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Author Topic: Genuinely curious - rejection of Baptism and the Council of Trent  (Read 24014 times)

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Offline trad123

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Re: Genuinely curious - rejection of Baptism and the Council of Trent
« Reply #20 on: May 28, 2018, 03:30:11 PM »
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Offline trad123

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Re: Genuinely curious - rejection of Baptism and the Council of Trent
« Reply #21 on: May 28, 2018, 03:49:47 PM »
How many hold out baptism of desire for those who aren't even catechumens, who don't even profess the Catholic faith?


Liguori, St Alphonsus. Sermons for All the Sundays in the Year (p. 273). Veritatis Splendor Publications. Kindle Edition.

Sermon 29. Trinity Sunday. - On the Love of the Three Divine Persons for Man


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4. See also the special love which God has shown you in bringing you into life in a Christian country, and in the bosom of the Catholic or true Church. How many are born among the pagans, among the Jews, among the Mahometans and heretics, and all are lost. Consider that, compared with these, only a few not even the tenth part of the human race have the happiness of being born in a country where the true faith reigns; and, among that small number, he has chosen you.


http://www.papalencyclicals.net/greg16/g16summo.htm

Summo Iugiter Studio, On Mixed Marriages, Pope Gregory XVI - 1832


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2.

(. . .)

Finally some of these misguided people attempt to persuade themselves and others that men are not saved only in the Catholic religion, but that even heretics may attain eternal life.

Only Catholics can be saved, who will say otherwise?
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Offline JohnAnthonyMarie

Re: Genuinely curious - rejection of Baptism and the Council of Trent
« Reply #22 on: May 29, 2018, 12:22:13 AM »
Quote from: trad123 on May 28, 2018, 03:28:37 PM
The 1917 Code is not binding on the universal Church, but only the Latin rite. It can be argued that the Code does not possess infallibility.
The first sentence in the reply above is identified in the very first canon of Canon Law - Licet in Codice iuris canonici Ecclesiae quoque Orientalis disciplina saepe referatur, ipse tamen unam respicit Latinam Ecclesiam, neque Orientalem obligat, nisi de iis agatur, quae ex ipsa rei natura etiam Orientalem afficiunt.  The second sentence above is immaterial because Canon Law is from the magisterium of the Catholic Church.

Do you disagree with Canon 1239 § 2 ?
Catechumeni qui nulla sua culpa sine baptismo moriantur, baptizatis accensendi sunt.
(Catechumens who, through no fault of their own, die without Baptism, are to be treated as baptized.)

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Offline JohnAnthonyMarie

Re: Genuinely curious - rejection of Baptism and the Council of Trent
« Reply #23 on: May 29, 2018, 12:47:57 AM »
The Council of Trent, Seventh Session, On the Sacraments in General, Canon IV says, "If any one saith, that the sacraments of the New Law are not necessary unto salvation, but superfluous; and that, without them, or without the desire thereof, men obtain of God, through faith alone, the grace of justification;-though all (the sacraments) are not indeed necessary for every individual; let him be anathema."  

I might suggest digesting this canon in three parts (divided by semicolons), that (1) the sacraments are necessary for salvation, (2) with them, or a desire for them, men obtain from God the grace of justification, and (3) that all the sacraments are not necessary for every individual.
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Offline JohnAnthonyMarie

Re: Genuinely curious - rejection of Baptism and the Council of Trent
« Reply #24 on: May 29, 2018, 12:52:11 AM »
Pope Pius XII, in his encyclical on the promotion of false doctrines, states,
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   "7. Here, too, our beloved sons and venerable brothers, it is again necessary to mention and censure a very grave error entrapping some Catholics who believe that it is possible to arrive at eternal salvation although living in error and alienated from the true faith and Catholic unity. Such belief is certainly opposed to Catholic teaching. There are, of course, those who are struggling with invincible ignorance about our most holy religion. Sincerely observing the natural law and its precepts inscribed by God on all hearts and ready to obey God, they live honest lives and are able to attain eternal life by the efficacious virtue of divine light and grace. Because God knows, searches and clearly understands the minds, hearts, thoughts, and nature of all, his supreme kindness and clemency do not permit anyone at all who is not guilty of deliberate sin to suffer eternal punishments."
   "8. Also well known is the Catholic teaching that no one can be saved outside the Catholic Church. Eternal salvation cannot be obtained by those who oppose the authority and statements of the same Church and are stubbornly separated from the unity of the Church and also from the successor of Peter, the Roman Pontiff, to whom 'the custody of the vineyard has been committed by the Savior.'(Ecuмenical Council of Chalcedon in its letter to Pope Leo.) The words of Christ are clear enough: 'If he refuses to listen even to the Church, let him be to you a Gentile and a tax collector;'(Mt 15.17.) 'He who hears you hears me, and he who rejects you, rejects me, and he who rejects me, rejects him who sent me;'(Lk 10.16.) 'He who does not believe will be condemned;'(Mk 16.16.) 'He who does not believe is already condemned;'(Jn 3.18.) 'He who is not with me is against me, and he who does not gather with me scatters.'(Lk 11.23.) The Apostle Paul says that such persons are 'perverted and self-condemned;'(Ti 3.11.) the Prince of the Apostles calls them 'false teachers . . . who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master. . . bringing upon themselves swift destruction.'(2 Pt 2.1.) "

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