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Author Topic: Inaudible or No Absolution  (Read 9055 times)

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Änσnymσus

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Re: Inaudible or No Absolution
« Reply #15 on: March 09, 2024, 04:54:33 PM »
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  • What would be a legitimate reason to deny absolution without telling you?  If you were not absolved, you'd need to confess those sins again in your next confession.  As for not receiving penance, that isn't even technically necessary. A lot of Byzantine Rite Catholic priests don't even prescribe a penance.
    Indeed, you would likely receive communion without having had mortal sins absolved.


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    Re: Inaudible or No Absolution
    « Reply #16 on: March 09, 2024, 05:02:49 PM »
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  • Indeed, you would likely receive communion without having had mortal sins absolved.
    If the person is not willing to give up the sin and keeps confessing the same sin but would be so scandalized for not being absolved that he would abandon the faith.  Something off the top of my head.  

    Simple fact that they can withhold absolution and do not have to tell you they are not withholding it.  I know, if this is hard for you to accept you will simply deem it as untrue.  But I'm content with the facts.  Grow some humility and do your own research, if you really want to get to the bottom of it.  Or just reassure yourself that what I say cannot be true if you would rather be comfortable than right.  


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    Re: Inaudible or No Absolution
    « Reply #17 on: March 09, 2024, 05:03:22 PM »
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  • Indeed, you would likely receive communion without having had mortal sins absolved.
    You would not be guilty of the sin if you thought you were absolved.

    Offline CatholicChris

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    Re: Inaudible or No Absolution
    « Reply #18 on: March 09, 2024, 05:14:37 PM »
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  • If the person is not willing to give up the sin and keeps confessing the same sin but would be so scandalized for not being absolved that he would abandon the faith.  Something off the top of my head. 

    Simple fact that they can withhold absolution and do not have to tell you they are not withholding it.  I know, if this is hard for you to accept you will simply deem it as untrue.  But I'm content with the facts.  Grow some humility and do your own research, if you really want to get to the bottom of it.  Or just reassure yourself that what I say cannot be true if you would rather be comfortable than right. 


    I can't find anything online about a priest refusing absolution and not telling you. It also goes against logic. How are you supposed to know what you need to correct if he doesn't tell you? Or you leave wondering if you have been absolved or not.

    Änσnymσus

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    Re: Inaudible or No Absolution
    « Reply #19 on: March 09, 2024, 05:39:40 PM »
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  • I’ve read guide to confessors so I’m aware of the fact that priests can sometimes deny absolution but I’ve never heard of a priest being able to not even tell the penitent they are doing that.  When would that be allowed or right and what’s the source?
    They can withhold the intention for the integrity of the sacrament when one is not ready to give up the sin and could lose the faith if notified, he is not being absolved.   

    It may be in "ROMAN RITUAL + SACRAMENTS AND PROCESSIONS".  I read it from an authentic source which is why it stuck in my head.  Because it was news to me as well until I understood the reasoning behind it.  Sometimes it can be better for the soul in the long run to keep them in ignorance.  

    It comes down trivializing the sacrament for non-repentant sinners by absolving; or scandalizing them out of the faith by telling them you cannot absolve them; the third option is to keep them in their ignorance, so they will not be guilty of further sin by sacrilegious confessions or communions or losing the faith, better to keep hope alive so God can work in them rather than risk putting them in position where they will cut themselves off.  Legitimate cases for it will be rare. 

    If someone finds the contrary in an official work, please share.  I'm always open to learning and being corrected.  Maybe I forget or misunderstood what I read.  


    Änσnymσus

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    Re: Inaudible or No Absolution
    « Reply #20 on: March 09, 2024, 07:14:01 PM »
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  • They can withhold the intention for the integrity of the sacrament when one is not ready to give up the sin and could lose the faith if notified, he is not being absolved. 

    It may be in "ROMAN RITUAL + SACRAMENTS AND PROCESSIONS".  I read it from an authentic source which is why it stuck in my head.  Because it was news to me as well until I understood the reasoning behind it.  Sometimes it can be better for the soul in the long run to keep them in ignorance. 

    It comes down trivializing the sacrament for non-repentant sinners by absolving; or scandalizing them out of the faith by telling them you cannot absolve them; the third option is to keep them in their ignorance, so they will not be guilty of further sin by sacrilegious confessions or communions or losing the faith, better to keep hope alive so God can work in them rather than risk putting them in position where they will cut themselves off.  Legitimate cases for it will be rare.

    If someone finds the contrary in an official work, please share.  I'm always open to learning and being corrected.  Maybe I forget or misunderstood what I read. 
    But ignorance does not excuse sin.

