of regeneration, or the desire thereof, as it is written: Vnlesse a man bee borne againe of water and the spirite, he cannot enter into the king∣dome of God.

https://quod.lib.umich.edu/e/eebo2/A69066.0001.001/1:8?rgn=div1;view=fulltext

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So, now your ace, St. Peter Canisius (Doctor of the Church), does not even to agree with you. Will you try to find another one?

trad123 · « **Reply #329 on:** April 03, 2023, 08:47:49 PM »

If this chart doesn't post, I also uploaded it.

. . . this transition, once the gospel has been promulgated, cannot take place without the laver of regeneration or the desire thereof, as it is written: Unless a man is born again of water and the Holy Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God (John 3:5).

As it is written says water and the Holy Spirit, both are needed.

If "or" means "one or the other" then forced baptisms would be valid.

if "or" means "one and the other" then both are needed.

CathInfo.com

Author Topic: The Catechism of the Council of Trent does not teach Baptism of Desire (Read 64403 times)

Ladislaus

Re: The Catechism of the Council of Trent does not teach Baptism of Desire

AnthonyPadua

Re: The Catechism of the Council of Trent does not teach Baptism of Desire

Angelus

Re: The Catechism of the Council of Trent does not teach Baptism of Desire

Angelus

Re: The Catechism of the Council of Trent does not teach Baptism of Desire

trad123

Re: The Catechism of the Council of Trent does not teach Baptism of Desire