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Author Topic: St Pius X and Ben XIV against invincible ignorance  (Read 7395 times)

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Offline AnthonyPadua

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Re: St Pius X and Ben XIV against invincible ignorance
« Reply #5 on: August 19, 2023, 10:31:16 PM »
In the 1700s, someone wrote to the Holy Office asking whether it would be permitted to baptize someone in an emergency (danger of death) if they had only come to believe in the existence of God but had not been taught about Our Lord and the Holy Trinity.  Answer from the Holy Office was a definitive no.  See, if this were a disputed or doubted question, they could at least conditionally baptized someone.  This demonstrates that there's no room for doubt here.  This ruling of the Holy Office is also ignored by those who claim that infidels can be saved.  And that's where the dishonesty starts to manifest itself.  They'll promote Suprema Haec, which doesn't even appear in AAS and could very well be fraudulent or at least doctored, as if it were a dogmatic Bull.  That's why they give it the Latin name, to make it seem like an Encyclical or Bull.  But then they'll completely ignore this other ruling of the Holy Office.
Very good to know. So if I ever have to emergency baptism someone, I should first tell them about the Incarnation and the Trinity. How much to they have to know/accept?

Offline Quo vadis Domine

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Re: St Pius X and Ben XIV against invincible ignorance
« Reply #6 on: August 20, 2023, 03:03:54 PM »
In the 1700s, someone wrote to the Holy Office asking whether it would be permitted to baptize someone in an emergency (danger of death) if they had only come to believe in the existence of God but had not been taught about Our Lord and the Holy Trinity.  Answer from the Holy Office was a definitive no.  See, if this were a disputed or doubted question, they could at least conditionally baptized someone.  This demonstrates that there's no room for doubt here.  This ruling of the Holy Office is also ignored by those who claim that infidels can be saved.  And that's where the dishonesty starts to manifest itself.  They'll promote Suprema Haec, which doesn't even appear in AAS and could very well be fraudulent or at least doctored, as if it were a dogmatic Bull.  That's why they give it the Latin name, to make it seem like an Encyclical or Bull.  But then they'll completely ignore this other ruling of the Holy Office.


Lad, where is the reference for this, in the AAS? Anything in English?


Re: St Pius X and Ben XIV against invincible ignorance
« Reply #7 on: August 20, 2023, 03:19:43 PM »

Lad, where is the reference for this, in the AAS? Anything in English?
First two citations in the following excerpt from MHFM's book:

Response of the Sacred Office to the Bishop of Quebec, Jan. 25, 1703:
“Q. Whether a minister is bound, before baptism is conferred on an adult, to explain to him all the mysteries of our faith, especially if he is at the point of death, because this might disturb his mind. Or, whether it is sufficient, if the one at the point of death will promise that when he recovers from the illness, he will take care to be instructed, so that he might put into practice what has been commanded him.
“A. A promise is not sufficient, but a missionary is bound to explain to an adult, even a dying one who is not entirely incapacitated, the mysteries of faith which are necessary by a necessity of means, as are especially the mysteries of the Trinity and the Incarnation.”93

Another question was posed at the same time and answered the same way.

Response of the Sacred Office to the Bishop of Quebec, Jan. 25, 1703:
“Q. Whether it is possible for a crude and uneducated adult, as it might be with a barbarian, to be baptized, if there were given him only an understanding of God and some of His attributes… although he does not believe explicitly in Jesus Christ.
“A. A missionary should not baptize one who does not believe explicitly in the Lord Jesus Christ, but is bound to instruct him about all those matters which are necessary, by a necessity of means, in accordance with the capacity of the one to be baptized.”94

93 Denzinger 1349a.

94 Denzinger 1349b.

See for yourself here: http://patristica.net/denzinger/#n1300


The dogma that belief in the Trinity and Incarnation is absolutely necessary for salvation for all those above the age of reason is also the teaching of St. Thomas Aquinas, Pope Benedict XIV and Pope St. Pius X.

St. Thomas Aquinas, Summa Theologica: “After grace had been revealed, both the learned and simple folk are bound to explicit faith in the mysteries of Christ, chiefly as regards those which are observed throughout the Church, and publicly proclaimed, such as the articles which refer to the Incarnation, of which we have spoken above.”95

Saint Thomas Aquinas, Summa Theologica: “And consequently, when once grace had been revealed, all were bound to explicit faith in the mystery of the Trinity.96

Pope Benedict XIV, cuм Religiosi (# 1), June 26, 1754:
“We could not rejoice, however, when it was subsequently reported to Us that in the course of religious instruction preparatory to Confession and Holy Communion, it was very often found that these people were ignorant of the mysteries of the faith, even those matters which must be known by necessity of means; consequently they were ineligible to partake of the Sacraments.”97

Pope Benedict XIV, cuм Religiosi (# 4):


“See to it that every minister performs carefully the measures laid down by the holy Council of Trent… that confessors should perform this part of their duty whenever anyone stands at their tribunal who does not know what he must by necessity of means know to be saved…”98

Those above the age of reason who are ignorant of these absolutely necessary mysteries of the Catholic Faith – these mysteries which are a “necessity of means” – cannot be numbered among the elect, as Pope St. Pius X confirms.

Pope St. Pius X, Acerbo Nimis (# 2), April 15, 1905:
“And so Our Predecessor, Benedict XIV, had just cause to write: ‘We declare that a great number of those who are condemned to eternal punishment suffer that everlasting calamity because of ignorance of those mysteries of faith which must be known and believed in order to be numbered among the elect.’”99

So let those who believe that salvation is possible for those who don’t believe in Christ and the Trinity (which is “the Catholic Faith” if defined in terms of its simplest mysteries) change their position and align it with Catholic dogma. There is no other name under all of heaven whereby a man is saved other than the Lord Jesus (Acts 4:12). Let them cease contradicting the Athanasian Creed and let them confess that knowledge of these mysteries is absolutely necessary for the salvation of all who wish to be saved. They must firmly hold this so they can themselves possess the Catholic Faith and profess this creed with honesty and as our Catholic forefathers did.


Re: St Pius X and Ben XIV against invincible ignorance
« Reply #8 on: August 20, 2023, 03:23:55 PM »
The book is available online for free here: https://schismatic-home-aloner.com/outside-the-church-there-is-no-salvation/

It covers almost every single objection to John 3:5 and the Athanasian creed and many dogmatic proofs for the necessity of the Catholic faith and the necessity of being born again of water and the spirit.

Re: St Pius X and Ben XIV against invincible ignorance
« Reply #9 on: August 20, 2023, 03:48:36 PM »
St Jerome said that ignorance of scripture is ignorance of Jesus Christ.