Author Topic: Is it wrong to believe this about hell? (Read 6844 times)

Änσnymσus · « **Reply #45 on:** March 20, 2017, 11:28:56 PM »

Quote from: Mercyandjustice on March 20, 2017, 04:23:01 PM

This is the OP again. I have found what might be 'solutions' to my problems.

The doctrine of apocatastasis "was formally condemned in the first of the famous anathemas pronounced at the Council of Constantinople in 543: Ei tis ten teratode apokatastasis presbeuei anathema esto [See, also, Justinian, Liber adversus Originem, anathemas 7 and 9.] The doctrine was thenceforth looked on as heterodox by the Church." http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/01599a.htm

There will be punishment after death, maybe even a long punishment, but it will be temporary.

No, Mercy and Justice, That is false. Hell is eternal.

Daniel 12:2,3 Many of those who sleep in the dusty ground will awake – some to everlasting life, and others to shame and everlasting abhorrence. But the wise will shine like the brightness of the heavenly expanse. And those bringing many to righteousness will be like the stars forever and ever.

Matthew 25:41 “Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you accursed, into the eternal fire that has been prepared for the devil and his angels!

The second 'solution' is the belief in a spirit world. The way that spiritualists believe the after life to be. The afterlife/spirit world is a world similar to ours, but free of anguish and sorrow. ... contrary to the traditional Christian view ...

There are not two worlds. There is one and you'd better not be wrong about the real world.

These options are just so much more consoling to me than the traditional Christian view of eternal fire for 99.89 %of humanity.

Are you seeking Truth or your own comfort and consolation?

St Paul wrote to the Corinthians: 1 - 2 : 6-10
Howbeit we speak wisdom among the perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, neither of the princes of this world that come to nought; But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, a wisdom which is hidden, which God ordained before the world, unto our glory: Which none of the princes of this world knew; for if they had known it, they would never have crucified the Lord of glory. But, as it is written: That eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither hath it entered into the heart of man, what things God hath prepared for them that love him. But to us God hath revealed them, by this Spirit. For the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.

How much comfort and consolation did Our Lord have as He hung on the cross for our sins? We are meant to follow in His footsteps and carry our cross whatever it be. There will neither be any consolation for you in spiritualism. These thoughts are from the evil one, so you must be a very important one for him to attack you in this way.

1 Corinthians 10: [13] Let no temptation take hold on you, but such as is human. And God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that which you are able: but will make also with temptation issue, that you may be able to bear it.

Such thinking makes me hopless, to be honest. And anxious too. I'm honestly almost starting to doubt that Catholicism, or even Christianity in general is the only true 'way.' .... I'm so spiritually lost right now. I still feel really empty and super sad and anxious, but believing in everlasting torment for temporal actions would make me sadder!

M&J, I am praying for you in your distress, which must be tremendous. Do not give up hope. Do you have the consolation of being able to consult a good priest about your dilemma?

Nadir · « **Reply #46 on:** March 21, 2017, 12:28:32 AM »

Sorry, I forgot to tick the box which says Post with your username? (NOT ANONYMOUS)

Mercyandjustice · « **Reply #47 on:** March 27, 2017, 03:22:18 AM »

The traditional idea of hell still seems totally overkill. Isn't punishment supposed to be to discipline you and eventually correct you? It makes more sense to see hell as that, a temporary punishment to fix you. Punishment for the sake of it isn't right. You don't send your child to timeout for no reason, you do it to teach him a lesson and fix him. God's mercy endures forever, while His anger is limited.

"God is the savior of ALL men, especially of believers." 1 Timothy 4 10

"In Christ, ALL will be made to live." 1Corinthians 15 22

"The last enemy to be destroyed will be death." 1 Cor 15 26 (How can death be destroyed if hell will be for ever?)

There a ton of verses that seem to support Christian universalism. Everywhere I see that Christ is the Saviour of ALL men and the WHOLE WORLD. Not just a few men. And yes, I know that there are frequent references to eternal fire and whatnot; but I've read compelling evidence that shows how the greek word doesn't really mean eternal. It just means an indefinite period of time. Many early Christians believed in Universalism, it seems:

http://www.tentmaker.org/Quotes/churchfathersquotes.htm

Also, a lot of these seem pretty hard to refute:

http://richardwaynegarganta.com/Bible%20Threatenings%20Explained.htm

I'm sorry, but it just seems to make more sense to believe that Christ truly is the Victor over death. The traditional view of salvation just makes God look like a failed Saviour. An accident. It makes the cross seem like a frail and almost pathetic attempt. Like "awww, well at least you tried!" If ony 3 out of 3838298374748383829383838 people will go to heaven everyday...? I don't want to believe God is a failure or that the cross is useless!! But, again, the traditional view makes it seem so. At least in my confused view. Please enlighten me if you can.

