Catholic Info

Traditional Catholic Faith => Anonymous Posts Allowed => Topic started by: Anonymous on January 06, 2019, 12:01:57 PM

Title: No more minor orders for SSPX Brothers?
Post by: Anonymous on January 06, 2019, 12:01:57 PM
Someone told me that, whereas SSPX brothers all used to receive the clerical tonsure plus the four minor orders, today they only receive tonsure.

Also, they said that in the case of a deal with Rome all these brothers (not sure if this referred to merely tonsured brothers, or those ordained to the minor orders as well) would be returned to the lay state.

Apparently there is some kind of perceived canonical issue on Rome’s side which would compel this demotion, but I couldn’t understand the specifics because the person who told me this speaks very poor English, and for this same reason, I may have also misunderstood some of the details above.

But he was very clear on the part about SSPX brothers no longer receiving minor orders and that this new development was bound up with the regularization process with Rome.

Can anyone help to affirm, refute, or clarify this matter?
Title: Re: No more minor orders for SSPX Brothers?
Post by: Ladislaus on January 06, 2019, 12:08:09 PM
I don't recall Brothers ever receiving Minor Orders beyond tonsure.  At least they did not when I was at the seminary and there were Brothers there.

Conciliarists elminated the Minor Orders altogether, so it's likely that there's no canonical structure in place to assimilate someone with Minor Orders only.
Title: Re: No more minor orders for SSPX Brothers?
Post by: Anonymous on January 06, 2019, 12:32:48 PM
I know there was a Br. Anthony in Winona who possessed all the minor orders (but he was once in priestly formation, so whether he received those orders as a seminarian, or as a brother, I do not know).  I also thought Br. Marcel possessed the minor orders, but I am no longer sure of that.
Title: Re: No more minor orders for SSPX Brothers?
Post by: Anonymous on January 06, 2019, 12:52:12 PM
Thinking more about it now, there was something about releasing all the brothers from their vows for some canonical reason.

I will call the person who told me this to clarify and report back.
Title: Re: No more minor orders for SSPX Brothers?
Post by: poche on January 09, 2019, 12:41:03 AM
I don't recall Brothers ever receiving Minor Orders beyond tonsure.  At least they did not when I was at the seminary and there were Brothers there.

Conciliarists elminated the Minor Orders altogether, so it's likely that there's no canonical structure in place to assimilate someone with Minor Orders only.
the minor orders would correspond to Lector and Acolyte.
Title: Re: No more minor orders for SSPX Brothers?
Post by: Anonymous on January 10, 2019, 08:27:24 AM
This is just a guess on my part, but I believe it may have to do with the differences between 1973 and 1983 Canon Law regarding clerics.

Under the 1917 law, a man became a cleric when he received first tonsure when he entered the minor orders.  However, under the 1983 law, a man only becomes a cleric upon his ordination to the diaconate (the Novus Order "ministries" of reader and acolyte are somewhat analogous to the traditional minor orders, but the 1983 law is clear that they are not clerics).

So, if the SSPX were to become regularized with Rome, anyone admitted to the minor orders would not be considered clerics.
Title: Re: No more minor orders for SSPX Brothers?
Post by: Anonymous on January 10, 2019, 10:39:07 PM
This is just a guess on my part, but I believe it may have to do with the differences between 1973 and 1983 Canon Law regarding clerics.

Under the 1917 law, a man became a cleric when he received first tonsure when he entered the minor orders.  However, under the 1983 law, a man only becomes a cleric upon his ordination to the diaconate (the Novus Order "ministries" of reader and acolyte are somewhat analogous to the traditional minor orders, but the 1983 law is clear that they are not clerics).

So, if the SSPX were to become regularized with Rome, anyone admitted to the minor orders would not be considered clerics.
I don't think that is necessary. If the profession in their community has traditionally included the conferral of minor orders upon their professed members then I don't see a necessity for them to do something different as part of an agreement with the Vatican. After all, Perfectae Caritatis calls upon the communities to go to the original charism of their foundation and if this is an integral part of that foundation under Archbishop Lefebvre then it should continue on.
While the conferral of minor orders is usually reserved to men in formation to the priesthood, there are ordinaries who are willing to confer them on men who are not destined to the priesthood or the permanent diaconate,