Author Topic: BOD Hypocrites (Read 5055 times)

Matto · « **Reply #30 on:** September 19, 2013, 03:59:25 PM »

Quote from: Director

This is directed to MarynM and Mato

Do you hold to Salvation by three ways , in other words ,Salvation thru, Baptism by water , Baptism by blood, Baptism by Desire.

The answer can only be "Yes or "No"

I guess you are asking me, though you misspelled my username. It's funny, I sometimes think everyone knows what I think about things. So I will answer your question. No. But I do not often enter into the arguments because I consider myself unqualified and I know I may be wrong, though I do read many of the arguments.

Stubborn · « **Reply #31 on:** September 19, 2013, 04:01:41 PM »

Quote from: Matto

Quote from: MyrnaM
Thanks Matto, I should have said, does God give grace to those who have reached the use of reason, grace at least once to save their soul.

I have heard it said before that God gives everyone enough grace to save their soul, but I do not know if it is true. Maybe there are people who God knows will reject the graces so he does not give them to them.

Yes, certainly God offers every one all the graces they need to get to heaven, we are free to accept them or reject them.
As Fr. Feeney put it: God has sufficient grace waiting for every man in the world, would he but take it! Were God to see that he would take it were it offered to him, it would be given. "For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour, Who will have all men to be saved, and to come to the knowledge of the truth." (1 Tim. 2:3,4.)

MyrnaM · « **Reply #32 on:** September 19, 2013, 04:35:30 PM »

Quote from: Director

This is directed to MarynM and Mato

Do you hold to Salvation by three ways , in other words ,Salvation thru, Baptism by water , Baptism by blood, Baptism by Desire.

The answer can only be "Yes or "No"

You forgot to put the word OR in between Baptism by water, OR Baptism by blood OR Baptism by Desire.

Yes.

Binechi · « **Reply #33 on:** September 19, 2013, 05:30:31 PM »

Quote from: MyrnaM

Quote from: Director
This is directed to MarynM and Mato

Do you hold to Salvation by three ways , in other words ,Salvation thru, Baptism by water , Baptism by blood, Baptism by Desire.

The answer can only be "Yes or "No"

You forgot to put the word OR in between Baptism by water, OR Baptism by blood OR Baptism by Desire.

Yes.

No myranM I did not leave out the "Or", it was written the way it was written for a reason.

It looks like you may fall under the Anathema of Canon 5 of the Council of Trent

Here it is...

Pope Paul III, The Council of Trent, Can. 5

on the Sacrament of Baptism, ex cathedra:

“If anyone says that baptism [the sacrament] is optional, that is, not necessary for salvation (cf. Jn. 3:5): let him be anathema.

let me explain,, to hold to salvation by the theory of Bod , or BB, is to put one in that "Optional" position. It states , 'there are no Options to Salvation but thru the one sacramental water Baptism.

So much for the theory of Bap of desire /blood

MyrnaM · « **Reply #34 on:** September 19, 2013, 05:35:20 PM »

Quote from: Director

Quote from: MyrnaM
Quote from: Director
This is directed to MarynM and Mato

Do you hold to Salvation by three ways , in other words ,Salvation thru, Baptism by water , Baptism by blood, Baptism by Desire.

The answer can only be "Yes or "No"

You forgot to put the word OR in between Baptism by water, OR Baptism by blood OR Baptism by Desire.

Yes.

No myranM I did not leave out the "Or", it was written the way it was written for a reason.

It looks like you may fall under the Anathema of Canon 5 of the Council of Trent

Here it is...

Pope Paul III, The Council of Trent, Can. 5

on the Sacrament of Baptism, ex cathedra:

“If anyone says that baptism [the sacrament] is optional, that is, not necessary for salvation (cf. Jn. 3:5): let him be anathema.

let me explain,, to hold to salvation by the theory of Bod , or BB, is to put one in that "Optional" position. It states , 'there are no Options to Salvation but thru the one sacramental water Baptism.

