When I first became a traditional Catholic I had assumed that traditional Catholics would be strong and zealous to obey God and keep traditional Catholic teaching. But afters years of interacting with 'trads' either online or in person I am severely disappointed again and again.

Most trads do not follow Church authority, when presented with infallible Catholic doctrines instead of meekly and joyfully submitting to God's command they instead justify disobedience by quoting men, regardless if these men are saints, doctors and theologians. This inordinate order of authority is essentially protestantism. Catholics obey what the Church teaches because the Church is the authority that God left on earth to teach and guide us to heaven. Yet so many trads pick and choose when it comes to things that effect them personally. I don't understand this, why not simply obey the proper ORDER of authority? Why deny Papal definitions? Why squirm out of dogmatic councils and decrees? Why is it the response is always "oh saint xyz said this contrary thing to this Pope/Council so I will obey saint xyz instead of said Pope/Council", this is ridiculous! It's not ju. st laypeople who do this, but the traditional clergy nearly all do this. Whether it be the SSPX with their false obedience to the man they claim is Pope while denying the Church's indefectibility, falsely believing that the new rites of Bishops and Priests are all fine and dandy at the expensive of the faithful, or the sedes with their contradictory denial that V2 is a false council that taught error/heresy while believing and quoting the very docuмent that V2 used to deny EENS and 'Pope' Sanborn with his nonsense authority with una cuм and denial of sacraments for those who believe in baptism and EENS, or with the resistance, I don't even know what's happening since Bishop Williamson died, they seem to be in stasis, just kinda there in limbo doing the same as usual. But each "group" (and others not mentioned) all have fundamental problems. I am not shocked that the faithful exemplify the behaviour of the clergy. Clergymen saying it's ok to vote for an evil man because he is less evil than the (((opposition))), clergymen denying Noah's flood, promoting evolution and other heretical garbage and not being punishment by his superiors. Is it any surprise the crisis in the Church has not improved over the last 60 years and instead has gotten worse?

And there is also the different trad responses to covid and taking the gene therapy...

You have trads who think feminism is fine, that women can dress immodestly, that women can disobey their fathers/husbands and go to college and get into debt!. 'Trads' who think women should wait until they are 25+ to get married because of Jєωιѕн propaganda on "brain development" and "maturity" (women do not mature like men, this is insane), that age gaps are bad and you are a pedo if you like younger women, (she was 17 yr old and 364 days you sick freak!), "oh your much older than her, you have too much power over her" , it's really amazing how retarded some 'trads' are. A man ALWAYS has power over his women, because that's simply the order that God has made. Yes men are more rational, more physically capable, more emotionally stable than women and many other things, this isn't a bad thing. It's simply how God has made us, but some 'trads' do not like this, they think men and women are equal, that women are just as capable as men. It's rubbish, absolute and utter garbage. The more that is given to you the more that is expected from you, God gave men more capabilities so men have more responsibilities as a consequence. So it's not strange that the man needs more time than the women to get married, he has more responsibility, he is the leader yet for some strange reason 'trad' men and women, even clergymen will say regurgitate Jєωιѕн feminist nonsense. A man is the head of the house, a woman it's heart. Bishop Williamson said that a man needs to be a straight pole in the ground so the woman the vine and wrap around him and grow upwards, yet so many don't want to submit to their husbands. So many 'trads' will deny scripture about a woman's duty to her husband, whether it be the marriage debt, obedience and other things. Even when you quote great Saints like St Thomas the trad feminists call you a sleezebag. Imagine if men called women names if they said that husband should love their wives like Christ loved the Church. I've seen on this forum a young lady saying she was felt a lot of pressure to get married, she was around ~22. Well it's not surprising, women do not age like men in terms of fertility, 22 is already late in my opinion so why does this girl and other feel this way? Is there no men up to their standards? Are they unwilling to marry an older man? Did their parents not properly raise them to be ready for marriage by ~18? It doesn't help that these girls do not explain why they feel this way so people can understand their perspective.