P.s. As for Apocosatasis being condemned:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/afkimel.wordpress.com/2015/05/18/apocatastasis-the-heresy-that-never-was-2/amp/

??

Mercyandjustice · « **Reply #48 on:** March 27, 2017, 04:16:39 AM »

There also seems to be some confusion in traditional Catholic views of hell and heaven. In every Catechism you see, it says that hell is for mortal sinners. What is a mortal sinner? Such a person is someone who has fully, one-hundred percent understood the truth. The truth was deeply ingrained into his mind, heart and soul. Yet what did he do with that deeply drilled truth? He rejected it with spite and malice in his heart. That is a mortal sinner. I feel like there are two types of mortal sinners: Catholic and non Catholic. A Catholic mortal sinner enters such a state when he does something that is only wrong for Catholics to do. Like skip Mass because you don't feel like going. A non Catholic, who may barely know what mortal sin means, cannot be punished for not going to Mass or even failing at keeping Sunday holy. A well instructed Catholic, however, can be punished. Basically what I am trying to say is that the category of 'mortal sinner' is quite narrow. So not many people can roast on eternal flame for ever and ever in the first place. Also, according to traditional Catholic thought, you need baptism to be saved. So millions upon millions upon millions of otherwise good people are and will burn forevermore because they didn't get baptized. Yet, they didn't explicitly choose to not get baptized. So how can such people burn for ever when they didn't explicitly choose evil over good? Makes NO sense. This is why, if hell is eternal, then hell mustn't be that bad. The majority of Hell simply must be a place of comfort and consolation. Most people or souls in hell must be at peace. No sense of loss for many of these souls. And maybe there is even a 'second' purgatory! Where the souls destined to the resting places of hell have to be purged of faults before entering into that rest. Hell is an ordinary end for man, and beacause God's love amd mercy endures FOR EVER, and because He Himself says that He will not be angry for ever; then the ordinary end must be good. Heaven however is the EXTRAordinary end. The above and beyond. I will not be influenced by the unnecessarily rigid and downright mean opinions of Western Church fathers like St. Augustine. Where everyone must suffer. This holy man lived an extremely sinful lifestyle, so obviously he kind of exaggerated and went overboard when he disciverd the truth. I think thay only that small minority of people who, again, had the truth deeeeeeeep in their hearts and souls and rejected it with explicit and graphic malice towards God and/or neighbor; or those who commit grave evils thay even non-Christians recognize as evil (like murder or rape) can actually burn in some eternal fire. It makes no sense to punish someone so cruelly for doing things they didn't even know were that bad. Like eating meat on Good Friday. Another thing to consider is that Scripture tells is that God's mercy endures FOREVER. In scripture, God punishes to teach a lesson. What lesson is there in eternal fire? There is no room for loving correction and discipline in there....

What do you all think? God is charity.

Charity is patient, is kind: charity envieth not, dealeth not perversely, is not puffed up,
5 Is not ambitious, seeketh not her own, is not provoked to anger, thinketh no evil:
6 Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but rejoiceth with the truth:
7 Beareth all things, believeth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things.

Stubborn · « **Reply #49 on:** March 27, 2017, 04:34:39 AM »

Quote from: Mercyandjustice on March 27, 2017, 03:22:18 AM

The traditional idea of hell still seems totally overkill. Isn't punishment supposed to be to discipline you and eventually correct you? It makes more sense to see hell as that, a temporary punishment to fix you. Punishment for the sake of it isn't right. You don't send your child to timeout for no reason, you do it to teach him a lesson and fix him. God's mercy endures forever, while His anger is limited.

Here is snip from this thread that's worth reading on the subject.

THE OPTIMISTS

The optimists object: “Can it be possible that God punishes a momentary sinful pleasure with an eternity of pain?”

