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Author Topic: Question about Husbands  (Read 3312 times)

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Question about Husbands
« on: May 07, 2015, 03:22:02 PM »
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  • This is a rather intimate question and I know it may greatly differ depending on the couple but if a young new wife asks how often, or how many times a week, she should expect to please her husband, what would be the best answer?

    Also, under what circuмstances she could legitimately refuse having marital relations with him?

    Is there Church teaching on this anywhere?

    Thanks! I don't really have anyone to ask so I am using the anonymous forum.


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    Question about Husbands
    « Reply #1 on: May 07, 2015, 03:32:28 PM »
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  • The Church teaching is clear, and it is called the marriage debt.  When one spouse seeks marital relations, the other must permit it, or else sin (this applies to both sexes).  Now, if one of the spouses is ill, or just doesn't want to that night, there is nothing wrong in asking for it not to happen.  However, if one spouse demands, the other may not refuse without sinning.


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    Question about Husbands
    « Reply #2 on: May 07, 2015, 04:20:44 PM »
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  • I'm just counting down to the first over-reactive post that the OP's topic is somehow inappropriate for this forum.

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    Question about Husbands
    « Reply #3 on: May 07, 2015, 04:33:38 PM »
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  • I am a Billings Method teacher.  I did run across a young couple years ago and the husband wanted martial relations every day.  It was not right, because his reasoning was not correct and  not reasonable as a "Catholic" would act and think.  He should be also thinking of his wife and not himself.  This husband actually said to me, "Every day or I will take it to a sperm bank.  Now that is very wrong.  Some men are prideful and that is wrong.  Also, science, and take it for what you want or research, every day not only wears a man out, it can also wear him out sooner than need be.  So, these questions should arise.  Some husbands may even M***** if they don't get what they want, so they think and that is a sin for them.

    A husband should consider his wife as she  considers him.  Both should love each other as God would want them to.

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    Question about Husbands
    « Reply #4 on: May 07, 2015, 05:49:53 PM »
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  • See if you can get a copy of "the Catholic Marriage Manual" by Rev. Kelly Imprimatur by Cardinal Spellman from Random House Publishing 1958.   It was written by a Doctor and a Priest.

    The answer to your question should be "when you both feel like it"


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    Question about Husbands
    « Reply #5 on: May 07, 2015, 06:06:28 PM »
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  • Quote from: Guest
    I am a Billings Method teacher.  I did run across a young couple years ago and the husband wanted martial relations every day.  It was not right, because his reasoning was not correct and  not reasonable as a "Catholic" would act and think.  He should be also thinking of his wife and not himself.  This husband actually said to me, "Every day or I will take it to a sperm bank.  Now that is very wrong.  Some men are prideful and that is wrong.  Also, science, and take it for what you want or research, every day not only wears a man out, it can also wear him out sooner than need be.  So, these questions should arise.  Some husbands may even M***** if they don't get what they want, so they think and that is a sin for them.

    A husband should consider his wife as she  considers him.  Both should love each other as God would want them to.


    Yes, I've heard if a husband don't get it every day, or often enough, then most would recourse to M******. Is this true in real life? How is a wife supposed to handled that? Obviously men's libido is very different from women, so there will be most likely a big discrepancy between his wishes on frequency and hers.  

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    Question about Husbands
    « Reply #6 on: May 07, 2015, 06:09:37 PM »
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  • Quote from: Guest
    See if you can get a copy of "the Catholic Marriage Manual" by Rev. Kelly Imprimatur by Cardinal Spellman from Random House Publishing 1958.   It was written by a Doctor and a Priest.

    The answer to your question should be "when you both feel like it"


    This book is presently on Ebay for $12.95.  It will also teach you what you can't do that some husbands try to tell you you can.

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    Question about Husbands
    « Reply #7 on: May 07, 2015, 06:39:26 PM »
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    The answer to your question should be "when you both feel like it"


    I am under the impression than men often "feel like it" a WHOLE LOT more often than women, (we're very different wired) so I think wives do have to keep that mind and make concessions whenever possible.


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    Question about Husbands
    « Reply #8 on: May 07, 2015, 10:43:08 PM »
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  • I still think that the husbands love for the wife, should include her as well and the 2 can come together with decisions that are good and wholesome for both.  What is reasonable and The Church sees the reasonable.