There is also boomer trads who think the economy is fine. People who just don't understand how younger men got shafted hard by diversity hiring and other Jєωιѕн garbage. "oh just pull yourself up by the bootstraps and work hard and stop complaining all the time". Men will come online to complain because in reality most men are POWERLESS. They have no real recourse to fix their situations. If a man is in his teens he can still manage if he works hard for 20+ years while living with his parents, just when his is ready for marriage with a house paid off and a career he will be in his 30s and his marriage options will be limited because brainwashing about age gaps mentioned previously. Now most guys are not working hard from their teens, usually it's in their 20s that most men will start to panic and realise that things are going the way they had hoped. For these men (and it's most men) they won't be able to marry (assuming they do things 'properly' from a Catholic courtship perspective) until they are in their late 30s and 40s. Yet most girls in their early to mid 20s don't want to marry these older men, even though it should be considered normal from a Catholic viewpoint.

This long article goes into the bullcrap white men have had to deal with since about 2014, men simply would not get hired because they were white, because they were a man, and because they weren't some ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ abomination.
https://www.compactmag.com/article/the-lost-generation/

Some will say these men should just do a trade job but not every man is cut out for a labor job, it's just how it is, likewise some tradesmen are not cut out for deskjobs.

In becoming a trad I had hoped that trads would be more disciplined that the average secular person and in most things they are. Most trads to not commit the same sins as secular people however there are certain things that disappoint me greatly that I did not expect. I've seen an incredible amount of trads who are overweight. it's really something. You would think mortification and fasting would keep trads slim and healthy, that they would know better since their body is temple for God and it should be keep pure body in body and soul. But no, I see obese, morbidly obese and beyond trads more than I do see slim and healthy trads. Trad wives with feminist style makeup (especially the lipstick urgh) whose daughters also wear this makeup (even 12yr old girls with heavy makeup ), girls who dress immodestly, whether it be tight clothing, clothes that are too short, clothes that are transparent, clothes with a slit on the legs, yet not a word from the pulpit about gluttony and immodesty in dress. Young ladies who mannerism leave much to be desired in terms of femininity, such as talking in a masculine manner, sitting with spread legs, being rude and disrespectful to men, listening to modern music . I have seen teenage girls with tattoos much to the dismay of the father (this indicates that the wife is the problem), teenage girls with nose piercing and lots of earrings, with fake dyed hair and having boyfriends and thinking it's okay to have relationships (I disagree, if it's not courtship it's not okay).

You have trad feminists online who claim to be Catholic/Christian yet they far from God because they deny His natural order between men and women. Some of these women think it's okay to date multiple men at the same time, and if you claim you will only marry a virgin they get very upset.  I've had very pro EENS girls block me because I quoted the Dimonds here and there because apparently I am not extremely enough, must be pro EENS while also denouncing others for their personal faults .


I've had trads get upset at me for quoting Catholic theologians on healthy racism, because I am somehow a bad person because I don't want to race mix and destroy my bloondline and make my children struggle with all the issues that come with being mixed race . Because white people aren't allowed to have their own nations and their governments aren't allowed to put the native whites first over the non-white immigrants, even though the Catholic authority says otherwise.


I know I can only accept the tribulations that God sends me with patience and resignation. But am I so tired of all the hypocrisy from modern trads, they refuse recognise and obey the proper authority and order of authority that God has sent down. They have little charity when you aren't as extreme as them in certain positions. They don't acknowledge the differences between men and women or understand how much effort and time it requires to be a man capable of providing and leading a family, that when a man does achieve these things he must marry someone close to his age who may not even be able to give him children (I know trad couples with no children, I can't say why for certain but I would wager it's because the women wasn't young). I know a young man who married a fat women, and within months of being married she is now much larger than she was before. I know ladies who wear makeup and like secular music. I know priests who say a women shouldn't get married until 25 because of brain development and maturity.