It is not only possible, but it is right and just. The offense given by the sinner to God when he transgresses His holy laws involves infinite malice, since it is an offense to infinite Majesty. Therefore, it deserves an infinite punishment. But since man, being finite, is incapable of undergoing punishment that is infinite in intensity, God punishes him with a chastisement infinite in duration. In acting thus, God acts justly.

Consider my son, that if you go to hell, you will never leave it. There, every pain is suffered and suffered forever.

Even when a hundred years have gone by since you went to hell, or a thousand, hell will be just beginning. After a hundred thousand, a hundred million years, after millions of centuries, hell will still be just beginning.

If an angel were to bring news to the damned that God had decided to free them from hell when as many million centuries had passed as there are drops of water in the ocean, leaves on the trees and grains of sand on the earth - if the damned were to hear that, they would be immensely consoled.

"True", they would say, "many centuries must yet pass, but some day the time of our freedom will come." In reality, however, such vast stretches of time and more than we can possibly imagine, shall pass and find hell still only beginning.

Every soul damned in hell would be willing to make this agreement with God: "Lord, increase my suffering as much as You will; make me stay here in this place of torment as long as You will, but give me hope that someday You will free me."

But no, this hope, this end to suffering, shall never be.

At least if the poor soul of the damned could deceive himself and cheer himself up by thinking, "Who knows? Perhaps some day God will have pity on me and lift me out of this burning inferno."

No, not even that way is open to him, for he will forever see written before him the sentence of his wretched eternity.....

Nadir · « **Reply #50 on:** March 27, 2017, 05:45:33 AM »

Quote from: Mercyandjustice on March 27, 2017, 03:22:18 AM

The traditional idea of hell still seems totally overkill. Isn't punishment supposed to be to discipline you and eventually correct you? It makes more sense to see hell as that, a temporary punishment to fix you. Punishment for the sake of it isn't right. You don't send your child to timeout for no reason, you do it to teach him a lesson and fix him. God's mercy endures forever, while His anger is limited.

At 19 years of age you are still young and arrogant enough to think you know better than God himself. As Matthew said in Reply 4: The problem with the OP's reasoning is that he fails to consider that choosing oneself over God in any serious matter makes one "gravely evil". In other words, any mortal sin.

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Isn't punishment supposed to be to discipline you and eventually correct you? It makes more sense to see hell as that, a temporary punishment to fix you. Punishment for the sake of it isn't right. You don't send your child to timeout for no reason, you do it to teach him a lesson and fix him. God's mercy endures forever, while His anger is limited.

By the time you die, there is no more “fixing” for the one who dies in grave mortal sin; in other words he has renounced any right or desire to live with God in Eternal Life. Hell is eternal “timeout”, if you want to use that word, chosen by the unrepentant sinner himself. It is God’s Mercy and Justice that determines this. He gives the unrepentant sinner the thing he most desires – to escape from God’s presence.

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"God is the savior of ALL men, especially of believers." 1 Timothy 4 10

"In Christ, ALL will be made to live." 1Corinthians 15 22

"The last enemy to be destroyed will be death." 1 Cor 15 26 (How can death be destroyed if hell will be for ever?)

The unrepentant sinners will live forever, just as the just will live forever. They will not live together though. They will be separated by a wide chasm – that between Heaven and Hell.

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There a ton of verses that seem to support Christian universalism. Everywhere I see that Christ is the Saviour of ALL men and the WHOLE WORLD. Not just a few men. And yes, I know that there are frequent references to eternal fire and whatnot; but I've read compelling evidence that shows how the greek word doesn't really mean eternal. It just means an indefinite period of time. Many early Christians believed in Universalism, it seems:

http://www.tentmaker.org/Quotes/churchfathersquotes.htm

A ton of verses, but you have not quoted one! You are fooling yourself. That collection of quotes does not back up your claims. These people are quite devious, devilish; on the page where they ask for your money they say: *We are working on a Bible translation without Hell in it. Funding for this will determine how soon it goes out and the quality of the printing and binding. Please consider this project. It's very important.
In other words, they write their own Bible to suit their heresy.

Quote

Also, a lot of these seem pretty hard to refute:
http://richardwaynegarganta.com/Bible%20Threatenings%20Explained.htm

I'm sorry, but it just seems to make more sense to believe that Christ truly is the Victor over death. The traditional view of salvation just makes God look like a failed Saviour. An accident. It makes the cross seem like a frail and almost pathetic attempt. Like "awww, well at least you tried!" If ony 3 out of 3838298374748383829383838 people will go to heaven everyday...? I don't want to believe God is a failure or that the cross is useless!! But, again, the traditional view makes it seem so. At least in my confused view. Please enlighten me if you can.

