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Traditional Catholic Faith => Anσnymσus Posts Allowed => Topic started by: Änσnymσus on July 10, 2024, 12:22:26 AM
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Okay, the time's come. Teens being tempted with self-abuse. How does a parent deal with it? Reading material on this topic? Practices? Conversational themes? What kind of attitude should a parent exhibit? Are there other threads that already deal with this?
I was left to the wolves on most forms of morality, so I'm having to re-invent the wheel with my family. Help and advice on this matter is appreciated.
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Okay, the time's come. Teens being tempted with self-abuse. How does a parent deal with it? Reading material on this topic? Practices? Conversational themes?....
Not a parent, but I think the critical point here is that at this stage you will need to educate your children about sɛҳuąƖ morality and how this problem/temptation specifically relates to this and the natural law from a Catholic perspective.
I recall that one of the more conservative SSPX priests who was ordained early on stressed that the timing of this education is critical...some never talk to their children about these matters for fear of bringing it up and "corrupting" them. The result is that the children discover on their own, and may may mistakes/establish bad habits before the parents even know what is going on. On the other hand, preserving innocence (but not naivety) is also important. There definitely is a way to do this while preserving that balance.
It is critical to make it clear that the reproductive faculties of man and woman are not inherently bad or evil, but that control is needed in accordance with morality/proper use/non use of these faculties depending on state in life. Fallen human nature plays a key role in encouraging attraction to misuse.
It is also very critical that the difference between a temptation and a sin us made clear. I have seen some torture themselves for years with scruples because they didn't understand this basic point...
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So, this is an epidemic problem that people are dealing with these days especially guys. I think when siblings share a room and not have their own room, you'll have less of that. And parents should be talking their kids at the right age about sex and that it's for marriage only, and that sex outside of that is sinful because.... blah blah blah. I think you should be honest with your kids and not beat around the bush because they'll learn about it from outside sources. These days, people are okay with the M even in marriage! Even before I was Catholic, I thought it was messed up. There are secular sources as to why the M/porn are bad. https://fightthenewdrug.org/ this is a good site.
Most people use porn when they're bored, anxious, stressed, etc. so if your kids are busy all the time, they're not going to have the time for that.
I personally think if people got married younger, it would help, probably not fix the problem.
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Before getting anywhere near that topic, it helps for parents to instill a proper understanding of self-control, different roles and responsibilities of one's state in life, and a proper time and place for everything. For example, getting things done vs. sleeping late and goofing off, moderation vs. gluttony, restraint in how and what one speaks vs. letting it rip on impulse. Basically that our bodies and natural faculties are for what God intends, not for our whims.
When these general standards are clearly taught early on, and the parents set a good example too, then talking about the well-ordered purposes of what's reserved for a married couple becomes a natural continuation of what's already learned.
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This battle begins long before they reach puberty. If they don't have self-discipline and pray the rosary daily and regular confession by age 10, they won't be able to have the self-mastery when post-puberty hormones are raging.
How much time do they spend with their parents? I read a stat that children on average only spend 18 minutes a day with their parents, and 8+ hours in schools with their peers. So peers are raising them (blind leading blind)! If you care about your kids' purity, pull them out of schools, homeschool them, or at least spend 8+ hours a day with them!
Example teaches far better than words when it comes to instilling purity. I highly doubt that faithful parents who don't contracept have children with habitual impurity issues.
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OP here,
Are there any books on this?
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Before getting anywhere near that topic, it helps for parents to instill a proper understanding of self-control, different roles and responsibilities of one's state in life, and a proper time and place for everything. For example, getting things done vs. sleeping late and goofing off, moderation vs. gluttony, restraint in how and what one speaks vs. letting it rip on impulse. Basically that our bodies and natural faculties are for what God intends, not for our whims.
When these general standards are clearly taught early on, and the parents set a good example too, then talking about the well-ordered purposes of what's reserved for a married couple becomes a natural continuation of what's already learned.
This.
This was instinctual for me. It's holistic, it starts when they're 2. You teach them mortification, self-control, don't give in to their whims, don't stuff them with food during Mass, teach them to be busy/industrious and not laze around. For example, I *never* allow my kids to "roll around on the floor", not on vacation, not on Christmas, not on Sundays. By "roll around on the floor" I mean just be 100% idle, sometimes laying down, being silly, just 100% unstructured existing, doing and saying whatever pops into their head. I always tell them "Stop it, get up, go pick an actual game and play it". They could literally play ANY game, even a made up one -- just not devolve into drunk silliness and idleness. Again, it's not the laughter that's the problem -- is the physical aspect of completely letting go of all inhibition with regards to the body. That's a bad habit I don't permit.
