Author Topic: 1973 film called "The Catholics"  (Read 2452 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Viva Cristo Rey

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6360
  • Reputation: +1787/-69
  • Gender: Female
1973 film called "The Catholics"
« on: July 28, 2014, 11:45:52 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • This movie is a must for all Catholics especially Irish Catholics.
    However, you must get the original full version that was on American
    PBS.    The amazon versions which also includes the "the Catholics"
    Or "Conflict" have many important scenes that are missing from these videos.
    Also for some odd reason Barnes and Noble will not sell any copies to me and I noticed
    That there aren't any doay Rheims bible.  It seems that Barnes and noble  might be anti catholic.

    I notice they promote Wicca and all religions.
    To live with the Saints in Heaven is all bliss and glory....To live with the saints on Earth is just another story!  (unknown)

    Offline crossbro

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 1434
    • Reputation: +0/-0
    • Gender: Male
    1973 film called "The Catholics"
    « Reply #1 on: July 28, 2014, 11:13:10 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0

  • I watched the movie 20 years ago.

    I don't recall anything about it except that I think the setting was an old monastery on an island in England. At the time it was very dry to me and un-interesting. But that was when I was in my 20s.


    Offline Viva Cristo Rey

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 6360
    • Reputation: +1787/-69
    • Gender: Female
    1973 film called "The Catholics"
    « Reply #2 on: July 29, 2014, 09:10:38 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • I just saw it.   If you are Catholic,( especially a Tradcat) you have to see it.  
    It is what is going on now. It is scary that this movie was made back in 1973.   Now, that you are older you can understand it.  It is our Catholic Faith.

    It is Ironic too that Martin Sheen whose character
    Is totally novus ordo and modern is like that in real
    Life even to social justice to homosexuals.

    The poor abbot in struggling to overcome athesism and he stopped praying.
    He became weak and lukewarm.  The no priest was tempting him with silver too.

    At the start of film they show people gathered at Mass
    Rock coming to Ireland from all over the world for the Latin Mass.

    The Mass Rock and penal days are here.  

    Archbishop Lefebvre helped save the Latin Mass
    Back in 1988. It is because if SSPX there
    Summorum Pontificum.  








    To live with the Saints in Heaven is all bliss and glory....To live with the saints on Earth is just another story!  (unknown)

    Offline Viva Cristo Rey

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 6360
    • Reputation: +1787/-69
    • Gender: Female
    1973 film called "The Catholics"
    « Reply #3 on: July 29, 2014, 09:47:32 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Remember The Mass Rocks.

    Yes we Go to Mass to be with God almighty; not to be
    With our neighbor.  

    Lol. Many of us in Novus Ordo couldn't stand the hippie guitars.

    The hippie social justice pot smoking yoga lovin perverts and sodomists are running
    Our Church and our government.  

    In a America we have Mass sites too. Recently, they took
    Down historic marker which described the first Mass in area and in private
    Homes.  Where brave German Priests from Philadelphia would dress as farmer
    Or trapper dodging bullets or lynching to offer up the Holy Sacrifice
    Of the Mass.  We used to build churches and schools.  The herectics
    Within close them down as enemies of Christ are building while slaughtering
    Christians.  The holocaust of Christians is still being down played and denied after
    Many years of silence and indifference.  Anti Christianity surpasses all other
    Peoples persecution.  

    And all Obama, Hollywood Catholics and cardinal Timothy dolan do is promote, praise condone sexual perversion.  They are obsessed with sexual perversion.
    They booed God and they attack the Church.  

    When we we went to Knock it was sad I thought that we would be seeing
    The original little Church where our Lady and Others appeared.
    It was modern and cold.   Now the Mass Rocks in Ireland
    Made me think of the Mass of my ancestors.  Then in America the herectics sold off shrine
    Property to budists up in auriesville, nj.  Let the herectics have it all because
    We have the faith.  

    We don't have to go far to visit a shrine when you have the
    Latin Mass.  

    I have to go and mail an Irish priest the prayers to make sure
    He blesses our Godchild's brown scapular of Our Lady of Mount
    Carmel.  


    And most important pray to God and pray the Rosary.












    To live with the Saints in Heaven is all bliss and glory....To live with the saints on Earth is just another story!  (unknown)

    Offline Viva Cristo Rey

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 6360
    • Reputation: +1787/-69
    • Gender: Female
    1973 film called "The Catholics"
    « Reply #4 on: July 29, 2014, 09:49:13 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • In the end it isn't about feeling good or social work. It
    Is about saving souls.
    To live with the Saints in Heaven is all bliss and glory....To live with the saints on Earth is just another story!  (unknown)


    Offline Viva Cristo Rey

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 6360
    • Reputation: +1787/-69
    • Gender: Female
    1973 film called "The Catholics"
    « Reply #5 on: August 14, 2014, 06:37:55 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • I notice that I received many thumbs down.  The movie was recommended by longtime tradcat who told me about movie.  