    Offline Yeti

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    Re: Inaudible or No Absolution
    « Reply #21 on: March 09, 2024, 08:05:38 PM »
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  • They can deny absolution without telling you.  And there can be legitimate reasons to do so, I think I read this in the Raccolta or some official work.  If you are willing to accept the fact you could actually be wrong on something you have obviously not studied then do the research, otherwise think as you will.
    .

    I don't believe this. Can you provide a source? Here's a photo of Jone's Moral Theology. He talks about various things related to how the priest might have to postpone absolution if the penitent is obstinate or unrepentant, and how the priest can work on disposing the penitent through persuasion.

    But he says that a properly disposed penitent must be absolved without delay. There is nothing in this passage that suggests a priest can refuse to absolve a penitent without telling him or trying to dispose him, much less that he can send the penitent away thinking he has been absolved when he actually hasn't.

    Offline SimpleMan

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    Re: Inaudible or No Absolution
    « Reply #22 on: March 09, 2024, 08:19:48 PM »
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  • They can withhold the intention for the integrity of the sacrament when one is not ready to give up the sin and could lose the faith if notified, he is not being absolved. 

    It may be in "ROMAN RITUAL + SACRAMENTS AND PROCESSIONS".  I read it from an authentic source which is why it stuck in my head.  Because it was news to me as well until I understood the reasoning behind it.  Sometimes it can be better for the soul in the long run to keep them in ignorance. 

    It comes down trivializing the sacrament for non-repentant sinners by absolving; or scandalizing them out of the faith by telling them you cannot absolve them; the third option is to keep them in their ignorance, so they will not be guilty of further sin by sacrilegious confessions or communions or losing the faith, better to keep hope alive so God can work in them rather than risk putting them in position where they will cut themselves off.  Legitimate cases for it will be rare.

    If someone finds the contrary in an official work, please share.  I'm always open to learning and being corrected.  Maybe I forget or misunderstood what I read. 

    Never heard of such a thing.  Allowing a person to think they are absolved of mortal sin, while leaving them in that sin, would be the height of perfidy.

    I know you think you read this, but I have to think you misunderstood what you read.  I've done likewise myself.


    Online Stubborn

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    Re: Inaudible or No Absolution
    « Reply #23 on: March 10, 2024, 09:59:33 AM »
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  • Thank you for the responses.  They can deny absolution without telling you.  And there can be legitimate reasons to do so, I think I read this in the Raccolta or some official work.  If you are willing to accept the fact you could actually be wrong on something you have obviously not studied then do the research, otherwise think as you will.
    Not sure what you read, but you must have misunderstood what you read. This bothered me enough to ask my priest (SSPX - 34 years) if this is permitted, allowed or is/ was practiced, his answer: NO.
    "But Peter and the apostles answering, said: We ought to obey God, rather than men." - Acts 5:29

    The Highest Principle in the Church: "We are first of all under obedience to God, and only then under obedience to man" - Fr. Hesse

    Online Ladislaus

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    Re: Inaudible or No Absolution
    « Reply #24 on: March 10, 2024, 10:51:08 AM »
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  • Of course they can't deny you absolution without telling you.  Their entire role is to determine whether you should receive absolution, make a judgment about your dispositions and then decide to absolve or not absolve.  They're not there to satisfy their curiosity.  If they were to withhold absolution without telling you, they'd be responsible for the individual approaching Holy Communion while not being in a state of grace.  In addition, individuals are required to confess all unabsolved mortal sin, including past unconfessed sins once they remember them, so these individuals would not be in a position to be able to comply, since they would have mistakenly thought thy had been absolved for them.  This is absurd.

    Online Stubborn

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    Re: Inaudible or No Absolution
    « Reply #25 on: March 10, 2024, 11:47:03 AM »
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  • Of course they can't deny you absolution without telling you.  Their entire role is to determine whether you should receive absolution, make a judgment about your dispositions and then decide to absolve or not absolve.  They're not there to satisfy their curiosity.  If they were to withhold absolution without telling you, they'd be responsible for the individual approaching Holy Communion while not being in a state of grace.  In addition, individuals are required to confess all unabsolved mortal sin, including past unconfessed sins once they remember them, so these individuals would not be in a position to be able to comply, since they would have mistakenly thought thy had been absolved for them.  This is absurd.
    Absolutely, well said. "This is absurd!"
    "But Peter and the apostles answering, said: We ought to obey God, rather than men." - Acts 5:29

    The Highest Principle in the Church: "We are first of all under obedience to God, and only then under obedience to man" - Fr. Hesse