Frankly I am tired and only getting older with each passing day, I do try to work hard and prepare myself so I can one day marry and raise Godly children, yet at every-turn I find opposition from those who are supposed to be my fellow brothers and sisters in Christ. I would have thought they would have some empathy and understanding to the struggle of the young instead it's usually a lecture and some propaganda about not being mature or working hard enough or not being man enough due to 'complaining' about these issues (or I could call it bringing up faults that need to be addressed and fixed). People who just don't seem to care. I don't want to ladies to grow old alone and miserable, I want them to marry young and be happy, even if that requires marrying an older man. I want the clergymen to actually accept Catholic dogma and have proper obedience to God and His Church, not picking and choosing because they don't care enough about the salvation of the faithful and would rather compromise with the enemy in Rome. I want the husbands to have Godly wives who are obedient to them in all things (bar sin), and wives to have loving husbands who don't abuse their authority. If I didn't care it would be much easier, but because I do care it's so much more difficult, seeing the state of things and frankly I do not believe that most trads will save their souls.

I do wish to love my (future) wife as Christ loved the Church, but I also expect obedience. I won't be compromising on Catholic doctrines, or my (basic) standards for women. I won't buckle under boomer delusion or Jєωιѕн propaganda. But realistically what can I do? Most of the women at my chapel are not ladies I would consider marrying, either because they aren't white, or they are fat, or they have tattoos, or took the covid injection, or they are not feminine or because they don't believe in EENS properly. My labor only pays me so much, or rather so little, in comparison to housing. By the time I am ready most of these girls will be too old for me to consider as I want to realistically have children and marrying an old women who may or may not give me children due to her lowered fertility is a risk factor I cannot ignore. The fact is these girls should already be looking for a husband while they are young, not waiting for 25 to hit before they even begin, and certainly not dismissing an older man simply because is old...

Now for those who will say that many people aren't called to the married life, just remember that the family unit is the most basic structure of society. If your sons and daughters cannot get married and have offspring for whatever reason, this is a SERIOUS problem that cannot be ignored. But from what I've seen most do not care, that's why this topic keep coming up over and over again on this forum and other website, because it's a foundational issue.

This post is not simply about women and feminists, not simply about the clergy and laypeople with inordinate obedience to God. It's the overall encompassing denial of reality that seems to be effecting trads. Trads who refuse to acknowledge that being a Catholic means being different from those who live in the world, so why do so many trads say the times have changed and want to deny how things were done in the past when it suits them? I could go on and on but I have already said enough.

When I first became a traditional Catholic I had assumed that traditional Catholics would be strong and zealous to obey God and keep traditional Catholic teaching. But afters years of interacting with 'trads' either online or in person I am severely disappointed again and again. Most trads do not follow Church authority, when presented with infallible Catholic doctrines instead of meekly and joyfully submitting to God's command they instead justify disobedience by quoting men, regardless if these men are saints, doctors and theologians. This inordinate order of authority is essentially protestantism. Catholics obey what the Church teaches because the Church is the authority that God left on earth to teach and guide us to heaven. Yet so many trads pick and choose when it comes to things that effect them personally. I don't understand this, why not simply obey the proper ORDER of authority? Why deny Papal definitions? Why squirm out of dogmatic councils and decrees? Why is it the response is always "oh saint xyz said this contrary thing to this Pope/Council so I will obey saint xyz instead of said Pope/Council", this is ridiculous! It's not ju. st laypeople who do this, but the traditional clergy nearly all do this. Whether it be the SSPX with their false obedience to the man they claim is Pope while denying the Church's indefectibility, falsely believing that the new rites of Bishops and Priests are all fine and dandy at the expensive of the faithful, or the sedes with their contradictory denial that V2 is a false council that taught error/heresy while believing and quoting the very docuмent that V2 used to deny EENS and 'Pope' Sanborn with his nonsense authority with una cuм and denial of sacraments for those who believe in baptism and EENS, or with the resistance, I don't even know what's happening since Bishop Williamson died, they seem to be in stasis, just kinda there in limbo doing the same as usual. But each "group" (and others not mentioned) all have fundamental problems. I am not shocked that the faithful exemplify the behaviour of the clergy. Clergymen saying it's ok to vote for an evil man because he is less evil than the (((opposition))), clergymen denying Noah's flood, promoting evolution and other heretical garbage and not being punishment by his superiors. Is it any surprise the crisis in the Church has not improved over the last 60 years and instead has gotten worse?

And there is also the different trad responses to covid and taking the gene therapy...

