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Offline Lover of Truth

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Re: Good Catholics Give Assent to Authoritative Documents
« Reply #30 on: September 15, 2017, 01:42:45 PM »
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  • These guys can't help making a prophet of me again - lies, cries, denies.  Nam-calling too of course.  Yuck.  And ICK

    Back to the truth for those with ears to hear in against those who wish to foist their heresies upon us:

    Pope St. Pius X did not write, or had nothing to do with, the Catechism of Pope St. Pius X.

    Incorrect. 
    In the first English translation of Pope Saint Pius X's catechism ("A Compendium of Catechetical Instruction" published by Reverend Monsignor John Hagan in 1910), it states in the Introduction: "During the sitting of the first Catechetical Congress in 1880, the then Bishop of Mantua (later St. Pius X) proposed that the Holy Father be petitioned to arrange for the compilation of a simple, plain, brief, and popular Catechism for uniform use all over the world. Shortly after his elevation to the Chair of Peter, Pius X at once set about realizing, within certain limits, his own proposal of 1880, by prescribing a uniform Catechism — the Compendium of Christian Doctrine — for use in the dioceses of the ecclesiastical province of Rome, at the same time indicating that it was his earnest desire to have the same manual adopted all over Italy."

    On October 18, 1912, Pope Pius X also wrote this letter to Cardinal Pietro Respighi approving his Catechism of Christian Doctrine for use in the ecclesiastical province of Rome. Here are photocopies of that letter on pages 3–4 of the original Catechism published in 1912:   Catechism cover   Page 2–3   Page 4–5
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church

    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Good Catholics Give Assent to Authoritative Documents
    « Reply #31 on: September 15, 2017, 01:55:44 PM »
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  • Where's the lie, you vile calumniator?  That this did not appear in AAS?  That the only copy we have was produced by Cushing?  That Cushing allegedly sat on the document for four years ... until the man who had allegedly written it had passed away?  Which part of this is "lie"?


    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Re: Good Catholics Give Assent to Authoritative Documents
    « Reply #32 on: September 15, 2017, 01:58:36 PM »
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  • Pius XII Mystici Corporus
    Quote
     But to these juridical bones, which are sufficient in their own line (quae iam ratione sui sufficiunt), in such a way that they far surpass the bonds of any other human society, even the highest, it is necessary to add another factor of unity by which we are most intimately joined together among ourselves and which God by reason of the three virtues, Christian faith, hope, and charity. [AAS, XXXV, 227.]

    As you know very well, Venerable Brethren, from the beginning of Our Pontificate, We have entrusted even those who do not belong to the visible structure (compagem) of the Catholic Church to the heavenly protection and direction, solemnly asserting that, following the example of the Good Shepherd, We wanted nothing more than that they should have life and have it more abundantly. Begging the prayers of the entire Church, We wish to repeat Our solemn declaration in this encyclical letter in which We have praised the great and glorious Body of Christ, most affectionately inviting each and every one of them [those who are not members of the Church] to co-operate generously and willingly with the inward impulses of divine grace and to take care to extricate themselves from that condition in which they cannot be secure about their own eternal salvation. For even though they may be directed towards the Redeemer's Mystical Body by a sort of unconscious desire and intention (etiamsi inscio quodam desiderio ac voto ad mysticum Redemptoris Corpus ordinentur), they still lack so many and such great heavenly helps and aids that can be enjoyed only in the Catholic Church. [Ibid., 243.]
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church

    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Re: Good Catholics Give Assent to Authoritative Documents
    « Reply #33 on: September 15, 2017, 02:42:47 PM »
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  • The letter from the Holy Office in 1949 was never documented in the Acta Apostolicae Sedis (and never assigned an AAS number), therefore the letter is not an official teaching of the Church and can be ignored.

    This is incorrect. The Acta Apostolicae Sedis (Latin for "Acts of the Apostolic See"), often cited as AAS, is the official gazette of the Holy See, appearing about twelve times per year. It was established under this name by Pope Pius X in 1908. It replaced a similar publication that had existed since 1865, under the title of Acta Sanctae Sedis. 

    The 1917 Code of Canon Law clearly states under Canon 9, "Laws laid down by the Apostolic See are promulgated by publication in the official commentary Acta Apostolicae Sedis [Acts of the Apostolic See], unless in particular cases another mode of promulgation has been prescribed." A Commentary on Canon Law (Augustine, 1918) states the same under Canon 9: "The laws enacted by the Apostolic See are promulgated by being published in the official Acta Apostolicae Sedis, unless some other mode of promulgation is prescribed in particular cases...". 