    Offline MaterDominici

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    Question about Husbands
    « Reply #9 on: May 08, 2015, 12:49:14 AM »
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  • There are two aspects to this sort of question: (1) what are my duties to my spouse under pain of sin and (2) how might I best help make our marriage happy and harmonious?

    The Catholic Marriage Manual addresses both in the section quoted below.

    Quote
    Partners’ “rights” in marriage

    The frequency of the marital act, and the specific times when it is performed, should be decided by mutual agreement as much as possible.  Ideally, the best time is when both partners feel a spontaneous desire.  With experience, you will come to know when your spouse will be most disposed to the physical act of love; if possible, you should try to gear your own desires to those of your mate.  The marital act can be engaged in at any time, provided that no deliberate attempt is made to prevent conception.  While intercourse during the menstrual period is morally permissible, most wives object to it then for sanitary reasons, and the considerate husband will respect his wife’s wishes in this regard.

    Sometimes the question of “rights” arises to plague a marriage.  From a technical point of view, theologians tell us, the husband has the right to engage in intercourse with his wife except when she has a serious reason to refuse.  St. Paul teaches that “the wife has not authority over her body, but the husband; the husband likewise has not authority over his body, but the wife.” (1 Corinthians, vii, 4:1)  For a wife to refuse her husband’s request without a serious reason could be a mortal sin.  When is a reason serious?  Theologians say that she may reasonably refuse when her husband is drunk, when either has a venereal disease which may be transmitted to the other, when her own health could be seriously endangered as a result, when there is a clear indication that artificial birth control is to be practiced, or when the other party has committed adultery.  A husband may refuse his wife on the same grounds.

    For the sake of harmony in the marriage, it should not be necessary for the partner desiring intercourse to insist upon his or her right.  Since by his very nature it is more difficult for a man to be continent, his wife should readily consent to his request in a spirit of active love.  She should not merely tolerate him but should show by her responses that she welcomes his advances and appreciates the opportunity to demonstrate her affection.

    There will be times, of course, when she will be unable to respond enthusiastically.  The mother who has lost several nights’ sleep caring for a child who is ill or recovering from illness, or who grieves over the death of a relative or friend, may not find it easy to develop the mood necessary for satisfactory relations.  The considerate husband will recognize these conditions and will not force himself upon her.  If he is motivated by charity and the desire to please her, he can easily subjugate his own desires.

    Young couples should realize that the occasional practice of abstinence will help them during those periods when prolonged continence is absolutely necessary.  Such times may include several months in the late stages of pregnancy and immediately following childbirth, and other long periods when the husband or wife may be absent from home.  When the mature and loving couple accept those periods with understanding and patience, they enrich rather than minimize married love.  By making your own desires secondary to the needs of your marriage, you may feel more love for your partner in abstinence than in intercourse.


    It's an overall good book. Buy a copy. Read it with your spouse.
    "I think that Catholicism, that's as sane as people can get."  - Jordan Peterson

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    Question about Husbands
    « Reply #10 on: May 08, 2015, 07:56:33 AM »
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  • Article 1. Whether husband and wife are mutually bound to the payment of the marriage debt?

    Objection 1. It would seem that husband and wife are not mutually bound, under the obligation of a precept, to the payment of the marriage debt. For no one is forbidden to receive the Eucharist on account of fulfilling a precept. Yet he who has had intercourse with his wife cannot partake of the flesh of the Lamb according to Jerome [Serm. de Esu Agni viii] quoted in the text (Sent. iv, D, 32). Therefore the payment of the debt does not come under the obligation of a precept.

    Objection 2. Further, it is lawful to everyone to abstain from what is hurtful to his person. But it is sometimes harmful to a person to pay the debt when asked, whether on account of sickness, or because they have already paid it. Therefore it would seem allowable to refuse the one who asks.

    Objection 3. Further, it is a sin to render oneself unfit to fulfill an obligation of precept. If, therefore, the payment of the debt comes under the obligation of a precept, it would seem sinful to render oneself unfit for paying the debt, by fasting or otherwise weakening the body: but apparently this is untrue.