You have trads who think feminism is fine, that women can dress immodestly, that women can disobey their fathers/husbands and go to college and get into debt!. 'Trads' who think women should wait until they are 25+ to get married because of Jєωιѕн propaganda on "brain development" and "maturity" (women do not mature like men, this is insane), that age gaps are bad and you are a pedo if you like younger women, (she was 17 yr old and 364 days you sick freak!), "oh your much older than her, you have too much power over her" , it's really amazing how retarded some 'trads' are. A man ALWAYS has power over his women, because that's simply the order that God has made. Yes men are more rational, more physically capable, more emotionally stable than women and many other things, this isn't a bad thing. It's simply how God has made us, but some 'trads' do not like this, they think men and women are equal, that women are just as capable as men. It's rubbish, absolute and utter garbage. The more that is given to you the more that is expected from you, God gave men more capabilities so men have more responsibilities as a consequence. So it's not strange that the man needs more time than the women to get married, he has more responsibility, he is the leader yet for some strange reason 'trad' men and women, even clergymen will say regurgitate Jєωιѕн feminist nonsense. A man is the head of the house, a woman it's heart. Bishop Williamson said that a man needs to be a straight pole in the ground so the woman the vine and wrap around him and grow upwards, yet so many don't want to submit to their husbands. So many 'trads' will deny scripture about a woman's duty to her husband, whether it be the marriage debt, obedience and other things. Even when you quote great Saints like St Thomas the trad feminists call you a sleezebag. Imagine if men called women names if they said that husband should love their wives like Christ loved the Church. I've seen on this forum a young lady saying she was felt a lot of pressure to get married, she was around ~22. Well it's not surprising, women do not age like men in terms of fertility, 22 is already late in my opinion so why does this girl and other feel this way? Is there no men up to their standards? Are they unwilling to marry an older man? Did their parents not properly raise them to be ready for marriage by ~18? It doesn't help that these girls do not explain why they feel this way so people can understand their perspective.

There is also boomer trads who think the economy is fine. People who just don't understand how younger men got shafted hard by diversity hiring and other Jєωιѕн garbage. "oh just pull yourself up by the bootstraps and work hard and stop complaining all the time". Men will come online to complain because in reality most men are POWERLESS. They have no real recourse to fix their situations. If a man is in his teens he can still manage if he works hard for 20+ years while living with his parents, just when his is ready for marriage with a house paid off and a career he will be in his 30s and his marriage options will be limited because brainwashing about age gaps mentioned previously. Now most guys are not working hard from their teens, usually it's in their 20s that most men will start to panic and realise that things are going the way they had hoped. For these men (and it's most men) they won't be able to marry (assuming they do things 'properly' from a Catholic courtship perspective) until they are in their late 30s and 40s. Yet most girls in their early to mid 20s don't want to marry these older men, even though it should be considered normal from a Catholic viewpoint.

This long article goes into the bullcrap white men have had to deal with since about 2014, men simply would not get hired because they were white, because they were a man, and because they weren't some ɧoɱosɛҳųαƖ abomination.
https://www.compactmag.com/article/the-lost-generation/

Some will say these men should just do a trade job but not every man is cut out for a labor job, it's just how it is, likewise some tradesmen are not cut out for deskjobs.

In becoming a trad I had hoped that trads would be more disciplined that the average secular person and in most things they are. Most trads to not commit the same sins as secular people however there are certain things that disappoint me greatly that I did not expect. I've seen an incredible amount of trads who are overweight. it's really something. You would think mortification and fasting would keep trads slim and healthy, that they would know better since their body is temple for God and it should be keep pure body in body and soul. But no, I see obese, morbidly obese and beyond trads more than I do see slim and healthy trads. Trad wives with feminist style makeup (especially the lipstick urgh) whose daughters also wear this makeup (even 12yr old girls with heavy makeup ), girls who dress immodestly, whether it be tight clothing, clothes that are too short, clothes that are transparent, clothes with a slit on the legs, yet not a word from the pulpit about gluttony and immodesty in dress. Young ladies who mannerism leave much to be desired in terms of femininity, such as talking in a masculine manner, sitting with spread legs, being rude and disrespectful to men, listening to modern music . I have seen teenage girls with tattoos much to the dismay of the father (this indicates that the wife is the problem), teenage girls with nose piercing and lots of earrings, with fake dyed hair and having boyfriends and thinking it's okay to have relationships (I disagree, if it's not courtship it's not okay).