    To live with the Saints in Heaven is all bliss and glory....To live with the saints on Earth is just another story!  (unknown)

    Offline Viva Cristo Rey

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 6360
    • Reputation: +1787/-69
    • Gender: Female
    1973 film called "The Catholics"
    « Reply #6 on: August 14, 2014, 08:27:27 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  •  :smirk:
    To live with the Saints in Heaven is all bliss and glory....To live with the saints on Earth is just another story!  (unknown)

    Offline BTNYC

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 2328
    • Reputation: +2580/-3
    • Gender: Male
    1973 film called "The Catholics"
    « Reply #7 on: August 14, 2014, 08:43:48 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: Viva Cristo Rey
    I notice that I received many thumbs down.  The movie was recommended by longtime tradcat who told me about movie.  




    Well, the movie ends with what is effectively the Gates of Hell triumphing over the Catholic Church.

    The heretical priest orders the monks - the last orthodox Catholic clerics on earth - to stop offering the Latin Mass and to deny the dogma of the Real Presence. The Father Abbot, who has lost his faith, falsely places the virtue of obedience above the virtue of Faith and obeys the order to apostatize, and orders the monks to do likewise.

    In the end, defense of the Catholic Faith is shown to be pointless and irrelevant, blind obedience is portrayed as virtuous and despairing existential terror wins the day.

    So, while it might be a superficially attractive film for trads because it shows the NO in a bad light, the film does not follow that premise through by arguing on behalf of Catholic tradition. I'm not sure what it's arguing on behalf of, other than despair and agnosticism.




    Offline Viva Cristo Rey

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 6360
    • Reputation: +1787/-69
    • Gender: Female
    1973 film called "The Catholics"
    « Reply #8 on: August 14, 2014, 11:23:00 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • No, I disagree.  The Irish monks were already in trouble for disobeying and questioning the Abbot
    Long before the arrival of the Vatican official.  You can see that the Abbott is struggling with temptations  being offered by the devil.  Also, by the abbot remaining at the Monastery was a blessing because the replacement could have been worse.  We see the monks praying and we see the Abbott trying to pray.   As the monks are praying, we know God and our blessed Mother shall triumph in the end.

    To live with the Saints in Heaven is all bliss and glory....To live with the saints on Earth is just another story!  (unknown)

    Offline Viva Cristo Rey

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 6360
    • Reputation: +1787/-69
    • Gender: Female
    1973 film called "The Catholics"
    « Reply #9 on: August 14, 2014, 11:31:37 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • The fictional movie was made in 1973 and it relates to what is happening in real life today.
    The beginning of the movies is good. It shows The Latin Mass and it explains why the Latin Mass.

    The person who wrote the book was struggling with his own faith.
    To live with the Saints in Heaven is all bliss and glory....To live with the saints on Earth is just another story!  (unknown)

    Offline claudel

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 1000
    • Reputation: +758/-3
    • Gender: Male
    1973 film called "The Catholics"
    « Reply #10 on: August 14, 2014, 03:04:38 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • The thread count plugging this TV movie is becoming almost BoD-like. (Cui bono, I wonder?) Indeed, there is a hardly a subforum that doesn't have one or two. I'm almost yearning for another couple of Michelle-Obama-is-a-cross-dresser threads, complete with YouTube links, to wash the taste of the inappropriate Trad applause out of my mouth.

    While I do not disagree with the tenor of BTNYC's assessment—how could I? I offered a similar assessment on an earlier thread—I fear his last paragraph is overly optimistic in its tentatively proposed explanation of why self-identified Trads treats these crumbs as if they were croissants flown in fresh from an upscale Parisian boulangerie. That is, I think that a distaste for the NO has little or nothing to do with it. Rather, I have seen time and again that for a certain sort of Trad, the glimpse of a tonsured head or a delicately tatted dalmatic receding into the distance, especially when accompanied by the barely audible background chanting (recorded decades ago probably) of matins or nones or one of the other hours, has an appeal that frequently overrides all the critical faculties, an appeal that is uncomfortably akin to what in more conventional movie-audience environments is prompted by naughty footage of a yummy twenty-something starlet frolicking in the buff with a guy or another girl.