Even major holidays, vacations, and Days of Rest should have *structure*. Time for prayer, daily chores, study, work (where appropriate) and RECREATION. But even recreation must have ACTUAL GAMES or activities. You don't just laze around, bored, waiting for something to happen. I'm a strong believer of the old adage, "An idle mind is the devil's workshop"
One of the things Fr. Doran (ex-SSPX, now a Conciliar priest in the Maronite Rite, the most liberal of Eastern Rites) got right was the thing about kids eating during Mass. He said that the 2 year old eating Cheerios during Mass "to keep him quiet" today will be having trouble with purity, even fornication, in 15 years. It made sense to me. It's the same mental pathway: Give in to your body, what it wants. Who cares about God and His worship. Hence I will let my young children read "church books" during Mass, but never have snacks. That one stuck with me.
Matthew
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To expand on that --
If you don't develop the mortification/virtue to get yourself out of bed when your BODY is tired and feels like sleeping, how are you going to be strong against other "movements and desires" of the body later on? It's the same strength.
If you can't say no to yourself about meat on Friday, candy during Lent, and other things, how can you turn down something much more pleasurable later on? It's about starting out as young as possible with the habit of virtue -- building up virtue (Latin for power or strength) with practice, year by year.
I tell my kids that the thought process or decision of the Free Will in favor of sin is the same "thought" process that leads to criminal behavior. There is a lot of overlap between sins and actual crimes. I tell them it will ruin your life, in this world AND the next, if you can't learn self-control and develop virtues. I tell them I don't want them to end up in hell, and I don't want to see any of them criminals or with ruined lives. They can see my sincerity in why I enforce certain rules, discipline around the house, etc.
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I took the approach with my son (now 17) of teaching him about changes in the body in an age-appropriate fashion some time before they actually happened, as well as the need to resist certain urges when they do finally manifest, and that certain actions are mortally sinful. I did not want anything to come as a surprise to him, and sure enough, nothing did. Probably a year or so before the changes take place is a good time for the youngster to be ready for them, and to recognize them when they do take place.
I have heard of mothers who never told their daughters anything about having periods until it actually happened. I don't think that's the way to approach it. As to explaining to my son "where babies come from", I introduced the subject gradually, with age-appropriate levels of information.
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Porn and sexy images are coming up all the time on the internet advertising. You can pull up anything decent then all kinds of stuff pops up. It’s almost impossible to monitor it. It’s getting worse.
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I personally think if people got married younger, it would help, probably not fix the problem.
This may be possible for the ladies but for the guys it's difficult to get married young due to financial struggles. Also since I am still relatively new in trad land and have the small chapel experience I am not sure how many parents think about their daughters marrying young, which may also be a barrier.
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Porn and sexy images are coming up all the time on the internet advertising. You can pull up anything decent then all kinds of stuff pops up. It’s almost impossible to monitor it. It’s getting worse.
You should get less of that stuff these days. When the Internet was new, it was way worse with the pop-ups. Have you tried Adblock extensions?
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You should get less of that stuff these days. When the Internet was new, it was way worse with the pop-ups. Have you tried Adblock extensions?
Was me.
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This.
This was instinctual for me. It's holistic, it starts when they're 2. You teach them mortification, self-control, don't give in to their whims, don't stuff them with food during Mass, teach them to be busy/industrious and not laze around. For example, I *never* allow my kids to "roll around on the floor", not on vacation, not on Christmas, not on Sundays. By "roll around on the floor" I mean just be 100% idle, sometimes laying down, being silly, just 100% unstructured existing, doing and saying whatever pops into their head. I always tell them "Stop it, get up, go pick an actual game and play it". They could literally play ANY game, even a made up one -- just not devolve into drunk silliness and idleness. Again, it's not the laughter that's the problem -- is the physical aspect of completely letting go of all inhibition with regards to the body. That's a bad habit I don't permit.
Even major holidays, vacations, and Days of Rest should have *structure*. Time for prayer, daily chores, study, work (where appropriate) and RECREATION. But even recreation must have ACTUAL GAMES or activities. You don't just laze around, bored, waiting for something to happen. I'm a strong believer of the old adage, "An idle mind is the devil's workshop"
One of the things Fr. Doran (ex-SSPX, now a Conciliar priest in the Maronite Rite, the most liberal of Eastern Rites) got right was the thing about kids eating during Mass. He said that the 2 year old eating Cheerios during Mass "to keep him quiet" today will be having trouble with purity, even fornication, in 15 years. It made sense to me. It's the same mental pathway: Give in to your body, what it wants. Who cares about God and His worship. Hence I will let my young children read "church books" during Mass, but never have snacks. That one stuck with me.
Matthew
Excellent!
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How much time do they spend with their parents? I read a stat that children on average only spend 18 minutes a day with their parents, and 8+ hours in schools with their peers.