You have trad feminists online who claim to be Catholic/Christian yet they far from God because they deny His natural order between men and women. Some of these women think it's okay to date multiple men at the same time, and if you claim you will only marry a virgin they get very upset.  I've had very pro EENS girls block me because I quoted the Dimonds here and there because apparently I am not extremely enough, must be pro EENS while also denouncing others for their personal faults .


I've had trads get upset at me for quoting Catholic theologians on healthy racism, because I am somehow a bad person because I don't want to race mix and destroy my bloondline and make my children struggle with all the issues that come with being mixed race . Because white people aren't allowed to have their own nations and their governments aren't allowed to put the native whites first over the non-white immigrants, even though the Catholic authority says otherwise.


I know I can only accept the tribulations that God sends me with patience and resignation. But am I so tired of all the hypocrisy from modern trads, they refuse recognise and obey the proper authority and order of authority that God has sent down. They have little charity when you aren't as extreme as them in certain positions. They don't acknowledge the differences between men and women or understand how much effort and time it requires to be a man capable of providing and leading a family, that when a man does achieve these things he must marry someone close to his age who may not even be able to give him children (I know trad couples with no children, I can't say why for certain but I would wager it's because the women wasn't young). I know a young man who married a fat women, and within months of being married she is now much larger than she was before. I know ladies who wear makeup and like secular music. I know priests who say a women shouldn't get married until 25 because of brain development and maturity.

Frankly I am tired and only getting older with each passing day, I do try to work hard and prepare myself so I can one day marry and raise Godly children, yet at every-turn I find opposition from those who are supposed to be my fellow brothers and sisters in Christ. I would have thought they would have some empathy and understanding to the struggle of the young instead it's usually a lecture and some propaganda about not being mature or working hard enough or not being man enough due to 'complaining' about these issues (or I could call it bringing up faults that need to be addressed and fixed). People who just don't seem to care. I don't want to ladies to grow old alone and miserable, I want them to marry young and be happy, even if that requires marrying an older man. I want the clergymen to actually accept Catholic dogma and have proper obedience to God and His Church, not picking and choosing because they don't care enough about the salvation of the faithful and would rather compromise with the enemy in Rome. I want the husbands to have Godly wives who are obedient to them in all things (bar sin), and wives to have loving husbands who don't abuse their authority. If I didn't care it would be much easier, but because I do care it's so much more difficult, seeing the state of things and frankly I do not believe that most trads will save their souls.

I do wish to love my (future) wife as Christ loved the Church, but I also expect obedience. I won't be compromising on Catholic doctrines, or my (basic) standards for women. I won't buckle under boomer delusion or Jєωιѕн propaganda. But realistically what can I do? Most of the women at my chapel are not ladies I would consider marrying, either because they aren't white, or they are fat, or they have tattoos, or took the covid injection, or they are not feminine or because they don't believe in EENS properly. My labor only pays me so much, or rather so little, in comparison to housing. By the time I am ready most of these girls will be too old for me to consider as I want to realistically have children and marrying an old women who may or may not give me children due to her lowered fertility is a risk factor I cannot ignore. The fact is these girls should already be looking for a husband while they are young, not waiting for 25 to hit before they even begin, and certainly not dismissing an older man simply because is old...

Now for those who will say that many people aren't called to the married life, just remember that the family unit is the most basic structure of society. If your sons and daughters cannot get married and have offspring for whatever reason, this is a SERIOUS problem that cannot be ignored. But from what I've seen most do not care, that's why this topic keep coming up over and over again on this forum and other website, because it's a foundational issue.

This post is not simply about women and feminists, not simply about the clergy and laypeople with inordinate obedience to God. It's the overall encompassing denial of reality that seems to be effecting trads. Trads who refuse to acknowledge that being a Catholic means being different from those who live in the world, so why do so many trads say the times have changed and want to deny how things were done in the past when it suits them? I could go on and on but I have already said enough.