    Put otherwise, inattentive Trads are swooning over the sizzle and barely noticing the steak. As I wrote on the earlier thread, the book that forms the basis of this manipulative program is a minor masterpiece of a sort, but neither the book nor the movie is proper fare for youngsters, who assimilate these misleading subliminal bits even more thoroughly and rapidly than their insufficiently critical elders.

    Quote from: Viva Cristo Rey
    The person who wrote the book was struggling with his own faith.


    Brian Moore had given up any such struggle 25 years earlier. He had hardened his heart against the Faith, whatever "socially Catholic" aspects remained. To claim otherwise is to substitute imagination for evidence, VCR. However, as the version of Catholics you have also imagined exists nowhere in the world outside you, this is saddening but hardly surprising.

    What's more, even were what you claim true (I reemphasize that it isn't), it would be of no account. The book he wrote and the TV movie others made from it must be evaluated on the basis of what one finds therein. And what is that? Nothing more nor less than a summons to cast off the remnants of a superstition that has outlived its usefulness, no matter how sentimentally appealing it might remain.


    Offline BTNYC

    • Sr. Member
    • ****
    • Posts: 2328
    • Reputation: +2580/-3
    • Gender: Male
    1973 film called "The Catholics"
    « Reply #11 on: August 14, 2014, 07:25:03 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: claudel
    The thread count plugging this TV movie is becoming almost BoD-like. (Cui bono, I wonder?) Indeed, there is a hardly a subforum that doesn't have one or two. I'm almost yearning for another couple of Michelle-Obama-is-a-cross-dresser threads, complete with YouTube links, to wash the taste of the inappropriate Trad applause out of my mouth.

    While I do not disagree with the tenor of BTNYC's assessment—how could I? I offered a similar assessment on an earlier thread—I fear his last paragraph is overly optimistic in its tentatively proposed explanation of why self-identified Trads treats these crumbs as if they were croissants flown in fresh from an upscale Parisian boulangerie. That is, I think that a distaste for the NO has little or nothing to do with it. Rather, I have seen time and again that for a certain sort of Trad, the glimpse of a tonsured head or a delicately tatted dalmatic receding into the distance, especially when accompanied by the barely audible background chanting (recorded decades ago probably) of matins or nones or one of the other hours, has an appeal that frequently overrides all the critical faculties, an appeal that is uncomfortably akin to what in more conventional movie-audience environments is prompted by naughty footage of a yummy twenty-something starlet frolicking in the buff with a guy or another girl.

    Put otherwise, inattentive Trads are swooning over the sizzle and barely noticing the steak. As I wrote on the earlier thread, the book that forms the basis of this manipulative program is a minor masterpiece of a sort, but neither the book nor the movie is proper fare for youngsters, who assimilate these misleading subliminal bits even more thoroughly and rapidly than their insufficiently critical elders.

    Quote from: Viva Cristo Rey
    The person who wrote the book was struggling with his own faith.


    Brian Moore had given up any such struggle 25 years earlier. He had hardened his heart against the Faith, whatever "socially Catholic" aspects remained. To claim otherwise is to substitute imagination for evidence, VCR. However, as the version of Catholics you have also imagined exists nowhere in the world outside you, this is saddening but hardly surprising.

    What's more, even were what you claim true (I reemphasize that it isn't), it would be of no account. The book he wrote and the TV movie others made from it must be evaluated on the basis of what one finds therein. And what is that? Nothing more nor less than a summons to cast off the remnants of a superstition that has outlived its usefulness, no matter how sentimentally appealing it might remain.


    Some very astute observations here and in your earlier post, Claudel.

    And the point you make about the sedating effect that the outward trappings of tradition have on trad filmgoers (highlighted above), is well taken. This is as good an explanation as any I can think of for why I have met so many (indeed, one would be too many) trads who cite Otto Preminger's Judao-Americanist VII agitprop epic The Cardinal as an example of a "good Catholic movie."

    Offline Viva Cristo Rey

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 6360
    • Reputation: +1787/-69
    • Gender: Female
    1973 film called "The Catholics"
    « Reply #12 on: August 14, 2014, 10:57:59 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • What you are saying is the movie was made to mock the Church?  Now I understand what you are saying.  We shouldn't compromise the faith.
    To live with the Saints in Heaven is all bliss and glory....To live with the saints on Earth is just another story!  (unknown)

    Offline Graham

    • Full Member
    • ***
    • Posts: 1768
    • Reputation: +1885/-8
    • Gender: Male
    1973 film called "The Catholics"
    « Reply #13 on: August 15, 2014, 02:37:36 PM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • However the tale is intended, what I like about the movie is the frank portrayal of the abbot (if that is his title), who has lost the faith but continues to run the monastery as its "superintendent." It shows in dramatic form how cynical many of the leaders must be, and how they'll employ a false concept of obedience to level any resistance.