    The Catholic Encyclopedia concurs with this where it states this monthly Roman publication contains the "principal public documents issued by the Pope, directly or through the Roman Congregations."
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church

    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Good Catholics Give Assent to Authoritative Documents
    « Reply #34 on: September 15, 2017, 06:43:30 PM »
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  • The 1917 Code of Canon Law clearly states under Canon 9, "Laws laid down by the Apostolic See are promulgated by publication in the official commentary Acta Apostolicae Sedis [Acts of the Apostolic See], unless in particular cases another mode of promulgation has been prescribed." 

    Nothing sourced from the Vatican was ever "prescribed" for this alleged letter.  We have nothing but Cushing's word for it.  Period.  End of story.


    Offline Merry

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    Re: Good Catholics Give Assent to Authoritative Documents
    « Reply #35 on: September 15, 2017, 07:22:35 PM »
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  • MAYBE "LoT" is not a real Catholic.  Maybe he is an infiltrator - some Communist or agent of the New Church modernist cabal sent to this website for the purpose of obfuscation, dissemination of error and calumny/mudslinging, to lead astray or weaken the traditional resistance.  MAYBE that is why he is not affected by anything anyone says in opposition to his hatred of Fr. Leonard Feeney, a good and loyal priest.  MAYBE that is why he simply keeps slinging his unstable and erratic theology and methodology, fighting Catholic truth and alarming people with his uncatholic spirit. The Church's enemies have been known to infiltrate even the Center itself.  They would surely be interested in a website having EENS participants, if they could affect the intellectual content towards and by their propaganda - or at least slow down or distract the orthodox Catholic reader.  They use many techniques, including just putting names in use that have a "bad smell" (to use the Communist term) - "Feeneyite," for example.  

    Conscientious Catholics would not be as heedless as "LoT" in his affirmations and methods, because such Catholics would still be careful of their virtue -- their humility and charity - nor, perhaps, would they presume to take such a presumptuous name to live up to: "Lover of Truth."  None of us lesser folk would think ourselves worthy of it.    
    If any one saith that true and natural water is not of necessity for baptism, and on that account wrests to some sort of metaphor those words of Our Lord Jesus Christ, "Unless a man be born again of water and the Holy Ghost...,"  Let Him Be Anathama.  -COUNCIL OF TRENT Sess VII Canon II “On Baptism"

    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Re: Good Catholics Give Assent to Authoritative Documents
    « Reply #36 on: September 18, 2017, 08:39:39 AM »
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  • Lie, cry and deny.  Where is the proof?  Can you at least pretend to be intellectually honest?

    Father Leonard Feeney was excommunicated only for disobedience, not for going against the faith.

    Incorrect. The letter from the Holy Office in 1949 to the Archbishop of Boston (
    hereclearly states, "Furthermore, it is beyond understanding how a member of a religious Institute, namely Father Feeney, presents himself as a "Defender of the Faith," and at the same time does not hesitate to attack the catechetical instruction proposed by lawful authorities...". The circumstances surrounding the excommunication were printed in an article in "The Catholic Advance" on February 27, 1953, which can be seen here. Pope Pius XII made three separate requests for Father Feeney to come to Rome. Clearly this meeting was to be about Father Feeney's denial of a Catholic doctrine, but when he did not show for the hearing, this was the final straw.
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church

    Offline JPaul

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    Re: Good Catholics Give Assent to Authoritative Documents
    « Reply #37 on: September 18, 2017, 11:57:34 AM »
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  • Lie, cry and deny.  Where is the proof?  Can you at least pretend to be intellectually honest?

    Father Leonard Feeney was excommunicated only for disobedience, not for going against the faith.

    Incorrect. The letter from the Holy Office in 1949 to the Archbishop of Boston (
    here) clearly states, "Furthermore, it is beyond understanding how a member of a religious Institute, namely Father Feeney, presents himself as a "Defender of the Faith," and at the same time does not hesitate to attack the catechetical instruction proposed by lawful authorities...". The circumstances surrounding the excommunication were printed in an article in "The Catholic Advance" on February 27, 1953, which can be seen here. Pope Pius XII made three separate requests for Father Feeney to come to Rome. Clearly this meeting was to be about Father Feeney's denial of a Catholic doctrine, but when he did not show for the hearing, this was the final straw.
    This has already been answered.  Father Feeney attacked the catechetical instructions that were being taught in the diocese with the  lawful authority,s approval. The teaching in question was demonstrably heretical.  You are willfully obtuse when it comes to facts.


    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Good Catholics Give Assent to Authoritative Documents
    « Reply #38 on: September 18, 2017, 11:59:10 AM »
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  • Where's the lie, you vile calumniator?  That this did not appear in AAS?  That the only copy we have was produced by Cushing?  That Cushing allegedly sat on the document for four years ... until the man who had allegedly written it had passed away?  Which part of this is "lie"?