So much for the theory of Bap of desire /blood

Where did you ask if Baptism was optional?

So it sounds like you deny BOD/BOB, too bad for you. Hope your baptism was done properly because according to you, if the priest poured the water before he said the Holy Words, and for some strange reason you were not properly baptized. No hope!

Binechi · « **Reply #35 on:** September 19, 2013, 05:52:20 PM »

Quote from: MyrnaM

Quote from: Director
Quote from: MyrnaM
Quote from: Director
This is directed to MarynM and Mato

Do you hold to Salvation by three ways , in other words ,Salvation thru, Baptism by water , Baptism by blood, Baptism by Desire.

The answer can only be "Yes or "No"

You forgot to put the word OR in between Baptism by water, OR Baptism by blood OR Baptism by Desire.

Yes.

No myranM I did not leave out the "Or", it was written the way it was written for a reason.

It looks like you may fall under the Anathema of Canon 5 of the Council of Trent

Here it is...

Pope Paul III, The Council of Trent, Can. 5

on the Sacrament of Baptism, ex cathedra:

“If anyone says that baptism [the sacrament] is optional, that is, not necessary for salvation (cf. Jn. 3:5): let him be anathema.

let me explain,, to hold to salvation by the theory of Bod , or BB, is to put one in that "Optional" position. It states , 'there are no Options to Salvation but thru the one sacramental water Baptism.

So much for the theory of Bap of desire /blood

Where did you ask if Baptism was optional?

So it sounds like you deny BOD/BOB, too bad for you. Hope your baptism was done properly because according to you, if the priest poured the water before he said the Holy Words, and for some strange reason you were not properly baptized. No hope!

You ll have to read my original writing again. You ll see it was to set up for Can 5

Because this is one of most important Canon s , which ties down salvation to One Baptism, and that being Sacramental Baptism

Oh ,, you don t have to worry about me being properly Baptised. We had some good old Italian God Parents, who knew what they were doing. Beside the Priests were a little more on the ball back in the 30 s

God love you ,,, get off this foolish kick. It holds not water. :)

Stubborn · « **Reply #36 on:** September 19, 2013, 05:52:40 PM »

Quote from: MyrnaM

Quote from: Director
Quote from: MyrnaM
Quote from: Director
This is directed to MarynM and Mato

Do you hold to Salvation by three ways , in other words ,Salvation thru, Baptism by water , Baptism by blood, Baptism by Desire.

The answer can only be "Yes or "No"

You forgot to put the word OR in between Baptism by water, OR Baptism by blood OR Baptism by Desire.

Yes.

No myranM I did not leave out the "Or", it was written the way it was written for a reason.

It looks like you may fall under the Anathema of Canon 5 of the Council of Trent

Here it is...

Pope Paul III, The Council of Trent, Can. 5

on the Sacrament of Baptism, ex cathedra:

“If anyone says that baptism [the sacrament] is optional, that is, not necessary for salvation (cf. Jn. 3:5): let him be anathema.

let me explain,, to hold to salvation by the theory of Bod , or BB, is to put one in that "Optional" position. It states , 'there are no Options to Salvation but thru the one sacramental water Baptism.

So much for the theory of Bap of desire /blood

Where did you ask if Baptism was optional?

So it sounds like you deny BOD/BOB, too bad for you. Hope your baptism was done properly because according to you, if the priest poured the water before he said the Holy Words, and for some strange reason you were not properly baptized. No hope!

Well there is another reason BODers offer to believe in a BOD. They should add that to BOD.com . . . . ."You should believe in a BOD in case your baptism was done improperly".
Yep, it'd fit in perfectly on that site.

MyrnaM · « **Reply #37 on:** September 19, 2013, 06:05:00 PM »

Well Stubborn, it happens!

MyrnaM · « **Reply #38 on:** September 19, 2013, 06:09:57 PM »

Quote from: Director

This is directed to MarynM and Mato

Do you hold to Salvation by three ways , in other words ,Salvation thru, Baptism by water , Baptism by blood, Baptism by Desire.