    Objection 4. Further, according to the Philosopher (Ethic. viii, 12), marriage is directed to the begetting and rearing of children, as well as to the community of life. Now leprosy is opposed to both these ends of marriage, for since it is a contagious disease, the wife is not bound to cohabit with a leprous husband; and besides this disease is often transmitted to the offspring. Therefore it would seem that a wife is not bound to pay the debt to a leprous husband.

    On the contrary, As the slave is in the power of his master, so is one spouse in the power of the other (1 Corinthians 7:4). But a slave is bound by an obligation of precept to pay his master the debt of his service according to Romans 13:7, "Render . . . to all men their dues, tribute to whom tribute is due," etc. Therefore husband and wife are mutually bound to the payment of the marriage debt.

    Further, marriage is directed to the avoiding of fornication (1 Corinthians 7:2). But this could not be the effect of marriage, if the one were not bound to pay the debt to the other when the latter is troubled with concupiscence. Therefore the payment of the debt is an obligation of precept.

    I answer that, Marriage was instituted especially as fulfilling an office of nature. Wherefore in its act the movement of nature must be observed according to which the nutritive power administers to the generative power that alone which is in excess of what is required for the preservation of the individual: for the natural order requires that a thing should be first perfected in itself, and that afterwards it should communicate of its perfection to others: and this is also the order of charity which perfects nature. And therefore, since the wife has power over her husband only in relation to the generative power and not in relation to things directed to the preservation of the individual, the husband is bound to pay the debt to his wife, in matters pertaining to the begetting of children, with due regard however to his own welfare.

    Reply to Objection 1. It is possible through fulfilling a precept to render oneself unfit for the exercise of a sacred duty: thus a judge becomes irregular by sentencing a man to death. In like manner he who pays the marriage debt, in fulfillment of the precept, becomes unfit for the exercise of divine offices, not because the act in question is sinful, but on account of its carnal nature. And so, according to the Master (Sent. iv, D, 32), Jerome is speaking only of the ministers of the Church, and not of others who should be left to use their own discretion, because without sin they may either abstain out of reverence or receive Christ's body out of devotion.

    Reply to Objection 2. The wife has no power over her husband's body, except as is consistent with the welfare of his person, as stated above. Wherefore if she go beyond this in her demands, it is not a request for the debt, but an unjust exaction; and for this reason the husband is not bound to satisfy her.

    Reply to Objection 3. If the husband be rendered incapable of paying the debt through a cause consequent upon marriage, for instance through having already paid the debt and being unable to pay it, the wife has no right to ask again, and in doing so she behaves as a harlot rather than as a wife. But if he be rendered incapable through some other cause, then if this be a lawful cause, he is not bound, and she cannot ask, but if it be an unlawful cause, then he sins, and his wife's sin, should she fall into fornication on this account, is somewhat imputable to him. Hence he should endeavor to do his best that his wife may remain continent.

    Reply to Objection 4. Leprosy voids a betrothal but not a marriage. Wherefore a wife is bound to pay the debt even to a leprous husband. But she is not bound to cohabit with him, because she is not so liable to infection from marital intercourse as from continual cohabitation. And though the child begotten of them be diseased, it is better to be thus than not at all.

     . . .

    Article 5. Whether husband and wife are equal in the marriage act?

    Objection 1. It would seem that husband and wife are not equal in the marriage act. For according to Augustine (Gen. ad lit. xii) the agent is more noble than the patient. But in the marriage act the husband is as agent and the wife as patient. Therefore they are not equal in that act.

    Objection 2. Further, the wife is not bound to pay her husband the debt without being asked; whereas he is so bound, as stated above (1,2). Therefore they are not equal in the marriage act.

    Objection 3. Further, the woman was made on the man's account in reference to marriage according to Genesis 2:18, "Let us make him a help like unto himself." But that on account of which another thing is, is always the principal. Therefore, etc.

    Objection 4. Further, marriage is chiefly directed to the marriage act. But in marriage "the husband is the head of the wife" (Ephesians 5:23). Therefore they are not equal in the aforesaid act.

    On the contrary, It is written (1 Corinthians 7:4): "The husband . . . hath not power of his own body," and the same is said of the wife. Therefore they are equal in the marriage act.

