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Author Topic: Welfare Only Way to Support Large Family  (Read 28370 times)

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Änσnymσus

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Re: Welfare Only Way to Support Large Family
« Reply #120 on: December 11, 2019, 11:59:28 AM »
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  • I've been meaning to come back and ask you this... Since you said you have seven children, one of these things is true.
    .
    A) You make over $135,000 per year.
    B) You intentionally skip the Add'tl Child Tax Credit on your tax return.
    C) You're receiving some amount of cash assistance from the government.
    .
    Which one is true? Curious minds (one at least) want to know!
    My personal finance is really relevant to the topic.  A man is responsible to provide for his family not the government.  To have an ever expanding family and expect others to support them is wrong.
    A man must do what is required to earn a living wage and advance their salary/career....2nd job, education in trade, academics, leadership, management...etc
    Tax credit could disappear with the stroke of a pen.  It is an added bonus when available but should never be considered income to support your family.

    Änσnymσus

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    Re: Welfare Only Way to Support Large Family
    « Reply #121 on: December 11, 2019, 12:00:37 PM »
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  • *Irrelevent 


    Änσnymσus

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    Re: Welfare Only Way to Support Large Family
    « Reply #122 on: December 11, 2019, 12:23:46 PM »
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  • Irrelevant 🤦🏻‍♂️ ....My bad!

    Offline MaterDominici

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    Re: Welfare Only Way to Support Large Family
    « Reply #123 on: December 11, 2019, 05:02:07 PM »
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  • My personal finance is really relevant to the topic.  A man is responsible to provide for his family not the government.  To have an ever expanding family and expect others to support them is wrong.
    A man must do what is required to earn a living wage and advance their salary/career....2nd job, education in trade, academics, leadership, management...etc
    Tax credit could disappear with the stroke of a pen.  It is an added bonus when available but should never be considered income to support your family.
    Likewise, food stamps or free medical care could disappear with the stroke of a pen. Why is that not an "added bonus when available"? I don't understand what the significant difference is between the cash assistance vs. food assistance vs. medical assistance.

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    Re: Welfare Only Way to Support Large Family
    « Reply #124 on: December 11, 2019, 05:35:28 PM »
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  • Likewise, food stamps or free medical care could disappear with the stroke of a pen. Why is that not an "added bonus when available"? I don't understand what the significant difference is between the cash assistance vs. food assistance 
    You are ABSOLUTELY correct.  Any government program can disappear with a stroke of a pen. Just another reason why it is important for a father to support his family, not the governments.
    Not to mention, to sign up for temporary  unemployment/ welfare benefits with the true intention of accepting those benefits as a permanent assistance or source of income is fraudulent.  Committing fraud is a sin.
    For those who make the excuse that it’s okay to defraud the program simply because the government is unjust, I’d simply remind them of what Our Lord said to the burdensome tax collector...give to Ceasar what is Caesar’s.
    Again, to be clear.  Those who need the help because they are unable to make ends meet DUE TO NO FAULT OF THEIR OWN...than God Bless them.  


    Offline MaterDominici

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    Re: Welfare Only Way to Support Large Family
    « Reply #125 on: December 11, 2019, 05:48:36 PM »
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  • Not to mention, to sign up for temporary  unemployment/ welfare benefits with the true intention of accepting those benefits as a permanent assistance or source of income is fraudulent.  Committing fraud is a sin.
    If the intention of the program is temporary assistance, then you would not be able to receive it for longer than the time limits without doing something illegal. I'm pretty sure no one here is advocating anything illegal, so that's not really relevant to the discussion.

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    Re: Welfare Only Way to Support Large Family
    « Reply #126 on: December 11, 2019, 06:34:48 PM »
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  • If the intention of the program is temporary assistance, then you would not be able to receive it for longer than the time limits without doing something illegal. I'm pretty sure no one here is advocating anything illegal, so that's not really relevant to the discussion.
    Something may not be illegal but it can still be morally wrong, hence sinful.  
    To accept a benefit under false pretenses is moraly wrong.  
    To intentionally bring children into the world without the means to support them is morally wrong.  
    To work a minimum wage job that doesn’t provide for your families needs and willfully accept that others (govt) will make up the difference, while you do NOTHING to improve your ability to provide for your family (seeking a better paying job and or improving your skill set to increase your families income) is also morally wrong.
    Again, it is a father’s job to support his family, no one else’s.  
    This would be a great question for a priest...
    ”Father, my wife and I can not afford to provide for our family.  Do you recommend we continue to have more children or should we abstain from the marital act until we can properly provide for the children that God has blessed us with?”

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    Re: Welfare Only Way to Support Large Family
    « Reply #127 on: December 11, 2019, 06:45:06 PM »
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  • Or...”Father, I work 40 hours a week at a minimum wage job and still can’t afford to take care of my family.  Do you recommend that I 1) accept govt assistance until my children are all grown and gone  2) get a second job to make ends meet? 3) improve my skill set so that I can earn a higher income and better provide for my family?”