The answer can only be "Yes or "No"

Director, the above was your question, where does it say the word optional?

Option was not the question, so you fibbed like the rest of the funneyites, or whatever they are here.

Binechi · « **Reply #39 on:** September 19, 2013, 06:39:42 PM »

Quote from: MyrnaM

Quote from: Director
This is directed to MarynM and Mato

Do you hold to Salvation by three ways , in other words ,Salvation thru, Baptism by water , Baptism by blood, Baptism by Desire.

The answer can only be "Yes or "No"

Director, the above was your question, where does it say the word optional?

Option was not the question, so you fibbed like the rest of the funneyites, or whatever they are here.

The key words are "Salvation" and "three ways", The correct answer is "no", even though water Baptism was in there.

The way Canon 5 is worded it takes a little mind twisting to figure it out. But I have confidence in you, to figure it out.

The thing is when you ve figured it out , do you still believe in Bod an Bb for Salvation. Not because all the Trad groups adhere to it , or do you believe what the Church has declared, and with an Anathema.

Do you know what Anathema means.... It means get away from me , worst then a piece of Dung. Never set foot in my Church again. etc

Now I don t say that about you , but I hope it opened yours and few others eyes, as to the false teaching going around for over 200 years on the false teaching of Salvation thru some other means, other then Sacramental Baptism.

Emerentiana · « **Reply #40 on:** September 19, 2013, 06:55:01 PM »

On and on and one and on. This stale subject never ends.
Director, are you keeping this alive at the Diamond's direction?

Most Catholics dont agree with the Feenyite position, so you are wasting your time. I guess you hope that some uneducated young posters will arrive for you to influence.

:heretic:

saintbosco13 · « **Reply #41 on:** September 19, 2013, 06:58:59 PM »

Quote from: Director

Quote from: MyrnaM
Quote from: Director
This is directed to MarynM and Mato

Do you hold to Salvation by three ways , in other words ,Salvation thru, Baptism by water , Baptism by blood, Baptism by Desire.

The answer can only be "Yes or "No"

You forgot to put the word OR in between Baptism by water, OR Baptism by blood OR Baptism by Desire.

Yes.

No myranM I did not leave out the "Or", it was written the way it was written for a reason.

It looks like you may fall under the Anathema of Canon 5 of the Council of Trent

Here it is...

Pope Paul III, The Council of Trent, Can. 5

on the Sacrament of Baptism, ex cathedra:

“If anyone says that baptism [the sacrament] is optional, that is, not necessary for salvation (cf. Jn. 3:5): let him be anathema.

let me explain,, to hold to salvation by the theory of Bod , or BB, is to put one in that "Optional" position. It states , 'there are no Options to Salvation but thru the one sacramental water Baptism.

So much for the theory of Bap of desire /blood

That was the most lame argument I have ever seen. I'm embarrassed for you Director. Talk about self interpretation. I guess over a dozen Church Fathers, and a dozen Doctors of the Church, and half a dozen Popes must all be anathematized then. Give me a break.

Emerentiana · « **Reply #42 on:** September 19, 2013, 07:03:42 PM »

Director said

Quote

You ll have to read my original writing again. You ll see it was to set up for Can 5

Because this is one of most important Canon s , which ties down salvation to One Baptism, and that being Sacramental Baptism

Oh ,, you don t have to worry about me being properly Baptised. We had some good old Italian God Parents, who knew what they were doing. Beside the Priests were a little more on the ball back in the 30 s

God love you ,,, get off this foolish kick. It holds not water. :)

Director, Im sure you were baptized correctly. Most of us here are. You dont attend mass or receive the sacraments, and havent for years! Are you going to show God your "Baptism badge" at your judgement?
Salvation depends on more than just infant baptism. Consider that some poor soul entering the church and being saved at a late date, may take your crown. Our Lord told us that he who perserveres to the end will be saved.
You cant live without food. Your soul cant live without spiritual food either.
One unrepented mortal sin can send us to hell. The sacrament of penance cleanses us.
Our Lord told us he would be with us until the end of the world. The sacraments are available. Baptism is not the only sacrament we need!