    Further, Marriage is a relation of equiparence, since it is a kind of union, as stated above (44, 1,3). Therefore husband and wife are equal in the marriage act.

    I answer that, Equality is twofold, of quantity and of proportion. Equality of quantity is that which is observed between two quantities of the same measure, for instance a thing two cubits long and another two cubits in length. But equality of proportion is that which is observed between two proportions of the same kind as double to double. Accordingly, speaking of the first equality, husband and wife are not equal in marriage; neither as regards the marriage act, wherein the more noble part is due to the husband, nor as regards the household management, wherein the wife is ruled and the husband rules. But with reference to the second kind of equality, they are equal in both matters, because just as in both the marriage act and in the management of the household the husband is bound to the wife in all things pertaining to the husband, so is the wife bound to the husband in all things pertaining to the wife. It is in this sense that it is stated in the text (Sent. iv, D, 32) that they are equal in paying and demanding the debt.

    Reply to Objection 1. Although it is more noble to be active than passive, there is the same proportion between patient and passivity as between agent and activity; and accordingly there is equality of proportion between them.

    Reply to Objection 2. This is accidental. For the husband having the more noble part in the marriage act, it is natural that he should be less ashamed than the wife to ask for the debt. Hence it is that the wife is not bound to pay the debt to her husband without being asked, whereas the husband is bound to pay it to the wife.

    Reply to Objection 3. This proves that they are not equal absolutely, but not that they are not equal in proportion.

    Reply to Objection 4. Although the head is the principal member, yet just as the members are bound to the head in their own respective capacities, so is the head in its own capacity bound to the members: and thus there is equality of proportion between them.

    http://www.newadvent.org/summa/5064.htm


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    Question about Husbands
    « Reply #11 on: May 08, 2015, 01:26:05 PM »
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    I am a Billings Method teacher.  I did run across a young couple years ago and the husband wanted martial relations every day.  It was not right, because his reasoning was not correct and  not reasonable as a "Catholic" would act and think.  He should be also thinking of his wife and not himself.  This husband actually said to me, "Every day or I will take it to a sperm bank.  Now that is very wrong.  Some men are prideful and that is wrong.  Also, science, and take it for what you want or research, every day not only wears a man out, it can also wear him out sooner than need be.  So, these questions should arise.  Some husbands may even M***** if they don't get what they want, so they think and that is a sin for them.

    A husband should consider his wife as she  considers him.  Both should love each other as God would want them to.


    Please do not make up false stories.  Your post is very entertaining but to think that Catholic husband would threaten to take his "stuff" to a sperm bank is silly.  If the husband was New Church, he would just pleasure himself.

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    Question about Husbands
    « Reply #12 on: May 08, 2015, 01:50:52 PM »
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  • I am not making up stories.  There are men and women, who can take things to far.  

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    Question about Husbands
    « Reply #13 on: May 08, 2015, 11:10:04 PM »
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    I am not making up stories.  There are men and women, who can take things to far.  


    Ahem.Yes....just like there are some people who are indiscreet, immodest, and have no shame in taking things too far, making too graphic on public forums.

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    Question about Husbands
    « Reply #14 on: May 08, 2015, 11:12:26 PM »
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    Quote from: Guest
    I am a Billings Method teacher.  I did run across a young couple years ago and the husband wanted martial relations every day.  It was not right, because his reasoning was not correct and  not reasonable as a "Catholic" would act and think.  He should be also thinking of his wife and not himself.  This husband actually said to me, "Every day or I will take it to a sperm bank.  Now that is very wrong.  Some men are prideful and that is wrong.  Also, science, and take it for what you want or research, every day not only wears a man out, it can also wear him out sooner than need be.  So, these questions should arise.  Some husbands may even M***** if they don't get what they want, so they think and that is a sin for them.

    A husband should consider his wife as she  considers him.  Both should love each other as God would want them to.


    Yes, I've heard if a husband don't get it every day, or often enough, then most would recourse to M******. Is this true in real life? How is a wife supposed to handled that? Obviously men's libido is very different from women, so there will be most likely a big discrepancy between his wishes on frequency and hers.  


    Nice terminology----not.