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Author Topic: St. Francis Cabrini movie  (Read 13810 times)

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Offline Viva Cristo Rey

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Re: St. Francis Cabrini movie
« Reply #15 on: March 10, 2024, 12:01:58 PM »
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  • I have never in my 72 years heard Saint Francis Xavier Cabrini referred to as "Saint Mother Cabrini" nor as "St. Francis Cabrini".  It has always been "Saint Francis Xavier Cabrini".  In a conversation or written piece, after beginning with her full title "Saint Francis Xavier Cabrini", some will continue with the simpler "Mother Cabrini".
    It really doesn’t matter because most places that she built has shut down.

    Some of us never heard of her at all. 

    The movie is just “Cabrini”. 


    March 8th says it all.  Another communist holiday by the U-N international of brainwashed liberal women’s day.

    Never heard of much of Catholic Church history, saints, religious orders.  Heard much about u-n and unicef etc.

    Now why would we as Catholics collect for United Nations when we have our own Catholic Missionaries. 



    May God bless you and keep you


    Offline Viva Cristo Rey

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    Re: St. Francis Cabrini movie
    « Reply #16 on: March 10, 2024, 12:11:52 PM »
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  • We go see it if it was a rainy day and an excuse to munch on popcorn.  
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    Offline moneil

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    Re: St. Francis Cabrini movie
    « Reply #17 on: March 10, 2024, 01:19:47 PM »
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  • Quote
    I might check out the movie, because to be honest, I don't know too much about this saint, and that's being Italian, from NY and 9 years of Catholic school, so you see how much Catholic institutions have failed me, and that was over 40 yrs ago.

    I'm looking forward to seeing the film sometime in the next week or so as I notice it is in a local theater.  I've not been to a cinema in probable 15 years or more, but I have four passes from my work's Christmas party and have been wondering what I would use them for.

    As for those who don't recall hearing much about St. Francis Xavier Cabrini, she was just canonized in 1946 by Pope Pius XII.  I was born in 1951, she wouldn't have been included in the daily missal that most of the women religious and other adult's probable were using back in the 1950's.  Unless an area in the U.S. was having a population growth in the 1950's - 1960's requiring the erection of a new parish there wouldn't been many churches with her as their patron.

    Offline Viva Cristo Rey

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    Re: St. Francis Cabrini movie
    « Reply #18 on: March 10, 2024, 03:15:20 PM »
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  • One benefit of Cathinfo, we learn more about the faith. 
    May God bless you and keep you

    Offline Viva Cristo Rey

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    Re: St. Francis Cabrini movie
    « Reply #19 on: March 10, 2024, 08:40:49 PM »
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  • Sad to say, I was right. This article is from 1931 and it’s a U-N new holiday.  

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    Offline Viva Cristo Rey

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    Re: St. Francis Cabrini movie
    « Reply #20 on: March 10, 2024, 08:44:39 PM »
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  • The 2 things I noticed from the trailer is the scandalous use of a Shania Twain song as the soundtrack (not actually in the movie, I hope) and the movie being released on "International Women's Day." I don't think this was accidental.
    May God bless you and keep you

    Offline Kephapaulos

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    Re: St. Francis Cabrini movie
    « Reply #21 on: March 10, 2024, 10:34:43 PM »
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  • I've seen at least part of the trailer of the movie in question.

    I'd rather read about St. Francis Xavier Cabrini and visit her tomb (although I did little research and would have to somehow ignore the external odd and ugly look of the shrine). 

    It's like with other movies. It is better to read about which it is based. 