Not meaning to nit-pic, and I realize that today's society and its schedule is often "off kilter" in many respects, but I find this a very strange metric, even in a single parent household.
It is typical (in my experience and understanding) that there is at least one parent around in the morning to get the kids up, make sure they brush their teeth and are dressed, have breakfast and a lunch to pack, and are out the door to school before the parent goes to work. The kids and parent(s) may indeed be separated for eight hours or more (out of the 24 hours have to include the commute time to and from work) on a work day, but most likely are together at least four hours (6 PM - 10 PM) on weekday evenings, with the opportunity to have supper together (whether or not they take advantage of that opportunity is another issue). The "only spend 18 minutes a day with their parents" doesn't seem at all believable.
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Not meaning to nit-pic, and I realize that today's society and its schedule is often "off kilter" in many respects, but I find this a very strange metric, even in a single parent household.
It is typical (in my experience and understanding) that there is at least one parent around in the morning to get the kids up, make sure they brush their teeth and are dressed, have breakfast and a lunch to pack, and are out the door to school before the parent goes to work. The kids and parent(s) may indeed be separated for eight hours or more (out of the 24 hours have to include the commute time to and from work) on a work day, but most likely are together at least four hours (6 PM - 10 PM) on weekday evenings, with the opportunity to have supper together (whether or not they take advantage of that opportunity is another issue). The "only spend 18 minutes a day with their parents" doesn't seem at all believable.
These studies (there are lots of them that have been done; I read about one of them a while back) go a bit deeper, going minute by minute.
For example, the time in the shower or bathroom was obviously alone, with no parental interaction. Any time at their desk doing homework -- not time spent with parents. The point is that it IS possible to track, using recordings, videos, logs, etc. how the minutes spent at home are allocated. I think the big subtraction was time spent (alone) on the computer, screen(s), phone, etc. -- again, spending 1 hour on social media is an hour they has zero influence from their parents.
Time spent picking clothes, doing laundry or other chores -- even if Mom or Dad is in the background, it's not exactly quality time that amounts to anything. Unless you were talking to parents during an activity -- in which case I'm sure the study instructed them to count it as "time spent with parent(s)".
Matthew
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Mary Reed Newland has a very good book that addresses this topic in one of it's chapters. I believe it's called "How to Raise Good Catholic Children".
Basically the premise is to start young--about 2 or so--in teaching them purity and modesty. Little children start exploring their personal areas at that age, due to potty training. I always tell them to say, "Jesus, help me be pure".
When they get older, about 5 or so, and I notice an upsurge in it again, we have a little chat about using our body parts respectfully, as God intended. Then I tell them if they want to do something like that, come to me right away and we'll say a Hail Mary together. I check in periodically with them--timing varies depending on the child--to see if they're still having trouble with purity.
Both my husband and I are available to them if they have any questions about the reproduction issue as they get older. I tell my boys if they're having impure thoughts to say mentally, "I reject this thought" or "St Joseph, Protector of Virgins, defend me", and then to start saying the mulitiplication tables, play mental alphabet games, etc for distraction. If they still have trouble, they can come to either one of us and say, "I'm having trouble"; our code for impure thoughts/impulses so the siblings won't key in to what's going on, and I will come with them and we'll say some prayers in front of the crucifix (in their room or quiet area).
Also, Bishop Zendejas said that if you give up meat on Wednesday in honor of St. Joseph, he will help maintain purity. So all my adolescents have voluntarily done so.
I think the key is to be charitable and kind, and not act embarrased. If they come to you with this problem, being upset and harsh is the worst thing you can do. You think they'll come back after you've yelled at them? Or physically punished them? Imposing some sort of discipline, say push-ups for boys, or washing the floor on their hand and knees for girls, is appropriate but I am never harsh or angry about it. I want my children to come to me with their problems, not be afraid. It's worked so far.
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I think the key is to be charitable and kind, and not act embarrased. If they come to you with this problem, being upset and harsh is the worst thing you can do. You think they'll come back after you've yelled at them? Or physically punished them? Imposing some sort of discipline, say push-ups for boys, or washing the floor on their hand and knees for girls, is appropriate but I am never harsh or angry about it. I want my children to come to me with their problems, not be afraid. It's worked so far.
I always told my son, if you have any questions or problems regarding that sphere of life, come directly to me, not to your mother (we are not together), not to your grandparents, and certainly not to the so-called "stepfather". He has done precisely that.
He never sees his mother anymore, and both of my parents are gone, so it's now just him and me.
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OP here,
Are there any books on this?
The Douay Rheims Bible. I recently have been reading proverbs where a father gives advice to his son.
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Only the coward wins against sins of impurity.