You do not need “to believe God is a failure or that the cross is useless!!”
What you need is to study and seek out the Catholic teaching. It is full of HOPE, if only you can come to comprehend it a little. But you will not find hope in any of that putrid muck you are allowing yourself to wallow in. As a woman old enough to be your grandmother I am giving you a little homely advice: Get the hell out of there!

First Epistle Of Saint Paul To The Corinthians Chapter 1 [18 - 25]

For the word of the cross, to them indeed that perish, is foolishness; but to them that are saved, that is, to us, it is the power of God. For it is written: I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and the prudence of the prudent I will reject. Where is the wise? Where is the scribe? Where is the disputer of this world? Hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?

For seeing that in the wisdom of God the world, by wisdom, knew not God, it pleased God, by the foolishness of our preaching, to save them that believe. For both the Jєωs require signs, and the Greeks seek after wisdom: But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jєωs indeed a stumblingblock, and unto the Gentiles foolishness: But unto them that are called, both Jєωs and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God. For the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.

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P.s. As for Apocosatasis being condemned:
https://www.google.com/amp/s/afkimel.wordpress.com/2015/05/18/apocatastasis-the-heresy-that-never-was-2/amp/
??

The links you present are unadulterated garbage – excuse the expression. The last one Eclectic Orthodoxy is a blogger who says of himself: "I'm a blogger, dammit, not a theologian!" It has no authority whatever.

Get yourself into some good Catholic literature, so that you may save your soul. Just because you’re young doesn’t mean you have plenty of time before you too come before the Merciful Judge. Now is the time to set good patterns that will stay with you.

I am praying for you. How is your prayer life, by the way?

Sorry about the formatting. I haven't worked that out yet.

Ladislaus · « **Reply #51 on:** March 27, 2017, 08:17:27 AM »

Quote from: Mercyandjustice on March 27, 2017, 03:22:18 AM

The traditional idea of hell still seems totally overkill. Isn't punishment supposed to be to discipline you and eventually correct you? It makes more sense to see hell as that, a temporary punishment to fix you. Punishment for the sake of it isn't right. You don't send your child to timeout for no reason, you do it to teach him a lesson and fix him. God's mercy endures forever, while His anger is limited.

Indeed, your propositions are heretical.

But, to answer from reason, hell is where people go who will not any longer be corrected. Correction involves a cooperation on the part of the subject. There are those who, in the end, will REFUSE to be corrected. God uses LIFE as His attempt to correct any and all who will be corrected. After that, hell is there choice.

You see, when one is judged, God does NOT say, "Well, I see that you want to go to heaven, but, sorry, you're going to hell instead." Not at all. By that time, it's effectively the SOUL who has made the decision to go to hell. That soul does NOT WANT God, has chosen anything or everything BESIDES God. Having thus chosen throughout his life, he is no longer even capable of saying, "Well, now I change my mind and choose God." He has already made his choice.

Änσnymσus · « **Reply #52 on:** March 27, 2017, 05:38:14 PM »

These bums should receive some sort of door prize for twisting and taking out of context the Church Fathers and scripture quotes.

Änσnymσus · « **Reply #53 on:** March 29, 2017, 12:55:54 AM »

Bizarre, Truth and Mercy, Bizarre. :o

Mercyandjustice · « **Reply #54 on:** March 29, 2017, 06:28:36 PM »

The problem with the traditinal view of hell is that it assumes that everyone is either 100 percent evil or 100 percent good. That is not the case. I don't think many people are 100 percent left or right. Eternal fire is for MORTAL sinners. That is, those who are actually wicked and evil all the way through. That is what Scripture says. How many people are mortal sinners? Like I said above, the category seems somewhat narrow, at least from my limited P.O.V. Only those who willingly reject God and/or commit grave evils that even non Christians know is morally wrong, can possibly suffer for eternity.