    Ryan Grant commented on the film on the Rundown yesterday and gives it an approval. Whether one agrees with him or not, he gave at least some good analysis and information on understanding artistry in film and the difficulty of capturing religion in it. I recall Charles Coulombe saying how even old movies fell short of expressing religious subject matter. Nothing beats the actual saint or event. 
    "Non nobis, Domine, non nobis; sed nomini tuo da gloriam..." (Ps. 113:9)

    Offline josefamenendez

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    Re: St. Francis Cabrini movie
    « Reply #22 on: March 11, 2024, 08:54:23 PM »
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  • I've been to the shrine , probably over 15 years ago. She is in a glass coffin under the altar (table) of a Novus Ordo chapel inside of a Catholic school in upper Manhattan. The chapel had a very cafeteria/ gymnasium feel to it with fluorescent lighting and kids drawings tacked up on the walls. Her body must have been waxed or was all wax- it didn't look too good when I saw it. (But pictures online seem to look better than I remember )
    I really don't want to say anything bad, but the whole atmosphere was really underwhelming.


    Offline MaterDominici

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    Re: St. Francis Cabrini movie
    « Reply #23 on: March 12, 2024, 02:55:07 AM »
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  • Matthew and I went and saw Cabrini and I'll give you my 2c in relation to the review posted here. I don't think the quality of the film is in any dispute -- the acting, cinematography, etc is all very good -- but the question is does the downplay of religion and the hype of Cabrini as a female ruin the film or otherwise render it unCatholic. (I'd add a spoiler alert here, but if you've read the review above, he's already discussed all of the major scenes.)

    For me, this choice of what to emphasize wasn't a deal-breaker. I realize that I'm not the target audience for this film and I didn't see anything that was outright offensive to Catholics. The creators obviously chose to emphasize certain elements, but I don't believe that they crossed any red lines in doing so. One scene did suggest that Cabrini might have skewed too strongly toward her own personal ambition, but whether or not this is true can not be known and was given only as an opinion in the film, not fact.


    Quote
    The story’s trappings of priests, bishops, and habited nuns are, for the most part, mere trappings. Cabrini almost never mentions God even when trying to convince the clergy to support her work, and is virtually never seen praying, even when at a deathbed. At one point she tells her sisters that they can do “all things in Him Who strengthens us”, but far more emphasis is placed on her own strength as a woman.


    I do not agree with the reviewer on this point. There are multiple scenes of Catholic burials including arranging of the burial of a child she'd never met before. When one of her own was dying, she was on her knees at the bedside. In most scenes like this, whether or not she was actually praying is left open, but she never acted in a manner unbecoming of her state in life. At her lowest point in the film, she goes to the chapel. I didn't feel like I needed the film makers to explain to me why she was there.


    Quote
    another character refers to Cabrini’s habit as a “suit of armor” which seems to refer more to her own womanly strength than to her consecration to God.
    This scene was very open to your own interpretation. They certainly could have gone many directions with this scene and chose to leave it pretty vague.


    Quote
    In the first, a former prostitute who has been helping the nuns comes to Cabrini after killing her pimp in self-defense. She weeps: “There’s not enough water in the world to make me clean.” Cabrini responds:
    Quote
    When I look at you, do you know what I see? I see a strong woman. I see courage. I see it glowing all around you. It takes a lot of courage to become who we’re meant to be. We have something in common....We are both survivors. We don’t get to choose how we come into the world, but God gave us the freedom to choose how we live in it.
    There is a reference to God, but it is too little, too late after this clear opportunity for baptismal imagery has been whiffed in favor of the anachronistic language of survivorhood.

    I agree here. If they didn't want to talk about confession and forgiveness, they should have excluded this scene altogether. To open up a clearly spiritual conversation and not have the Catholic nun provide her with strong spiritual direction is a stretch too far. I think this was one of the most problematic scenes not for what it says, but because opens the door to a very religious topic and then chooses to gloss over the obvious Catholic response.


    Quote
    From the beginning, Cabrini’s relationship with the institutional Church is portrayed as adversarial; though it’s not that the film sets her up against the Church specifically so much as against male authority figures in general. At any rate, she plays the ecclesiastical bureaucracy against itself so she can get power to fulfill her charitable ambitions and prove herself as a woman. (At least the movie makes a point of her obedience to direct orders.)