Binechi · « **Reply #43 on:** September 19, 2013, 07:49:05 PM »

Quote from: Emerentiana

On and on and one and on. This stale subject never ends.
Director, are you keeping this alive at the Diamond's direction?

Most Catholics dont agree with the Feenyite position, so you are wasting your time. I guess you hope that some uneducated young posters will arrive for you to influence.

:heretic:

Me and a few others , who have the truth. The Dimonds pay pretty good
Lol

How about you are you ready for the same question I asked MyranM ?

Conspiracy_Factist · « **Reply #44 on:** September 19, 2013, 08:00:20 PM »

Quote from: MyrnaM

Quote from: bowler
Compare the above Baltimore catechism instruction with this explanation of a BOD hypocrite, with my notes in red:

Bishop Bernard Fellay, Conference in Denver, Co., Feb. 18, 2006: “We know that there are two other baptisms, that of desire and that of blood. These produce an invisible but real link with Christ but do not produce all of the effects which are received in the baptism of water…(OK so far) And the Church has always taught that you have people who will be in heaven, who are in the state of grace, who have been saved without knowing the Catholic Church (this is opposed to the Athanasian Creed and NEVER taught by any Father, Doctor or Saint, so how could he say that "the Church has always taught"). We know this. And yet, how is it possible if you cannot be saved outside the Church? It is absolutely true that they will be saved through the Catholic Church because they will be united to Christ, to the Mystical Body of Christ, which is the Catholic Church (united despite rejecting Christ and His Church! opposed to the Athanasian Creed and NEVER taught by any Father, Doctor or Saint). It will, however, remain invisible, because this visible link is impossible for them. Consider a Hindu in Tibet who has no knowledge of the Catholic Church. He lives according to his conscience and to the laws which God has put into his heart. He can be in the state of grace, and if he dies in this state of grace, he will go to heaven.” (conscience is now salvific for this trad bishop, no different than Pope Francis recent comment that had everyone on CI clamoring. This novel liberal teaching is opposed to the Athanasian Creed and NEVER taught by any Father, Doctor or Saint) (The Angelus, “A Talk Heard Round the World,” April, 2006, p. 5.)

Bower why do you post HERE what Bishop Bernard Fellay "said", (putting in quotes because you have been so mistaken so much ABOUT WHAT OTHERS BELIEVE). If indeed he said it, why not post on a forum that is pro Fellay, most here will not defend Bishop Fellay, because if you have been reading HERE they are resisting him. Why not address your notes to his supporters? I doubt anyone here will defend his words anymore.

Just curious do you believe that God gives, at least once, to every human being the grace to save their soul?

Do you believe that anyone who dies in the state of Sanctifying grace saves their soul and belongs to the Catholic Church, because this saving grace unites ONE to GOD?

I think the Church said, Jews, Pagans etc. etc. can not save their soul UNLESS they become united to it in some way before their death. Not the way you posted.

Whoever said, as you said, that BOD defenders believe that the above can save their soul without being united to it before their death? Who in your mind posted that here?

Also do you believe that a Traditional Bishop of today, his sins or offenses are transferred upon those who depend on him for the Sacraments, provided he is not promoting heresy?

do you agree with this heresy?
Against the Heresies, by Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre:

1. Page 216: “Evidently, certain distinctions must be made. Souls can be saved in a religion other than the Catholic religion (Protestantism, Islam, Buddhism, etc.), but not by this religion. There may be souls who, not knowing Our Lord, have by the grace of the good Lord, good interior dispositions, who submit to God...But some of these persons make an act of love which implicitly is equivalent to baptism of desire. It is uniquely by this means that they are able to be saved.”