    Offline Neil Obstat

    • Hero Member
    • *****
    • Posts: 15679
    • Reputation: +7696/-411
    • Gender: Male
    1973 film called "The Catholics"
    « Reply #14 on: August 16, 2014, 06:15:08 AM »
  • Thanks!0
  • No Thanks!0
  • Quote from: Graham

    However the tale is intended, what I like about the movie is the frank portrayal of the abbot (if that is his title), who has lost the faith but continues to run the monastery as its "superintendent." It shows in dramatic form how cynical many of the leaders must be, and how they'll employ a false concept of obedience to level any resistance.


    I had the same impression of the movie.  

    I thought it was well-made, largely because of the typically Irish actors.  They were playing the part of someone that wasn't unlike who they really are.  If you want an Irish character, get an Irish actor, because it's not easy to pretend that you're Irish when you're NOT, and do so convincingly.  

    There are numerous very brief moments when various actors do things and say things that only an Irishman would do, and it is very entertaining to watch that.  They show the spark of their inextinguishable cultural faith in very subtle and simple movements and expressive words in context.  A most telling moment is when the monk in the rowboat pulls up to the stone steps with Sheen standing there, and the monk can't believe that Sheen is a priest because of his clothing, which appeared to be like a motorcycle rider's outfit, with leather jacket and boots on.  The boatman looked around and then refused Sheen to board, even SWINGING A STICK at him, perhaps a Shillelagh!  Those 5 or 10 seconds are simply genius, and most hilarious.  They are excellent entertainment and well worth replaying several times.  They get funnier every time you replay them.  Later on in the movie, when Sheen arrives at the monastery in a helicopter, our understanding of the Irish expectation for how a priest should look is enlarged by one monk in the room with the abbot, who can't believe Sheen is a priest, either, merely based on the appearance of his clothing.

    There are instances all throughout the film, such as when the monk brings Irish soda bread up to Sheen, who then not so subtly proceeds to NOT "enjoy" it.  Another moment is when Sheen is moved through the refectory by the abbot, forbidding his monks from speaking to him.   Then there was the fishing scene at the water, and the words of the expert fisherman -- remember the Apostles were fishermen.  The symmetry is palpable.  The visitor is from Rome, and he is no expert fisherman, but he has to go to this "John the Baptist" niche in the water's edge rocks to be shown a real fisherman.  Between the loaves of soda bread and the fishes of the cove, we can recall the miracle of the loaves and fishes in the Gospel.  These things are all over the movie.

    "However the tale in intended," the frank portrayal of each character, most prominently the abbot, is most edifying, really.  

    When I first saw the movie, I had never heard of "Rock Mass" in Ireland, and I had never heard of "Mass Rocks" as being places that physically exist there.  Therefore, the opening scene of a priest saying Mass on rocky cliffs overlooking the ocean was surreal to me, rather bizarre, actually, and appeared to be contrived.  The thought crossed my mind that maybe this is something that may have actually happened somewhere in Ireland, but it also appeared to be some kind of "Woodstock" scene, with people in the open air gathering for an event.  I couldn't make heads or tails of the cultural significance because I had not known of Irish "Rock Masses."  

    There is another thread here on CI that explores this theme in some detail.

    All I had been able to understand is that those people were gathering on the mainland in a remote place for Mass, and that the priest who was the celebrant had come over from an island nearby, during the time when local parishes had abandoned the TLM in favor of the NovusOrdo liturgy, in 1970 or '71.  

    The people came carrying signs protesting the changes in the Mass.  But who were the signs for?  Who was there to read the signs other than more people with the same ideas in mind?  The only person was the character played by Martin Sheen, who was effectively depicted as an OUTSIDER, one whose part later in the movie made it clear that he was no friend of Tradition, and had been sent from Rome to deal with a "problem of Resistance," one which CathInfo is really all about.  So it's very good advice for all members of CathInfo to watch the movie, and I recommend watching it more than once.


    .
    .--. .-.-.- ... .-.-.- ..-. --- .-. - .... . -.- .. -. --. -.. --- -- --..-- - .... . .--. --- .-- . .-. .- -. -.. -....- -....- .--- ..- ... - -.- .. -.. -.. .. -. --. .-.-.

     

    Sitemap 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16