    To be sure, Cabrini is sometimes given reason to be combative; but often when she first meets someone she needs something from, there is a confrontational tension in her demeanor even before she has been offended. Particularly off-putting is her whole attitude during her first meeting with the archbishop of New York; she immediately attempts to play the Pope’s authority against his, and smirks when he correctly asserts that the Pope has given him the prerogative to make decisions for his own diocese.

    I don't agree with the point he's making here. Often her meetings were after many letters had been sent back and forth, so rejection was on the table at the beginning of the encounters. In the specific scene he mentions here, she had already been told the archbishop's intentions before the meeting. And, she had good reason to say the Pope had sent her because that's exactly what had happened. If she wanted to just follow his orders without any push back, there would be no point to the meeting. The idea of Cabrini not taking "no" as a final answer is really the entire premise of the movie.


    Quote
    as the music swells to the emotional climax of this victory, she looks almost at the camera and says, “Men could never do what we do.”


    While this line is clearly meant to emphasize the power of women to accomplish great things and had a "girl power" vibe to it, in light of Cabrini's life's work, I don't think it was entirely inappropriate. She and her fellow sisters were running an orphanage (the hospital element had not come to fruition yet) and I don't disagree that orphanages full of small children are best run by women.

    All in all, this was a mediocre film for a Catholic. The artistry is nice if you'd like to see it on that point alone. You're not going to walk away feeling very inspired unless you bring into it all of the religious elements that you already know to be true. Her fortitude and resilience are admirable, but you have to bring your own spiritual perspective as that appears only lightly in the movie. If your motivation is to learn all about St. Cabrini, this isn't going to get you there, but it might inspire you to pick up a real biography and learn more.
    "I think that Catholicism, that's as sane as people can get."  - Jordan Peterson

    Offline Asbury Fox

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    Re: St. Francis Cabrini movie
    « Reply #24 on: March 17, 2024, 11:10:42 PM »
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  • Thomas V. Mirus wrote a follow-up article to his review & a response to the director's criticism of his critics:

    https://www.catholicculture.org/commentary/cabrini-and-denial-that-christ-is-for-everyone/

    Cabrini and the denial that Christ is for everyone

    "In a recent interview, Alejandro Monteverde, the director of the new movie Cabrini, defends his work against those who have criticized it for portraying St. Frances Xavier Cabrini as a strong woman and social worker with little to no reference to God, prayer, her religious vocation, or the Catholic faith in general. Expressing his displeasure with those he calls “complainers”, he says, “Well, thank God I’m not making a movie for you.” But it is not Monteverde’s ire that concerns me here; rather, I am troubled by the rationalizations he makes for his decisions, and their implications for both art and evangelization.

    Now as I stressed in my review, the problems with Cabrini can’t be laid solely or perhaps even primarily at the feet of the director. This project was conceived by executive producer J. Eustace Wolfington, who in every interview repeats the same story about how this was always intended to be a movie about “a great woman who just happens to be a nun”. (As a 90-year-old Catholic, Wolfington himself may have been formed by the prevailing attitudes in the Church of the 60s and 70s, particularly the mandate to be relevant to the world.)

    Thus the agenda was set before screenwriter and director were ever hired. Wolfington’s preconceived notion would, of necessity, have affected even the research stage, blocking new discoveries and adjustments that might have come from a truly open engagement with the historical subject. Therefore, while Monteverde is of course defending his own work as a director, he is also defending the job he was given to do by the producer.

    Nonetheless, I would say the following to Monteverde, screenwriter Rod Barr and any other Catholic who made major decisions on Cabrini: It is natural to be upset by criticism of a project you have worked long and hard on. But it is Christian to be open to correction, and if that correction be truthful, to demand more of yourself.

    I would say, too: I realize that Catholic artists are often frustrated by a subset of commenters who are high on suspicion and outrage at the slightest perceived deviation, and low on artistic sense and sympathy for the complexities and challenges artists face. So I should emphasize that I care deeply about Catholic artists, that Monteverde is my brother in Christ, and that I want him to succeed.