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    Re: Welfare Only Way to Support Large Family
    « Reply #128 on: December 11, 2019, 06:49:39 PM »
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  • This is the place libertarianism has gotten us to. To suggest that it is a sin to engage in the marital debt when on is poor and on government assistance. The state has a duty to the people as well.

    Änσnymσus

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    Re: Welfare Only Way to Support Large Family
    « Reply #129 on: December 11, 2019, 06:54:40 PM »
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  • More accurately...

    Father, my wife and I can not afford to provide for our family.  Do you recommend we continue to have more children and depend on other people to help support them,  or should we abstain from the marital act until we can properly provide for the children that God has already blessed us with?”

    When I say “provide” I don’t mean new Nike sneakers, Polo jeans, cell phone, and exotic family vacations.   I mean the basic necessities of life...food, cloathes, clean home, education.

    Änσnymσus

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    Re: Welfare Only Way to Support Large Family
    « Reply #130 on: December 11, 2019, 06:59:52 PM »
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  • This is the place libertarianism has gotten us to. To suggest that it is a sin to engage in the marital debt when on is poor and on government assistance. The state has a duty to the people as well.
    And parents have a duty to provide for the children they bring into the world, not the government.  Men need to stand up and be men.  Provide for their family.
    Abstinence is perfectly moral when accepted by both partners.  Self-control is a virtue.  I learned that from Sr Britta in 6th grade. 


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    Re: Welfare Only Way to Support Large Family
    « Reply #131 on: December 11, 2019, 07:14:35 PM »
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  • This is the place libertarianism has gotten us to. To suggest that it is a sin to engage in the marital debt when on is poor and on government assistance. The state has a duty to the people as well.
    Never said it was a sin for poor folks to engage in the marital act.  What is a sin is to bring children into the world with no means to care for them.
    My family had no money, my five siblings and I never had new shoes, got hand-me-downs from neighbors... but there was always food on the table, roof over our heads.  My dad always picked up extra hours where he could and mom was always clipping coupons and pinching pennies where she could but they never expected others to pay their bills for them.

    Offline MaterDominici

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    Re: Welfare Only Way to Support Large Family
    « Reply #132 on: December 11, 2019, 07:18:48 PM »
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  • To accept a benefit under false pretenses is morally wrong.  
    Give me an example where it would be morally wrong yet not illegal.
    There's no secret as to which programs as meant to be temporary and which are not -- there are time limits on some and not on others. At least one of them is actually called "Temporary Assistance".
    I think you're adding moral requirements based on your own opinion of who should or shouldn't be given assistance. It's the government that decides who gets what and when. If you meet their requirements, how could you do be doing anything "under false pretenses" and it not be illegal?

    Offline St Ignatius

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    Re: Welfare Only Way to Support Large Family
    « Reply #133 on: December 11, 2019, 07:24:46 PM »
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  • Tax credit could disappear with the stroke of a pen.  It is an added bonus when available but should never be considered income to support your family.

    Listen here, smarty pants... many of us have lived hard lives in order to make ends meet. Under such circuмstances, we tend to learn a bit about resourefulness. So, let's say that if one does lose this particular benefit with a "stroke of the pen," he's more likely to craft a way to continue to survive, even though it might result in extreme discomforts...

    However, those which think they have had the tiger by the tail are in for a very gruesome surprise. They'll find out that doctorates and degrees will be rendered useless. Without practical tradeskills, (yes, those jobs filled by those loathsome blue-collar workers) they'll find themselves absolutely helpless when the "stroke of the pen," by their hidden masters render the value of their dollar to nothing, you'll be lacking the grit necessary to even support yourself, moreless your entire family.

    I  speak with experience here... I went from riches to rags, almost literally overnight, I had a successful construction business and I went out of business in the crash of 2007-08. I witnessed many families thrown into the streets, with all their degrees and such, but I was able to get by without any schooling of higher learning, just with practical everyday skills and grit, and I didn't have to forfeit one bit of real property! That, my friend, is planning!

    Learn who your masters are and quit playing this stupid foolish game that you think is just being responsible... you are about to be burnt! Learn, and teach your children, how to be a truely productive citizen to society and not just a big wage earner (wage slave.)

    Offline MaterDominici

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    Re: Welfare Only Way to Support Large Family
    « Reply #134 on: December 11, 2019, 07:25:37 PM »
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  • So, what we have from "anonymous" is that as long as you're capable of caring for your family, it's OK to take welfare as an "added bonus".
    Also, if you cannot take care of your family, it's OK to take welfare because that's what it's there for.

    I fail to see who exactly doesn't fall into one of these two categories.