This is an interesting piece that has gone around lately, I found this excellent post on it today.

https://x.com/IterIntellectus/status/2000846259645514219

the thing about calling DEI 'economic genocide' is that it undersells it

yes, young White men were systematically excluded from careers during their peak marriage years, but that's just first-order effects.

second-order: marriage market collapse. women date across and up. men without careers become invisible to the women who would have married them and disappear. the "eligible bachelor" pool shrinks.

third-order: fertility crisis. fewer marriages, fewer children. but it's worse than just men not marrying or having families. the women who "won" the DEI lottery got careers instead of families, delayed fertility until it was too late. DEI attacked family formation from both sides, excluded men from provider roles AND diverted women from their fertility window. everyone lost.

fourth-order: psychological. young men couldn't even name what was happening to them. the same institutions that excluded them told them they were "privileged", that complaining was proof of weakness. so they internalized failure as personal inadequacy rather than systemic rigging, retreated into depression, video games, porn. the symptoms we then pathologized as "male failure". the system broke them (on purpose) and blamed them for being broken.

fifth-order: institutional trust gone. once you know positions are filled by demographics rather than competence, every credential becomes suspect (if not a priori worthless). is your doctor qualified or a diversity hire? your pilot? your engineer? you can't prove any individual is incompetent, but you can't trust any individual is competent either. medicine skepticism, academic failure, media skepticism, none of this emerged organically. it was manufactured by the DEI hire you can't be sure is qualified to treat you.

sixth-order: reality became unspeakable. noticing any of this was a fireable offense. pointing out the obvious got you called a bigot, deplatformed or fired. pure totalitarian censorship and the problem couldn't even be acknowledged (until now, finally)
men knew they were being cheated but couldn't say it. women sensed something was wrong with the men but couldn't identify it. relationships poisoned by a dynamic neither party could name.

seventh-order: the feedback loop. fewer eligible men means more women competing for a shrinking pool, more women losing the marriage market, more resentment, more "men are trash", more support for DEI, fewer eligible men and the system accelerates itself.

and the worst part is that DEI was just the economic arm. the same people and institutions pushed the complete package
"toxic masculinity" to pathologize male identity
"the future is female" as explicit zero-sum framing delusion
"believe all women" to weaponize trust against men
"men are trash" to normalize open contempt
a coordinated ideological assault on family formation.

and it even had a business model. HR departments exploded (millions of jobs invented to administer the regime). DEI consultants became a multi-billion dollar industry. politicians got voting blocs dependent on racial grievance. established boomers kept their positions while their competition was eliminated.

the architects knew what they were doing
you don't accidentally build a system that specifically targets men during peak marriage years, tells them they deserve it, makes it unspeakable to complain, attacks their identity as toxic, promotes women into career tracks that burn their fertility, then acts confused when society collapses

if you wanted to suppress the fertility of a specific demographic, engineer the breakdown of trust between the sexes, and make it illegal to notice, the playbook would look exactly like this.

DEI should be held responsible for the fertility crisis, the marriage collapse, the epidemic of male depression and ѕυιcιdє, the destruction of institutional trust, the atomization of society, and the manufactured war between men and women

but DEI was the weapon
the people who designed it, funded it, made it mandatory, enforced it through HR, fired anyone who resisted, called all opposition hate and racism, built careers and industries on its maintenance, they knew. and they're the ones who should be remembered as the architects of one of the worst crimes against humanity

Why don't you expanded on how OP can quit wasting their life? They already are Catholic and work, what more do you expect them to do?

Why do you make retarded boomer liberal arguements? "Oh some nigger in africa is poorer than you so you can't be upset for being poor"
Why are you boomer like this?

The previous comment was mine.

Converts to traditional catholicism arrive at their faith because they are thinkers. But thinking is a minority sport, always has been.

We must be like salmon swimming upriver, even amongst our own. To expect that things could be otherwise is an illusion.

 

or the sedes with their contradictory denial that V2 is a false council that taught error/heresy while believing and quoting the very docuмent that V2 used to deny EENS

and 'Pope' Sanborn with his nonsense authority with una cuм and denial of sacraments for those who believe in baptism and EENS