    I write this follow-up to my review, then, not to beat a dead horse, but because I believe Monteverde’s comments, ostensibly defending his artistic prerogatives, are in their real implications discouraging to Catholic artists, leading them to curb their high artistic and evangelistic aspirations and settle instead for a circuмscribed, Hollywood-captive vision of what will “work” for a mass audience. Worse, his comments even do a disservice to our Catholic faith. And so I will be frank in examining the many facile assumptions, begged questions and worldly notions put forth by Monteverde in his interview.

    Is “the power of a woman’s voice” more catholic than her Catholic faith?

    Before getting to the director’s statements, though, it’s worth noting how interviewer Kate O’Hare sets the stage: “The fact that [Cabrini] did this in service of Christ and her vocation is … more implicit than explicit.” O’Hare’s ellipses highlight her generous intent, but it is worth noting that if something is not explicit, that does not mean it is implicit: it could simply be absent, which is closer to being the case in Cabrini. If the movie were simply implicit or vague about Cabrini’s deeper motivations, that would be one thing. But the film is indeed explicit in stating her motives, and as I illustrated in my review, they are to a large extent worldly, not spiritual ones.

    Along the same lines, the director uses a hoary writing-workshop cliché to justify downplaying Cabrini’s faith in the film: “It’s show, don’t tell.” Forgive me if I call this a rationalization, seeing that the filmmakers exercised no such restraint when it comes to the film’s girlboss and pro-immigrant themes, which are spoken out loud and often by the fictionalized Cabrini. Indeed, as Paul Kengor points out, they went so far as to invent from whole cloth the film’s villain, the racist mayor of New York, as well as its climactic scene, just so their protagonist could, after putting this non-existent Mayor Gould in his place, turn towards the camera and tell us the film’s principal theme: “Men could never do what we do.”

    Monteverde continues:

    It’s a film that is not for one audience, it’s for everybody. It’s a universal story. This is a movie about a woman that happens to be a nun, a woman that happens to be the first American saint, but she’s a woman and she is very proud to be a woman.

    And she built an empire with women, but she was also an immigrant woman. And that’s where I also connected with her.

    She came to this country with nothing but just a couple of suitcases. And she was the first woman to lead a mission outside, an overseas mission, without the leadership of a man. And look what she built.

    James MaJєωski, my co-host on Criteria: The Catholic Film Podcast, pointed out to me that the suppressed premise here is that Jesus Christ is not universal, that He is not for everybody. Incongruously, Monteverde later says the film “was also an opportunity to celebrate the power of the woman’s voice.” But why is “the power of the woman’s voice” more universal than the woman’s relationship with Christ? Is our culture’s inordinate preoccupation with female “firsts” (a preoccupation certainly not shared by St. Frances Xavier Cabrini) more catholic than Catholicism itself? Presenting a little something of Christianity might, it’s true, be a bit more challenging and less safe, artistically and spiritually, for the filmmakers and their audience—it would also be more intriguing and inspiring—but that is not the same as being less universal.

    The director continues:

    I knew exactly the movie I wanted to make, and I don’t like to make movies to preach to the choir. Those people are already going to church. OK, go.

    So I like to make movies that bring people together, and the problem is that the minute we think we live in a bubble, that’s when we kind of exclude everybody else. And Cabrini didn’t do that. She’s a saint.

    And:

    The works of mercy are in the film. Look, her life is a prayer. So you want to pray, just watch her life. Do 1% of that. That’s her life.

    Preaching to the choir: this cliché, too, obscures more than it illuminates. Does “already going to church” mean we don’t need beautiful and truthful religious art—do Catholics not need to be shown, in the stories of the saints, that our good works only have value when done for and by Christ? But if the film is instead intended for non-Catholics, then how can they be expected to read between the lines to see that the works of mercy portrayed in the film are, indeed, spiritual works of prayer? Surely those outside the choir would need even more, not less, explanation. (Of course, even saint movies need not be “preachy”, but artists who wish to portray a Christian subject adequately cannot avoid the necessity of conveying the Gospel.)