    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Re: Good Catholics Give Assent to Authoritative Documents
    « Reply #39 on: September 18, 2017, 01:07:12 PM »
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  • As we wait for the "proof" that will never come we will see some truth that cannot be legitimately refuted:

    St. Cyprian, Church Father (3rd Century)The Epistles of Cyprian, Epistle LXXII: "Let men of this kind, who are aiders and favourers of heretics, know therefore, first, that those catechumens hold the sound faith and truth of the Church, and advance from the divine camp to do battle with the devil, with a full and sincere acknowledgment of God the Father, and of Christ, and of the Holy Ghost; then, that they certainly are not deprived of the sacrament of baptism who are baptized with the most glorious and greatest baptism of blood".

    Epistle LXXII, To Jubaianus, Concerning the Baptism of Heretics: "Let men of this kind, who are aiders and favourers of heretics, know therefore, first, that those catechumens hold the sound faith and truth of the Church, and advance from the divine camp to do battle with the devil, with a full and sincere acknowledgment of God the Father, and of Christ, and of the Holy Ghost; then, that they certainly are not deprived of the sacrament of baptism who are baptized with the most glorious and greatest baptism of blood, concerning which the Lord also said, that He had "another baptism to be baptized with."

    The Treatises Of Cyprian, Treatise XI, Exhortation to Martyrdom, Addressed to Fortunatus: "In the baptism of water is received the remission of sins, in the baptism of blood the crown of virtues. This thing is to be embraced and desired, and to be asked for in all the entreaties of our petitions, that we who are God's servants should be also His friends."
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church

    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Re: Good Catholics Give Assent to Authoritative Documents
    « Reply #40 on: September 19, 2017, 08:52:20 AM »
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  • Tertullian, Church Father (3rd Century)On Baptism, Chapter XVI, Of the Second Baptism - With Blood: "We have indeed, likewise, a second font, (itself withal one with the former,) of blood, to wit; concerning which the Lord said, "I have to be baptized with a baptism,"when He had been baptized already. For He had come "by means of water and blood,"just as John has written; that He might be baptized by the water, glorified by the blood; to make us, in like manner, called by water, chosen by blood. These two baptisms He sent out from the wound in His pierced side, in order that they who believed in His blood might be bathed with the water; they who had been bathed in the water might likewise drink the blood. This is the baptism which both stands in lieu of the fontal bathing when that has not been received, and restores it when lost."

    Scorpiace: Antidote for the Scorpion's Sting, Ch VI: "He therefore appointed as second supplies of comfort, and the last means of succour, the fight of martyrdom and the baptism--thereafter free from danger--of blood. And concerning the happiness of the man who has partaken of these, David says: "Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered. Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin." For, strictly speaking, there cannot any longer be reckoned ought against the martyrs, by whom in the baptism (of blood) life itself is laid down. Thus, "love covers the multitude of sins;" and loving God, to wit, with all its strength (by which in the endurance of martyrdom it maintains the fight), with all its life (which it lays down for God), it makes of man a martyr."
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church


    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Good Catholics Give Assent to Authoritative Documents
    « Reply #41 on: September 19, 2017, 01:47:22 PM »
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  •  >:(

    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Re: Good Catholics Give Assent to Authoritative Documents
    « Reply #42 on: September 19, 2017, 01:51:28 PM »
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  • Basically the Protestant position was that the true Church, the Mystical Body of Christ, is to be found in this world among the justified or the predestined people, and that only God knows exactly who these individuals really are. The heresiarchs of the Reformation contended that this true Church, the social body outside which no one can be saved, is something invisible to men in this world. Fenton 
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church

    Offline Ladislaus

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    Re: Good Catholics Give Assent to Authoritative Documents
    « Reply #43 on: September 19, 2017, 02:11:09 PM »
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  •  :popcorn:

    Offline Lover of Truth

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    Re: Good Catholics Give Assent to Authoritative Documents
    « Reply #44 on: September 19, 2017, 02:36:44 PM »
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  • This attitude manifested itself most strongly with regard to the dogma of the Church's necessity for eternal salvation, the point of doctrine against which the opponents of the Church tended to react most violently. Thus there were some Catholic publicists who produced statements of the Catholic position in which the dogma of the necessity of the Church for the attainment of salvation was simply ignored. Others, however, wrote and taught in such a way as to weaken this teaching and to explain it in a way inconsistent with the pronouncements on the subject by the ecclesiastical magisterium. These were the people who reduced the necessity of the Church for the attainment of salvation to a mere empty formula.  Fenton
    "I receive Thee, redeeming Prince of my soul. Out of love for Thee have I studied, watched through many nights, and exerted myself: Thee did I preach and teach. I have never said aught against Thee. Nor do I persist stubbornly in my views. If I have ever expressed myself erroneously on this Sacrament, I submit to the judgement of the Holy Roman Church, in obedience of which I now part from this world." Saint Thomas Aquinas the greatest Doctor of the Church

     

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