Scripture says God is not angry forever, that He wills the salvation of ALL and that His mercy endures forever. Yet the Catholic Church declares EENS. Why then does God allow billions of people to remain ignorant of the 'only' way to happiness after death? Why wouldn't He give every single person a clear and concise path which to follow? Then, the person can choose FAIRLY which path to take. This seems to be a contradiction, And it would have me believe that after death there is a chance for repentance and conversion. At least for those who never heard of the Truth, or never heard enough of it. That's only fair! EENS sometimes seems like a political tool. What better way to control people than to tell them that only you can lead to happiness after death,and that if they leave you than they will burn in eternal fire?? Also, why do so many Bibe translations corrupt the text and translate the words sheol, gehenna, and hades into 'hell?' Definitely seems like an agenda is being pushed here... Finally, I don't necessarily have to disbelieve in an eternal hellfire, but it goes against all common sense to say that most of humanity will end up there. Either God allows people to repent and convert after death and suffering is only temporary; or hell is eternal and is mostly a 'paradise' as Christ told the good thief it was on the Cross. Only a smaller part of hell would be for eternal suffering, for those who were actually at fault and explicitly chose evil and had enough knowledge of the truth and what thay had to do.

P.s. I'm not officially disbelieving in any Catholic dogma...just questioning. No matter how much I doubt I always come crawling back, but this time the doubt has reached record heights. And I'll never become aatheist. I will always believe in the supernatural, paranormal, spirti world and afterlife, God, good and bad spirits, etc..

Another P.S. as you can all see, I'm not posting anonymously anymore. So maybe this thread could be moved somewhere more appropriate?

"God has shut up all in unbelief, that He may have mercy on all" Rom 11:32

"I will draw all things to myself" St. John 12:32

"All mankind shall see the salvation of God" St. Luke 3:6

" for it has pleased God the father that in him all his fullness should dwell and that through him he should reconcile to himself all things whether on Earth or in the heavens making peace through the blood of his cross" Colossians 1:20

Änσnymσus · « **Reply #55 on:** March 29, 2017, 07:19:42 PM »

Let me tell you what St. Thomas Aquinas says regarding the OP.

If a person who is not in grace commits even a venial sin, the penalty is eternal torment, for God must punish sin, even venial sin, since it is actual sin willfully committed.

Now out of the trillions of people who have died, how many do you suppose have died in original sin and at LEAST venial sin?

There you go.

Nadir · « **Reply #56 on:** March 29, 2017, 08:41:51 PM »

The main reason people are going to hell is that they prefer to please themselves, rather than to please God.

So, Mercyandjustice, remember that when you try to make Hell a pleasant place in your mind. You are wanting to please yourself.

It's not a buyer's market, where you get the hell of your choice. No one can design his own eternal punishment. He may chose it but it's not his to design.

We just get what's coming to us, whether Heaven or Hell, but we have no say in the design. No, hell is settled long ago and any of your wishful thinking will not make a skerrick of difference to the outcome.

So buckle down and live the life of a Catholic, and stop toying with these three other options. As the saying goes, Don' t play with fire!
:heretic:

Mercyandjustice · « **Reply #57 on:** March 29, 2017, 09:37:41 PM »

Quote from: Nadir on March 29, 2017, 08:41:51 PM

The main reason people are going to hell is that they prefer to please themselves, rather than to please God.

So, Mercyandjustice, remember that when you try to make Hell a pleasant place in your mind. You are wanting to please yourself.

It's not a buyer's market, where you get the hell of your choice. No one can design his own eternal punishment. He may chose it but it's not his to design.

We just get what's coming to us, whether Heaven or Hell, but we have no say in the design. No, hell is settled long ago and any of your wishful thinking will not make a skerrick of difference to the outcome.

So buckle down and live the life of a Catholic, and stop toying with these three other options. As the saying goes, Don' t play with fire!
:heretic:

Only those (like us) who have been sufficiently preached to can displease God by preferring ourselves over him with malice in our hearts. Only we are liable to punishment. But what of those who don't know? You cannot be punished in such a manner for IGNORANCE. And I don't understand how thinking only a part of hell is reserved for fire is somehow bad or heretical. Christ Himself called hell, according to Catholicism, 'paradise' when He said to the good thief, "Today you will be with me in paradise."
Somebody will burn in eternal flames for doing something he didn't even know was wrong, or at least gravely evil? Really? Totally contradicts scripture and common sense. "God is NOT ANGRY FOREVER" "God wants ALL to be saved." "His mercy endures FOREVER." God is merciful forever until someone 'not in a state of grace' eats just a little too much ice cream after dinner. Then, he commits the SIN of gluttony and is damned to torment FOREVER!! Absolutely ridiculous. Maybe these doctrines made sense hundreds of years ago when those who came up with these doctrines lived in societies where everyone either was under the Church's control or at least knew about what the Church taught. But now we see through a bigger lense. Billions are and were inculpably out of the Church. Inculpably didn't know/ don't know what God wants. There is no justice in punishing someone for doing stuff he didn't know was wrong in the first place. The doctrines and traditions of men can't change God's mercy. What a depressing world view. Imagine going outside for a walk. Pretty much all the faces you see are damned! For supposedly "preferring" themselves over God. One who is ignorant cannot burn in eternal fire. Scripture says that the WICKED will burn. WI-CK-ED. Ayayay this is all just too much -_-. I wish the west was like the east in this aspect. The Eastern Christians have a more vague view of the afterlife. The west is too detailed and excessive in this point. I'll just believe God is merciful and just and wants the best for us. AS SCRIPTURE STATES. And I will believe that He will see what is best for our souls in the next life and that He will give it to us. That's it. Am I a heretic now?

Lighthouse · « **Reply #58 on:** March 29, 2017, 11:01:25 PM »

You're not at a crossroads, you're at a place of misapprehended choices and horrible consequences. All the difficulties you find necessary to throw in your own path to salvation are tattered old and answer subjects that each have a specific answer welded into place by the Church.

You think you have the ability to insert your own answer, and that's all it takes. These things are mostly settled theology. You need to get out of the basement and do some reading. You will get nowhere chasing around in your own head to find truth.

But it's even worse than you may think. One of the 6 sins against the Holy Spirit is "impugning the known truth".

Indeed, I pray that God has mercy on your soul.

Nadir · « **Reply #59 on:** March 30, 2017, 05:16:57 AM »

Quote from: Mercyandjustice on March 29, 2017, 09:37:41 PM

Only those (like us) who have been sufficiently preached to can displease God by preferring ourselves over him with malice in our hearts. ..

Why do you specify "malice". God hates not only "malice"; He also hates indifference, selfishness, gluttony, luxury, and lukewarmness.
Apocalypse (Revelation) 3:16 But because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold, nor hot, I will begin to vomit thee out of my mouth.
You realise, don't you Mercyand justice, that you can go into the eternal fire, not only for those sins committed "with malice in our hearts", but for the things that we have omitted doing:

Matthew 24 [41 - 46] Then he shall say to them also that shall be on his left hand: Depart from me, you cursed, into everlasting fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels. For I was hungry, and you gave me not to eat: I was thirsty, and you gave me not to drink. I was a stranger, and you took me not in: naked, and you covered me not: sick and in prison, and you did not visit me. Then they also shall answer him, saying: Lord, when did we see thee hungry, or thirsty, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister to thee? Then he shall answer them, saying: Amen I say to you, as long as you did it not to one of these least, neither did you do it to me. And these shall go into everlasting punishment: but the just, into life everlasting.

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...I will believe that He will see what is best for our souls in the next life and that He will give it to us. That's it.
Am I a heretic now?

Then why don't you simply trust God, without going against what He and His Holy Church teaches us?

I did not accuse you of being a heretic, although some of the things you are saying here are heretical. You say yourself that you could go any one of four ways and three of those ways will certainly lead you to hell. You seem to be a very confused young man, and the level of your culpability is for God to judge.
I asked before, but you didn't answer me. You just keep going over the same ground and there is no breakthrough.
But I am asking you again now. How is your prayer life? Do you pray the Rosary?
Rejoice, O Virgin Mary, for thou alone have destroyed all heresies. Thou believed the word of the Archangel Gabriel. A virgin still, thou brought forth the God-man; thou bore a Child, O Virgin, and remained a Virgin still. Mother of God, intercede for us.
http://www.catholictradition.org/Mary/mary5.htm

Author Topic: Is it wrong to believe this about hell? (Read 6844 times)

Änσnymσus

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Nadir

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Mercyandjustice

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Mercyandjustice

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Stubborn

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Nadir

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Ladislaus

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Änσnymσus

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Änσnymσus

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Mercyandjustice

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Änσnymσus

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Nadir

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Mercyandjustice

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Lighthouse

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Nadir

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