    Is to specify Jesus Christ (whose name was removed from the traditional Latin table blessing that is the film’s one spoken prayer) automatically to “preach to the choir”? Was St. Paul preaching to the choir when he proclaimed “Jesus Christ, and Him Crucified”? Where did a Catholic artist learn this attitude toward evangelization? Surely it is not the strategy taught by Jesus in the Gospels.

    This is not just a matter of evangelization, but of good art. Art, like the Incarnation, connects us to the universal by means of the particular. It is the artist’s task to lead his audience to connect with something outside them, something unfamiliar, and an abdication of that task to give them only what they already know. Monteverde rightly says, “my job as a director was going to be to break any prejudices that come with the character”, but rather than meet that challenge, the makers of Cabrini dodged it by removing most aspects that a modern audience would be prejudiced against in the first place. To do this and then claim to be boldly breaking barriers is an artistic and spiritual cheat.

    And after all, if accessibility was the concern, was the task here so complicated? In a movie about St. Frances Xavier Cabrini, just as in her real life and the whole history of the Church, what wins the respect and love of a non-Catholic audience is her self-giving service to the poor. Step one complete; common ground established. Now for step two! Hearts opened by what they can already recognize as good, irreligious viewers will now be less resistant to the film’s portrayal of what is less familiar (but no less universal): her profession of faith in Jesus Christ and the deeper meaning of her vows as a Catholic religious. That’s not enough to make a good movie, of course—there would remain, for instance, the challenge of giving a saint real internal drama (absent in the film we got). But it’s not like they had to figure out how to portray a really unrelatable saint, like St. Simeon Stylites.

    When, so to speak, “use words when necessary” becomes in practice “don’t use words because they’re unnecessary”, I have a sense of dawning recognition. Suddenly I am in familiar territory; this is the same misguided strategy that Church leaders have used for the past 70 years as the pews empty, now being marketed as cutting-edge Catholic filmmaking! It’s the same illusion of expedience: de-specify the Faith, focus on social work, and cater to the moral fads of the age. Since this is a period piece about a nun set in a time when nuns wore habits, we see Cabrini wearing one, and the movie even compares it to a suit of armor. Yet if it were set ninety years later, the sort of nun portrayed in this movie would have traded her habit for a pantsuit. Catholic artists like Monteverde and company can and should do better."

    Offline MaterDominici

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    Re: St. Francis Cabrini movie
    « Reply #25 on: March 18, 2024, 12:03:45 AM »
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  • Is to specify Jesus Christ (whose name was removed from the traditional Latin table blessing that is the film’s one spoken prayer) automatically to “preach to the choir”?
    I had to look up what he's talking about here. They shortened the whole prayer, not just removed or changed a word as he's suggesting. Apparently they only said "Bless us, O Lord, and these Thy gifts. Amen."
    As it was in Latin, the chances of even 0.1% of the audience noticing is slim.
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    Offline Cera

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    Re: St. Francis Cabrini movie
    « Reply #26 on: March 18, 2024, 03:49:20 PM »
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  • I cannot speak to the new movie, however we did watch an older film about her on EWTN (yes, I know, but lets leave that aside and just look at this movie.) Throughout this older film (and in this short clip below), Mother Cabrini consistently speaks of her devotion to the Sacred Heart of Jesus. I thought it was excellent and had none of the feminist claptrap. She was always respectful to Pope Leo XIII, her Bishop and her clergy. Her faith in the Sacred Heart of Jesus is powerfully portrayed throughout.



    I saved it to our DVR, but it may be showing again. It can be rented or purchased here

    https://ondemand.ewtn.com/paid/Home/Series/catalog/video/en/mother-cabrini
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