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Author Topic: Genuinely curious - rejection of Baptism and the Council of Trent  (Read 24845 times)

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Offline Stubborn

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Re: Genuinely curious - rejection of Baptism and the Council of Trent
« Reply #90 on: May 31, 2018, 11:55:47 AM »
Lad,

I'm not going to follow suit with your splitting up of my posts as though these thoughts are unrelated, all needing to be treated separately.  You're taking me out if context and not reading what I'm saying right out of the gate. It's clear, in fact explicit, that what I said about necessity was directed at happenby.
.
I know that this approach is a good way to bury the question I asked you three pages ago and basically reset the discussion to square one. But that doesn't help anyone, and it's probably the source of your impatience-- even if we disagree I've not done anything to warrant that attitude of yours .
Since you refuse to answer the simple question, will you answer why you refuse to answer the simple question?

Re: Genuinely curious - rejection of Baptism and the Council of Trent
« Reply #91 on: May 31, 2018, 11:56:02 AM »
Section V
Points 1, 2 and 3.

He conveniently (intentionally?) misquotes Pope Pius IX in his point #1, which effectively nullifies points 2 and 3 - as well as his own little chart. Same crap Fr. Cekada has always done in his attempts to justify all his errors.

No sense to critique the rest of that link, it's all crap.
Do you disagree then that "I. You must believe the teachings of both the solemn and the universal ordinary magisterium of the Church (Vatican I)."?


Offline Stubborn

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Re: Genuinely curious - rejection of Baptism and the Council of Trent
« Reply #92 on: May 31, 2018, 11:59:05 AM »
Do you disagree then that "I. You must believe the teachings of both the solemn and the universal ordinary magisterium of the Church (Vatican I)."?
No, I do not disagree.
That has nothing to do with Fr. Cekada intentionally(?) misquoting Pope Pius IX to spread error- which is a tactic he employs regularly. You need to beware of that whenever you read or hear anything from him.

Re: Genuinely curious - rejection of Baptism and the Council of Trent
« Reply #93 on: May 31, 2018, 12:01:19 PM »
No, I do not disagree.
That has nothing to do with Fr. Cekada intentionally(?) misquoting Pope Pius IX to spread error- which is a tactic he employs regularly. You need to beware of that whenever you read or hear anything from him.
Which quote do you believe is incorrect?

Re: Genuinely curious - rejection of Baptism and the Council of Trent
« Reply #94 on: May 31, 2018, 12:05:02 PM »
Rahner was HONEST ... even if heretical.  He had every reason to distort the historical / Patristic record, but he wouldn't do it because he had a certain amount of intellectual integrity that most Traditionalist BoDers lack.

No one has ever explained to me the difference between what they think and what Rahner, theologian of Vatican II, postulated, which was also taught in Lumen Gentium.

Quote
Anonymous Christianity means that a person lives in the grace of God and attains salvation outside of explicitly constituted Christianity — Let us say, a Buddhist monk — who, because he follows his conscience, attains salvation and lives in the grace of God; of him I must say that he is an anonymous Christian; if not, I would have to presuppose that there is a genuine path to salvation that really attains that goal, but that simply has nothing to do with Jesus Christ. But I cannot do that. And so, if I hold if everyone depends upon Jesus Christ for salvation, and if at the same time I hold that many live in the world who have not expressly recognized Jesus Christ, then there remains in my opinion nothing else but to take up this postulate of an anonymous Christianity.

This discussion among traditionalists is absurd because it is really never about the catechumen; but about the hypothetical anonymous Christian described by Rahner above which ends up being the "nice guy" next door. I notice more understanding on the remote possibility of a "Baptism of Desire" among conservative Novus Ordites. At least, they make the connection between the Baptism of Desire and actual dying catechumen.